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Older DJ's, is bachelorhood or divorced more appealing?

white sox bill

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Not too long ago, I was "nexted" LOL by a female who I think wanted a father for her kid---I told her I loved kids (which I do as long as I can return them to the parent after having fun) but apparantly she didn't buy it. So my question remains:

I'm 46, unmarried, no kids. Does this mean that I'm the seemingly unattainable (ie challenge) or does it mean that I have "commitophobia" that is, fear of commitments?

Of course, I'm not speaking just for myself, but for all DJ's who are past a certain age.
 

penkitten

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only you know if you have a committment problem or not.
this female that nexted you, assumes that since you are 46 and never been married that you must have a committment problem and wants someone else that she thinks does not have a problem.

some women see this and want to run away, however they should be looking at it differently. heres a guy who didnt settle down to early only to be divorced. divorced men are probally more damaged in ways that a bacholer is not. perhaps you never felt the need to settle down before and perhaps you didnt find the right one yet. sounds like she didnt even look at it like that at all and just used that as an excuse to me.
 

Francisco d'Anconia

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I'll add that in the back of her mind she wonders why aren't you (or never have been) married or have had any kids. She wonders if you are "damaged goods on the clearance rack."

She's probably thinking someone who loves children doesn't have any. Are you now desperate to become a father by any means out of desperation? She's wary because in her mind she believes that's the case. Is it right or logical? Who knows? Someone said in the forum "never step into a woman's reality." ;)
 

penkitten

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Francisco d'Anconia said:
I'll add that in the back of her mind she wonders why aren't you (or never have been) married or have had any kids. She wonders if you are "damaged goods on the clearance rack."

She's probably thinking someone who loves children doesn't have any. Are you now desperate to become a father by any means out of desperation? She's wary because in her mind she believes that's the case. Is it right or logical? Who knows? Someone said in the forum "never step into a woman's reality." ;)
surely if she really contemplated it at all, she would start with 'why doesnt he have kids yet if he loves them so much?" but it would lead to "maybe he hasnt found the right woman to have kids with."
now if he were in this 20s i could see her saying he might be looking for the instant family to make him happy (because some people do this) however since he is twice this age, why would he just want to settle down with an instant family just for the sake of it?
sounds like he is very cautious to me and that he wouldnt just do it to be doing it.
thats why i feel she is using this line as an excuse to not get into a ltr with him. there has to be some other underlying reason , however she is not going to be willing to share this with him.

does that make any sense at all?
 

Rollo Tomassi

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First and foremost, stop using pop-psychology catch phrases like "commitophobia" - this is a female social contrivance with the latent purpose of convincing men they aren't living up to society's (really women's) expectatons through the use of shame. Being 46 and unmarried gives you a depth of experience and overall view that few men ever achieve. That said, being prudent and selective in your life's choices doesn't necessitate or imply fear. So my message to you and all middle age men is to pull your head out of this Dr. Phil, Men are from Mars, Carl Jung nonsense and get down to brass tacks.

Neither are you an unattainable challenge, quite the contrary. You wouldn't have posted this thread if you fit this, yet again, pop-culture fueled archetype. No man is an island, but being cautious about who you hitch your cart to (particularly the cart you've developed over 46 years) doesn't make you unattainable. One of the great crimes perpetrated against men is this premature fear, that's constantly reinforced by society and popular culture, that if a man doesn't marry ASAP he'll be doomed to a life of solitude and lonely dispair in his 60's. Never is the counterpoint explored in any detail that, even if this crap were true, living in misery in a premature marriage and all of the responsiblities and accountabilites associated with it make unattached life-long bachelorhood preferable.

BILL, you're dealing in idealisms, which is really the root of innane social contrivances, and it's time to throw these out of your thinking. They serve a function as being a good blueprint for your own expectations, but taken to the extreme they become escapisms that women, society, pop-culture and commercialism will put to their own uses. The hard fact is that life is visceral and requires persistence of habit. I have what most would describe as an ideal marriage, but I can tell you that the bulk of my time for the last 10 years I've spent with my wife has centered on paying bills, working towards goals, raising our daughter and simple, dirty, life issues. That's not to say we don't get our warm fuzzy feelings or special times together, but this is all that an idealization will promise you - never the day to day stuff. This is exactly why it pays to be prudent and selective. When we're young AFCs we want to get married because we believe the idealization that it'll be great 'meaningfull' sex and good times for a lifetime, and when we're older we're fearful of being alone and old - neither of these should ever be the basis for making a lifelong committment.

At the end of all this, I'd say this woman did you a favor. Now you're free to explore your options at your own leisure. You are the envy of married men, not because you're single and can tap whomever you choose, but because you have the one commodity we don't - you have time of your own, unencumbered with the responsibilities and accountabilities that comes with marriage and 'committment'.
 

Kings_royalty

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First and foremost, stop using pop-psychology catch phrases like "commitophobia" - this is a female social contrivance with the latent purpose of convincing men they aren't living up to society's (really women's) expectatons through the use of shame. Being 46 and unmarried gives you a depth of experience and overall view that few men ever achieve.

Amen Rollo...
 

ElChoclo

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White Sox, looking after someone elses kid is not the definition of commitment. The truth is that at 46 your potential as a marriage prospect is somewhat diminished. Maybe you aren't suited to it. Unfortunately it doesn't make you the unattainable dream man. However it doesn't make you into relationship offal either.

Whilst RT rightly tries to point out the evil of stereotypical beliefs about men, traditional views are based on some truth. The truth, in the past, was that a lot of men didn't live to be 46, and if they did, harsh living conditions meant that they were physical wrecks. Now we are like indoor cats, living to the extremes of our potential life expectancy. Even so, if you had your own kid now, you would be 64 when they reach 18, so at some point it becomes inconvenient, especially if you have to work for a living.
 

WestCoaster

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Rollo, thanks for the post of the year, excellent. Too bad society skewered views don't align with your's.

Also, I'd be wary of the messenger. Who is telling you that you're too old and you should been married earlier? It's usually a divorced woman.

I had a gal one time insinuate I was some kind of loser because I hadn't been married. Her background? She married a guy in her mid-20's because "her friends told her to do so" and she wasn't even in love with him.

Her next hope for love? Some poet who lived out in the wildnerness for a year who came back to town and proclaimed his love for her.

That was the messenger! I believed her message to me about as much as I do the National Inquirer.

Most of these messengers think sit-coms are good drama, have a diet of cheese puffs and pork rinds, believe Celine Dion is good music, and haven't had an orginal throught in 15 years.

Be wary of the messenger.
 
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Latinoman

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I am 38. Don't know if that makes me a "mature DJ".

I don't disagree with Rollo's point. But I will answer this question a little different. And that is from the "customer" (the women we would be in a relationship) point of view. I don't necessary agree with their point of view (which is part of society crap), but the fact remains the same: it is women point of view.

I will touch several points:

1- Most women view a man that is over 35 and never being married as; "he must have something wrong".

2- Most women with children want to have a man that can serve as the child "father figure". Personally, I would ONLY be a father figure to my children. But I understand a woman's desire for a man to be a father figure for her child. And do you know what? If a man decides to get involved and marries a woman with small children (pre-teenager), then that man is accepting that responsibility as "father figure".

3- Many women don't want a man with smaller children or men that have been divorced. However, many women accept the fact that if she is wants a man over 35 that the chances are he is either married, divorced, or a widower.

4- I disagree with the person that said that at 46 your potential as a marriage prospect is somewhat diminished. You see? There are plenty of women in their 30s out there. Sure, I personally don't and won't date women in their 30s. However that is because I'm still under 42. If I was 45 or so, then I would date women in that age group (30s). And if I was in my 50s, I would do the same.

To go back to her issue...that woman was looking for a "dad" for her child.
I'm 46, unmarried, no kids. Does this mean that I'm the seemingly unattainable (ie challenge) or does it mean that I have "commitophobia" that is, fear of commitments?
Only you can answer that question. Personally, if I was you...I wouldn't care what others think.

And to answer your question (title of this thread)...I don't think neither is more appealing. But based on age, one might be more "acceptable" than the other. For example...a man that is 32 and never being married is as acceptable as a man that is 45 and is divorced. That is from women's societal perspective.

Now...the thing in here is...do you TRULY CARE what others think about you? Do you have regrets that you are not divorced and paying child support for x amount of years and possibly alimony? Would be broke be more appealing than having lot of money saved?

And here comes the biggest one: Do you want children? If the answer is "no"...then who cares what women think about YOU? Simply understand what they might be thinking...and play it to your advantage. After all...knowledge is power. ;)
 

WestCoaster

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Great post Latinoman. Here's what's funny ... most women think I'm off because I haven't been married. About 90 percent of my married man friends envy me big time and feel trapped. One of my friends says, "Man, you have no ball and chain wife." He has multiple kids, can't get out. They crave freedom that they don't have. Not saying marriage is bad, actually when done right it's very good, but women view it as the end-all, men do not.

The key is to act confident all the time and don't worry about what others think. Like I said, view the messenger closely. It's either a psychotic woman or an AFC boy telling you that you're weird.

Stupid people telling smart people how to live always cracks me up.
 

squirrels

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Yeah, I think Rollo and Latinoman hit it pretty much on the head. The fact that you're 46 and unmarried means that...well...you're 46 and unmarried. It doesn't somehow ALTER your definition of who you are. You are not your relationships.
 

Vulpine

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(You are not your khakis. You are not your bank account.)

I've been struggling with this idea lately. I frequently get the "why aren't you married?" question and never have really given it much thought. I always feel a bit ackward answering, because fifty buh-zillion social conventions scramble through my head. So, after I started thinking, I came up with an answer that suits me best.

But, there really doesn't seem to be a good answer for that question, and it's a struggle to keep a positive frame either way.

Bachelorhood would imply that you are somehow unfit for marriage, or your value is low.
Divorce would imply the exact same thing!

So it boils down to: do you have good foresight, or do you have good hindsight? I'd rather have good foresight.

But, try conveying that to a woman. They are going to pop that blue pill, wake up in their beds and believe, whatever society wants them to believe.
 

RedPill

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Living a happy, fulfilling, successful life and being married are mutually exclusive. Most people (men and women) are too inside the box to understand this and think true happiness in life can only result from marriage. It's a horsesh!t fallacy whether you're in your 20's, 30's, 40's, or 90's.

On the "why aren't you married?" line of questions, different situations call for different replies. For instance, when I'm sitting with a senior couple who are clients of mine, and the nice grandma lady at my desk asks "so how will you ever find a wife with all the hours you work?", I smile and nod and reply with "Oh, I'm sure that special girl will come along someday."

But if I'm out drinking with work associates, and an AFC married one asks me "hey man when you gettin' married?", I respond with "I'm twenty-fukkin-five! Are you nuts?" It usually shuts them up pretty quick.

I've never had a chick ask me this, but I'd imagine my reply would be along the lines of "because none of you women have been able to rope me in." ;)

Confidence in any response will shut down the fallacy of marriage = happiness, not married = damaged goods. Every time.
 

WestCoaster

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Vulpine and others, I wonder what your response would be if the converation went like this:

AFC married guy: "Why aren't you married?"

Vulpine, or Red Pill or WestCoaster, etc.: "Because I'm pulling different tail left and right and I'm lovin' it!"

... I wonder what the response would be?

* A little off-topic here, but at work today a gal with a few facial piercings and many man-hating buttons on her purse had a t-shirt that read: "Vagina: Are you comfortable with that word?" (On the back was some "V" week thing.)

I work at this university but I was tempted to reply, "Yeah, I'm veeeerrrrrry comfortable with it, especially when I'm in it!"

I would've gotten fired in two seconds ... but the shirt did ask the question. Funny thing is if one answers the question, they're immediately chastised.
 

Vulpine

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WestCoaster said:
AFC married guy: "Why aren't you married?"

Vulpine, or Red Pill or WestCoaster, etc.: "Because I'm pulling different tail left and right and I'm lovin' it!"

... I wonder what the response would be?
I can't wait for a married chump to give me the question.

With a guy asking, it's easy to keep a positive frame. Even though he's asking with the same intent, you don't have to worry about giving a "good" answer. And man, I would give him both barrels.

But you know what? A married AFC wouldn't ask that question. He'd envy my lifestyle because he would know "I'm pulling different tail left and right and lovin' it!" already. It's not like I try to hide the fact that I am a womanizer, philanderer, and/or lovertine.

The response of an AFC married guy would probably be an echo of a woman:
"What about a family? What about kids? What about diseases? You gotta settle down and be responsible - you can't party forever."

I can't? I gotta? Huh? That's news to me!
 

NewMan

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To answer your question, I'd rather be Single than Divorced and paying for Vaginamony and child support. Losing 50% of everything I have is not a fun thing to think about.

as for damaged goods. That's just society putting pressure on us older single guys. I just roll my eyes when I here that.
 

Rollo Tomassi

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Ah, a Leykis 101 student. I've missed the professor since I moved to Florida.
 

LJC

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I don't know why everyone is talking about the female/collective societal mind here, because this is simply an issue as to what WS Bill prefers. If he's ready to settle down, he will know it and will usually give that impression. If he's not ready, then who cares what or how a woman/society thinks? Even if they're right, what does it matter to Bill, or to me and you? You're either happy or you're not with your current status.

It is possible, you know, to want to marry yet be completely happy with being a bachelor. That's the beautiful part of maturity.
 

Bonhomme

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This crap about a man being somehow less of a man because he's over a certain age and never been married is simply projection of the woman's consideration of marriage and breeding as goals in themselves.

In my recent online dating foray, I've seen one profile of a woman who is over 40, single, and never married saying she prefers men over 37 to have been divorced. She also said she's unlikely to respond to anyone who doesn't have a pic, but she didn't have a pic herself. Now doesn't that beat all?

For some people, the quality of the relationship and appropriateness of circumstances precede marriage and children.
 
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