Need help, please....

[mystic03]

Hello to all out there...


Since I've been improving on my technics to stop being an AFC, wich I'm not ( nor a DJ yet), a lot of people that know me and people I ask for guidence tell me that I'n very naive when I deal with women. I know there's something wrong with the way I think but I really don't see the naive part. I have 29 years and it really kills me that a lot of people tells me that and I don't see it. And it's not because what people think, but because it has to be true if a lot of different people tells me this.

Any help will be appreciated.

 

[MindOverMatter]

give us an example to work with. last time someone called you naive about women, what did you say/do before they said it?

 

[mystic03]

Here's a copy of an email I sent to one of the "gurus"

<<
Hello XXXXXX

I need your opinion on something that has happened me twice in less than a year. I don't know if the "new generation" of chicks are thinking the same way.

Anyway I'm a 29 year old that has been as AFC as someone can be. I'm way ahead of being an AFC, but I still kind of lost because I don't get some things.

The problem I've encountered two times this year with two girls of 21-22 years.

The first one: I got to know was trough a friend of mine, she made a lot of eye contact with me I though it was obvious that she liked me. Even my friend told me "wow what was that all about??" refering that this girl was checking me out. After that I got her number and was suppossed to get together to go to a club, when I called her that night she didn't answer her cel phone and I left a message. After that I tried again a couple of days later and she didn't answer it either. I went further and called days later..nothing... then I used another phone number (all this time I was using the same number to call her) and to my susprise she answered, I told her who I was and she remembered, then I asked her out and she told me she would get back to me, I gave her my number....of course she didn't call back.


The second: In college got to know a girl, talked to her couple of times and before a test I came up with the "idea" of a study group to get to know her better, of course I told her about it and she actually showed up and we talked and study, the usual stuff. Tha same morning I asked her cel number because we where talking about continuing the group that afternoon. I called that afternoon but didn't get togheter. After that, the next class day after the exam I was going to be late because of work, I decided to call her to ask to tell the teacher that I was running late, to my susprise she knew who was when I called (of course I used my cel phone, the same as the 1st call). After that my father died and I had to miss a couple of days and after that I was in class but you can imagine that I wasn't in the mood of anything. Anyway after that another test was comming and this time it was her that asked me if we were making the study group, I hadn't planned it at the time but I told her yes. At this point we were getting along very well, allways saying hi and talking a little bit, I could notice eye contact and sometimes she would laugh at my jokes staring at me for a few seconds and a couple of times she would ask me about excersises that the teacher put in the board.... to my opinion, she was acting friendly. When we got toghether to study and everything went fine, at the end she told me " if you need any help with anything, call me".

After that the semester ended. last week I decided to call her and ask her out, when I called the cel phone rang like 5-6 times (telling me that the cel phone wasn't off or out of range) until the aswering machine picked up, and here I think I made a mistake (maybe I've made more than one at this time) and left a message " hello <her name> this is <my name> please call me back when you can, bye". All this with a firm and nice voice. She called me back the next day, telling me that I let a message.... I told her I was calling to get together to see a movie or to eat something. She told me she was going to this new club if I wanted to go we could talk later. I was planing to set a time but right there she told me she had a call in the other line, to call her later. I called that night, but her answering machine picked up, left another message, she didn't called back. Then this week I got my grade for the class we went together and I called her to see how she did, but again the machine picked up, left another message telling that I saw my grade and I wanted to know how she did...

So after that I don't plan to call her again, it si obvious that she doesn't want to talk to me. So here comes the question:

How bad did I do?
Is this normal?

Please guide me...

Thanks XXXXX, for your time.


LB>>



In his reply he mentioned that I'm very naive when it comes to women and since a lot of people has allways said that to me from time to time, now I'm worried.....

 

[stevera004]

Long, boring, generic AFC tales of woe. Read the DJ Bible and learn it. That's it.

"To know the way is good, to live the way is better, to love the way is best"

 

[decades]

my sense is that the girls think you're too passive and unsure of yourself. Act like you are the prize. Its attitude. I agree that you should start with the basics. You seem to generate some good initial interest, however.

 

[mystic03]

Thanks, persistent exaction, for the advice....

 

[PuertoRican_Lover]

I can't see anything that you did 'terribly' wrong in these situations. The thing I would avoid is making too many calls and not setting up a date right away without having to make another phone call or having them get back to you.

An interested woman would usually jump at the chance and set plans right away! Don't leave messages and use *67 to hide your number. Only talk to them and avoid messages in the beginning stages of meeting a girl!!

Try to approach women romantically only and don't try the 'friend' route or 'work study group thing.

Your friends may call you 'naive' because you don't get the hints that show women are disinterested'.' Ask them what they mean by 'naive'!

 

[NewMan]

I'll tell you what the problem is right off of the bat.

Your way to boring, average and just needy.

I can tell by the way you right and your story.

Your calling multiple times, leaving multiple messages - then calling from a different machine so she will not no the number... etc etc.

Thats just needy.

Read the bible.

But specifically you want to get in touch with your male side a little more (a lot more maybe?).... and here are a couple of things.

1) Work on multiple women - that way your not needy - calling and calling the same woman. Get out there work the field.

2) If she shows a lack of interest - move on fast. Don't linger and wonder - and call her 3 more times. If you leave your number and a message and she doesn't call back - her loss. Move on.

3) If she's interested, she will make time.

4) be agressive with women. Meaning don't be passive. Don't be a *****. Assert yourself in a Man not a jerk way.

5) you don't need women. Don't obsess over any of them.

 

[WestCoaster]

The learning process, not the mistake list

One of the favorite titles on the board is: What am I doing wrong?

Actually, it's not that, it's what you're learning. Take it from a guy who has made several mistakes, been shutdown a zillion times, broken up with quite a few times, stood up more than the average schmo, etc. ... I've learned a lot and many times it wasn't always my fault.

But in my AFC days I put the total blame on myself.

It's what you've learned. Call too much? Yeah, I'm reading that. What you've learned is to not call as much. Don't beat yourself up. Take it from a guy who should've worn boxing gloves because I've beaten myself up so much -- don't do it! It's not worth it, it just kills the self-esteem.

Look at life as a learning process not a laundry list of mistakes. Accept yourself for who you are and who you're becoming.

Plus, as I've duely noted, most of these women are clueless as h-ll and have no clue what they want in a guy. They THINK they know, but they do not. Look at their actions, don't listen to their words.

You're not doing things terribly wrong, you just need refinement. Look at every experience as something to build on.

 

[comote]

Ok my take on the situation is similar to some of the others. You are just simply not moving fast enough yet you are moving too strongly when you do.

I am actually starting to be against dating in the traditional sense, at least at first.

Invite girls to do things that you would be doing already is the way I go now. I think you should have invited that second girl to go to the clubs throughout the whole semester rather than wait for the semester to be over.

A great way to develop this approach is to actually have an interesting hobby of some sort, something that girls would like to try, it can be any number of things from riding a motorcycle, say hey I'm going for a ride this sunday you should come along, to rock climbing. Hell I would just ask girls if they wanted to come to parties I was going to. This way if she says no or can't come you still have something fun to do. Another thing is don't give up after the first few times she can't make it. Keep asking her whenever you feel like it, make it a sort of game even. Just as long as you aren't creepy about it she will enjoy it.

I kept asking one girl every couple of weeks for a year, of course I was still pursuing other women at the time, I had to stop because she finally said yes one day and the rest my friend is history.

Another thing I do is I just quit asking for the phone number, if you flirt and show value a woman will eventually make it clear she wants to give you her number. If you are impatient just ask her to meet you for some coffee or something or lunch. This expresses interest yet does not seem threatening. You can progress from there.

 

[mystic03]

PuertoRican_Lover, NewMan, WestCoaster & comote

Thanks for taking the time to write your ideas. Each one of you said things that I'm sure will help me. I now know that I need to be a little bit more patient, I usually get anxious when I don't see results fast, I have to work on that....