How women turn men into co-dependent losers

[ChristopherColumbus]

CC, what is your objective of the game?

LLTR

I'm not anti-game. I have learnt to incorporate some of its methods, and have become a lot better with woman than I was before. I think in the initial stages of dating women, game helps. But if you want to make progress, you need to move on. It then becomes more of a dance than a game.

I see game as a certain skill-set for a specific situation. People are making too much of it - it's not knowledge, or a way of life, just as tennis isn't. I think people can become a bit extreme with game, where it may warp other areas of their life. Game as knowledge, or a way of life, has turned people into cynics. There is a time and place for everything.

So in sum, all for learning 'game' as a certain skill-set. Not for expanding Game into some 'world-view' that will end up coloring every other sphere of my life.

 

[ubercat]

Mm I think a lot of guys here also aim for alpha knowing their own Weaknesses and the vagaries of life will serve up enough beta to season the broth.
I ve aways taken CCs viewpoint that game is a toolbox you can reach into to sui the nature of the job.

Guys probably bring their egos into their posts. Some of my favorite threads and posters are like good books. As my understanding grows I can re-visit them and find nuances of meaning I previously missed. If you're finding SS one dimensional IMO you're mining the wrong ore veins.

 

[BraddH]

LLTR

I'm not anti-game. I have learnt to incorporate some of its methods, and have become a lot better with woman than I was before. I think in the initial stages of dating women, game helps. But if you want to make progress, you need to move on. It then becomes more of a dance than a game.

I see game as a certain skill-set for a specific situation. People are making too much of it - it's not knowledge, or a way of life, just as tennis isn't. I think people can become a bit extreme with game, where it may warp other areas of their life. Game as knowledge, or a way of life, has turned people into cynics. There is a time and place for everything.

So in sum, all for learning 'game' as a certain skill-set. Not for expanding Game into some 'world-view' that will end up coloring every other sphere of your life.

Love it

 

[ChristopherColumbus]

Are you retarded? If you treat women how you want them to treat you, they'll take advantage of it.

It depends on the particular woman [you can not generalize in the abstract]. If the woman is low quality, selfish, ADH, and a spoilt brat, yes, you better not treat her how she wants to be treated. There's a world of trouble for you. But if the woman is class, you may want to treat her how she would like to be treated [without being a doormat obviously]. She may just fall in love with you and want to have your babies. This classier woman will also most likely know how you like to be treated. Synchronicity.

I think guys have to first learn to game themselves; keep high standards, and don't go running around after low quality that is not worth the effort. But that takes self-control.

 

[pyros]

1 Nowadays women are spoiled, entitled whor-es, in general.
2 Nowadays the majority of men are AFCs one way or another.
3 Nowadays if you act too dominant/DJ many women will discard you because of 1.
4 Nowadays if you act too AFC you will progably get a girl, but she will have all the power in that relationship. (you want to obey a woman? it seems many guys do as long as they get some pvssy).

So...I'd rather be too dominant/DJ and meet many women that discard me until...I find one (or a few) that actually prefer A MAN, so they are obedient, treat you nice, dont give you too much drama, and satisfy you in bed. You have then the power in that relationship, and this makes the woman happier eventhough she may complain or say the opposite.

Anyway, as I said, in 80% of couples the guy does what his gf says, and just in 20% of couples it is the girl the one who follows.

Decades ago all men led their gf/wives/homes, now it is the opposite. How lame/embarrasing/sad.

 

[Bingo-Player]

The fear is insidious. Society is setup to reinforce and superficially reward compliance. But when your eyes r open you see it's fools gold.

I m on holiday with family. Had a moment of weakness wondering why my girlfriend hadn't contacted me for the last couple of days. Then my DJ training kicked in and triggered default LTR action -- do nothing.

Reminded myself that I m the star of my show. Hit the gym and the pool. And started my online business process mgmt course. And then of course g/f broke radio silence next day.

good show of character sir

 

[Serenity]

Good post! Next make a thread called "How men turn themselves into co-dependent losers".

 

[Bingo-Player]

No I get that....but if guys here continually talk about how women are all out to get them in a relationship, then why bother is the question?

women aren't all out to get you into a relationship , but the for the majority that is the end plan

women are master manipulators , they will chip away at you until you bend to their will

you have to screen VERY deeply if you are going to consider a relationship with one

they are also experts in disguising unattractive traits in the opening stages

tread very carefully , once the claws are in deep enough its hard to get out with your mind in one piece

 

[Poon King]

No I get that....but if guys here continually talk about how women are all out to get them in a relationship, then why bother is the question?

And you constantly "whine" about SoSuave and the posters here.. yet you keep coming back lol.

Listen.. my message has never been that "women are horrible" and I have never said women are horrible. MY message is to be strong and not allow yourself to get walked on and manipulated by women. Just like people in general.. women care primarily about what you can do for them. This does not make them "horrible" this makes them smart. If you're dumb enough to put women's priorities above your own.. then you will get exploited like most men.

This is a game and I want men to win. If this was a sport.. we would talk about the other teams strengths and advantages so we can beat them. That is all we are doing. Stop being so sensitive.

 

[Tenacity]

This is a game and I want men to win. If this was a sport.. we would talk about the other teams strengths and advantages so we can beat them. That is all we are doing. Stop being so sensitive.

This game is a hobby to me. That is probably incomprehensible to you.

Okay so this entire thing is a sport to you guys, right? With the grand ol' prize at the end of the road (should you "win") being that you get:

- A piece of ran over, mediocre, pvssy that a wide variety of men from your local Congressman, your church's Pastor, to the convicted/unemployed/jailbird thug has hit raw multiple times...

- Because of the above, your chances of catching an STD goes through the roof

- The more times you fvck these mediocre folks, your chances of unwanted babies go through the roof which fvck up your time, energy, finances, and freedom

- Your chance of having any type of value from the woman is slim to none, most of a woman's value from this market is sex and companionship

Remind me again of exactly what the hell you are playing this "sport" for? I understand that guys who go into a Dojo to learn a martial art, most won't make it to the UFC, but they do it for the ability to defend themselves as well as other benefits that comes from it such as more confidence, better health, and the integrity of rising up the belt ranks.

WTF do you gain from the "sport" of sleeping with a bunch of mediocre, stupid, bytches? Please tell me the internal/external benefits you get other than a piece of ran over pvssy which comes attached to it ALL SORTS of risks that will fvck your life up?

In PK's and others' defense, 95% of the guy who frequent these forums have unfavorable relations with women due to weakness not strength........Instead you get the thirsty guys who will sell their soul for a piece of puzzy.

So again, this "sport" is all about you guys spitting out hundreds of theories, creating cartoon characters, patting each other on the a.ss, etc., all for the GOAL of getting a piece of mediocre pvssy that has more miles on it than a 2001 Chevy Malibu lol?

women aren't all out to get you into a relationship , but the for the majority that is the end plan

This is the CORE of my argument. You guys say most women ain't shyt (I agree) but you sit here and create cartoon theories about how to get them ALL DAMN DAY because you say you love the "sport" of getting women to sleep with you or be receptive to your advances. Okay, that's fine. My question is, considering what I laid out earlier, what the hell is the point of all of this shyt if all you are getting (for the most part) is a piece of mediocre pvssy?

 

[Tenacity]

I have learnt more from this game, and gained more self-improvement, than from learning martial-arts.

Like what?

Off the top of my head: challenge, excitement, thrill-seeking, understanding, fun, self-awareness, self-improvement, sex.

What are you playing for?

Excitement and thrill-seeking? Can you explain how this "game" brings excitement and thrill into your life?

Understanding and self-awareness? Self-improvement? Screwing mediocre bytches brings this how?

What am I playing it for? Well, that's the thing, I'm not playing it. When I became "attractive" in 2010, I began spinning plates NOT because I wanted to spin plates....but because every chick I would meet wouldn't fit my full criteria for the girl I wanted to be in a serious relationship with.

My whole agenda has been to find the chick I want and to be in a serious LTR. It's not to spin plates, pat myself on the back for being some "player", or any other type of stupid shyt like that because there's NO VALUE in that other than the increased RISKS that I laid out. My issue is that I haven't been able to find the girl that fit all my criteria, so I'm settling a little bit....and I'm trying to adjust to "settling".

But in no means is my agenda to see this as a "sport" to see how many stupid, dumb, thug-loving, thug baby making, bytches I can stick my "wee wee" in because it gives me a THRILL up my leg or it brings me into some higher form of "self-consciousness" . Man I've never ate or smashed Tyquesha's pvssy and thought to myself, "Damn, this bytch's pvssy is bringing me to a higher form of self-fulfillment!"

 

[Tenacity]

I don't think so. I'm not validating myself to you.

It's just as I thought. You don't appreciate the value that this game offers. You merely drudge through online-dating websites looking for a unicorn to LTR, and throw your toys out the pram when you don't get it.

It's like talking to a philistine about art - pointless and regrettable.

Typical response from you Manosphere folks when you can't refute points that are made.

 

[mrgoodstuff]

Typical response from you Manosphere folks when you can't refute points that are made.

I agree with your more sane and "safe" LTR desire. However it won't be the prototypical "hot girl", she will likely be a little heavier than you like, and more stable but boring. She will make money, help you out and it will be her desire to please her man. You'll likely find her in a church.

 

[grayclif]

Poon King is one of the best posters on here, but for the life of me.....if women are turning men into co-dependent fag.gots then STOP dating them.

I'm with you on hIm being one of the best posters. I read his stuff with great interest. But I think he's discussing LTR and not dating.

I hate to admit it but this codependant thing happened to me over a 15 year LTR/marrIage. His 3 year time line is almost spot and coincdided perfectly with the birth of my child.

My weakness was weight gain and food despite the fact she was fatter than I was. Then we competed at who could get home last after work. It was a sad state of affairs.

 

[Bingo-Player]

Okay so this entire thing is a sport to you guys, right? With the grand ol' prize at the end of the road (should you "win") being that you get:

- A piece of ran over, mediocre, pvssy that a wide variety of men from your local Congressman, your church's Pastor, to the convicted/unemployed/jailbird thug has hit raw multiple times...

- Because of the above, your chances of catching an STD goes through the roof

- The more times you fvck these mediocre folks, your chances of unwanted babies go through the roof which fvck up your time, energy, finances, and freedom

- Your chance of having any type of value from the woman is slim to none, most of a woman's value from this market is sex and companionship

Remind me again of exactly what the hell you are playing this "sport" for? I understand that guys who go into a Dojo to learn a martial art, most won't make it to the UFC, but they do it for the ability to defend themselves as well as other benefits that comes from it such as more confidence, better health, and the integrity of rising up the belt ranks.

WTF do you gain from the "sport" of sleeping with a bunch of mediocre, stupid, bytches? Please tell me the internal/external benefits you get other than a piece of ran over pvssy which comes attached to it ALL SORTS of risks that will fvck your life up?




So again, this "sport" is all about you guys spitting out hundreds of theories, creating cartoon characters, patting each other on the a.ss, etc., all for the GOAL of getting a piece of mediocre pvssy that has more miles on it than a 2001 Chevy Malibu lol?




This is the CORE of my argument. You guys say most women ain't shyt (I agree) but you sit here and create cartoon theories about how to get them ALL DAMN DAY because you say you love the "sport" of getting women to sleep with you or be receptive to your advances. Okay, that's fine. My question is, considering what I laid out earlier, what the hell is the point of all of this shyt if all you are getting (for the most part) is a piece of mediocre pvssy?

don't know about the others but for me ive far surpassed the requirement for mediocre pu$$

i had enough of that when I was a young fool

now I simply enjoy toying with women whom perhaps deem themselves far out of my league ( as narcissistic as that may sound)

I can bang at will , but when theres no chase its not fun anymore and its also nice to have women chasing you from time to time

 

[guru1000]

So again, this "sport" is all about you guys spitting out hundreds of theories, creating cartoon characters, patting each other on the a.ss, etc., all for the GOAL of getting a piece of mediocre pvssy that has more miles on it than a 2001 Chevy Malibu lol?

Have I ever solicited advice to you or others that was impractical, unreasonable, ineffective, or that which I have not done myself with great success?

The word "mediocrity" has never been in my vocabulary. I am here to provide guidance to equip men with the tools to "win" not just with women, but in life. "Game" is not a game, but rather a level of thinking which permeates your understanding with the true motives of people and thus how to win and influence people to increase the gold in your life.

For example, you come to me and say, "Hey Guru, I need an LTR." I respond back to you with, "Tenacity, if you want a successful LTR, you can't "need" one to fill your glaring holes." You reply, "You see, again, another cartoon character theory."

I never solicit advice that I myself have not done with tremendous success. You mentioned in this thread that you are settling, when already your expectations for a woman were extremely low. Do you have a biological clock? Why in the world are you settling on already undervalued terms? Because the market has grown too difficult for you to navigate, thus forcing your capitulation. That's Tenacity?

This forum is a market. A market of thirsty men. Let's say you have a guy who comes to you for help. You respond with your usual retort "Get your SMV up, looks, finance, personality," right? Great, he does that, but still can't get what he wants, even though he already has low standards and simply wants a girl with less than three kids, not in mountains of debt, at least cute, and pleasant. Mind you, he is still young, financially on the ball, and relatively good-looking, but lacks emotional fortitude. What do you advise him now?

 

[Poon King]

Okay so this entire thing is a sport to you guys, right? With the grand ol' prize at the end of the road (should you "win") being that you get:

- A piece of ran over, mediocre, pvssy that a wide variety of men from your local Congressman, your church's Pastor, to the convicted/unemployed/jailbird thug has hit raw multiple times...

- Because of the above, your chances of catching an STD goes through the roof

- The more times you fvck these mediocre folks, your chances of unwanted babies go through the roof which fvck up your time, energy, finances, and freedom

- Your chance of having any type of value from the woman is slim to none, most of a woman's value from this market is sex and companionship

Remind me again of exactly what the hell you are playing this "sport" for? I understand that guys who go into a Dojo to learn a martial art, most won't make it to the UFC, but they do it for the ability to defend themselves as well as other benefits that comes from it such as more confidence, better health, and the integrity of rising up the belt ranks.

WTF do you gain from the "sport" of sleeping with a bunch of mediocre, stupid, bytches? Please tell me the internal/external benefits you get other than a piece of ran over pvssy which comes attached to it ALL SORTS of risks that will fvck your life up?

So again, this "sport" is all about you guys spitting out hundreds of theories, creating cartoon characters, patting each other on the a.ss, etc., all for the GOAL of getting a piece of mediocre pvssy that has more miles on it than a 2001 Chevy Malibu lol?

This is the CORE of my argument. You guys say most women ain't shyt (I agree) but you sit here and create cartoon theories about how to get them ALL DAMN DAY because you say you love the "sport" of getting women to sleep with you or be receptive to your advances. Okay, that's fine. My question is, considering what I laid out earlier, what the hell is the point of all of this shyt if all you are getting (for the most part) is a piece of mediocre pvssy?

What do you "gain" from being a co-dependent faggot? That is a much more important question.

My message is freedom, personal power and living on your own terms. If that sounds like a bad deal to you, then I don't know what to tell you.

These days you are not providing any useful insight to men on this site. You are just whining, moaning and b!tching. I suggest medication or therapy. Fix your issues.

 

[Tenacity]

"Game" is not a game, but rather a level of thinking which permeates your understanding with the true motives of people and thus how to win and influence people to increase the gold in your life.

I understand this focus when looking at business, economics, martial arts, etc. There's real value and real benefits to be acquired. I'm still waiting for someone to tell me the DIRECT benefits that come from fvcking some bytch who has fvcked every convicted thug in the street, plus your local Congressman, the mailman, the church minister, etc.? Most women are flat out unloyal wh0res today and their pvssy has a significant amount of miles on it. But this is the PRIZE you guys are patting yourself on the chest about?

This forum is a market. A market of thirsty men. Let's say you have a guy who comes to you for help. You respond with your usual retort "Get your SMV up, looks, finance, personality," right? Great, he does that, but still can't get what he wants, even though he already has low standards and simply wants a girl with less than three kids, not in mountains of debt, at least cute, and pleasant. Mind you, he is still young, financially on the ball, and relatively good-looking, but lacks emotional fortitude. What do you advise him now?

Lower his expectations, like I did, because the woman he's looking for is SO LOW IN NUMBER that trying to find her would be a kin to a Talent Agent trying to find the next "Denzel Washington".

What YOU would say Guru, is that his looks, finances, and personality should be raised even higher than they already are....then he will find the girl he wants. Market dynamics and market limitations come into play, the woman I list out (no kids, good finances, educated, good personality, and HOT) is EXTREMELY RARE in this market. Because the criteria is so "basic" I didn't know that my expectations were too high, but I'm coming to realize that they were.

 

[Tenacity]

What do you "gain" from being a co-dependent faggot? That is a much more important question.

You don't gain anything....which is my point. You don't directly gain anything from women being a Beta/AFC/Fag.got and you don't gain anything being an Alpha/DJ/PUA because the vast majority of women have NOTHING to offer other than sex and companionship.

These days you are not providing any useful insight to men on this site. You are just whining, moaning and b!tching. I suggest medication or therapy. Fix your issues.

That's your opinion. I participate here on "The Manosphere" and just like other things I participate in, sometimes there's a need for correction/updates/progression. Why can't we extend into other conversations that are deeper, with more meaning, etc., other than the same shyt about only spin plates.....women are all out to get you....etc.?

Listen, nobody on this forum talks about how piss poor quality this market is than me. But I honestly don't think women are OUT TO GET ME. I just think most women are fvcking STUPID based on social conditioning and cultural factors.

 

[guru1000]

I understand this focus when looking at business, economics, martial arts, etc. There's real value and real benefits to be acquired. I'm still waiting for someone to tell me the DIRECT benefits that come from fvcking some bytch who has fvcked every convicted thug in the street, plus your local Congressman, the mailman, the church minister, etc.? Most women are flat out unloyal wh0res today and their pvssy has a significant amount of miles on it. But this is the PRIZE you guys are patting yourself on the chest about?

So stay away from these kind of women. If your reply were well that's the whole market, then, I will say don't walk into the chicken ranch and complain that all you see are chickens.

Lower his expectations, like I did, because the woman he's looking for is SO LOW IN NUMBER that trying to find her would be a kin to a Talent Agent trying to find the next "Denzel Washington".

What YOU would say Guru, is that his looks, finances, and personality should be raised even higher than they already are....then he will find the girl he wants. Market dynamics and market limitations come into play, the woman I list out (no kids, good finances, educated, good personality, and HOT) is EXTREMELY RARE in this market. Because the criteria is so "basic" I didn't know that my expectations were too high, but I'm coming to realize that they were.

I would say that his problem does not originate from his outer SMV.

Let's revisit this. A guy comes to you for help, and says he wants to find a woman with no kids, good finances, hot, loyal, and kind. You tell him to build his outer SMV and he does. Now he is a solid 7, good finances, and more outgoing, but still can't meet a woman within his parameters, as when they grow to know him, they leave. So you tell him to lower his parameters. And so he does. Now he is looking for a woman with less than three kids, no more than a little debt, a 5, loyal, and somewhat kind. But, he still can't find her, as when they grow to know him, they leave. You tell him to lower his standards again. And so he does. Now he is looking for a woman with less than five kids, less than $50k in debt, a 3, loyal, and somewhat bearable. One day, he finally finds her, and she is a loyal trooper by his side! She meets all of his "needs," except one: He does not want her.