Can guys over 30 get a high lay count? My thoughts and experiences.

[SW15]

I almost think that there is a window of opportunity to truly learn game. Let me give you a good example. In a pickup group I am a part of, there is a guy who tried to learn game in his mid-30s. Before that, he was a super blue pilled type of dude. Now the guy has "taken action" and had days where he does 20+ approaches. He has even spent most of his time trying to learn game and lived in Miami and NYC in the meantime. However, despite that, as he pushes his late 30s, he still struggles a lot.

So I wondered why that was and I realized that with game, there are subtle and nuanced things that you can only pick up on when you got in on it early enough. You learn it by being around a lot of other socially calibrated people and these are not PUAs or game coaches.

Things like not taking yourself too seriously, not being overly sensitive, being able to joke about yourself, being able to be easygoing when she throws a sh*ttest in your direction, and all of that are things PUA does not teach. You cannot learn that by just reading about it, you learn it by experience.

For a guy who was social and had friends growing up, it is muscle memory. For some hardcore newb getting into it at 30, it is new.

You look at these red pill guys, they take themselves too seriously and have delicate egos. Both are disasters for dating and meeting women.

Approaching strangers and turning it into something meaningful is an extremely difficult path, even for men with at least adequate social skills. Only swipe apps and sending DMs are more difficult.

It's still easier to form relationships from repeated interactions in high school or college or through mutual friends/acquaintances. Even though fewer people use their social networks now to arrange first dates, those first dates still are more likely to actually turn into relationships.

Neil Strauss was an outlier. When Neil Strauss started hanging around Mystery and other PUAs, he was an early 30s, 5'6" bald man. He lacked at least two of @Mike32ct 's keys to success by lacking height and hair. He was a well known journalist/writer by then so he had some money. Strauss co-wrote Motley Crue's 2001 autobiography "The Dirt" (later a Netflix movie) with the Motley band members before he started hanging out with Mystery and others.

 

[Pierce Manhammer]

I’ve been reading this thread and have a few observations:

Many of those 20-ish year old girls many of you want that are fertile and childless now will be 30-40 something’s that are childless in a few years. More and more women are both having kids.

I have (3) 40 something’s in my lineup that are childless one of them was married but never had kids, the other two never married or had babies. 2 are solid 8.5 1 is a 7. All are solid upper middle class, educated, dress well etc. THEY ARE ALL HEDONISTIC. They are in various stages of epiphany. They all have had fun with recreational pharma and/or alcohol.

This is what happens to those cute fertile 20-something’s all of you guys talk about running through. Guys like me in their 50’s grab them in their late 30’s and 40’s if they’re still fit and attractive and toss them in rotation. All of them lament their life choices and not having had children.

They’re probably all some level of cluster B. They all have issues with compromise to some extent, they all want an LTR but have to settle for what they’re getting from the likes of me.

This is reality.

Just illustrating it from the other side.

 

[CornbreadFed]

This is what happens to those cute fertile 20-something’s all of you guys talk about running through. Guys like me in their 50’s grab them in their late 30’s and 40’s if they’re still fit and attractive and toss them in rotation. All of them lament their life choices and not having had children.

You have to realize kids of divorced/bad parents are going to be more picky about having children than someone from a non divorced household. It’s not that we are just picky and do not want kids, we are just extremely cautious from having to deal with the negative effects of failed parents our whole lives. I am lucky to be in the position I am now and I do not want my future kid to have to deal with the same BS hurdles of failed parents that I had to go through. No offense, but I do not think most lower income people know what it’s like to compete against people of higher income. Your typical career girl probably has this ptsd in her head.

 

[The Duke]

You have to realize kids of divorced/bad parents are going to be more picky about having children than someone from a non divorced household. It’s not that we are just picky and do not want kids, we are just extremely cautious from having to deal with the negative effects of failed parents our whole lives. I am lucky to be in the position I am now and I do not want my future kid to have to deal with the same BS hurdles of failed parents that I had to go through. No offense, but I do not think most lower income people know what it’s like to compete against people of higher income. Your typical career girl probably has this ptsd in her head.

You are a product of your environment. It's hard to escape. Children from divorced parents are more likely to get divorced in adulthood than children from non divorced parents. Same reason poverty is hard to escape.

The hesitation to not be married, to not entertain single moms is an avoidant personality condition to protect yourself.

 

[SW15]

You are a product of your environment. It's hard to escape. Children from divorced parents are more likely to get divorced in adulthood than children from non divorced parents. Same reason poverty is hard to escape.

The hesitation to not be married, to not entertain single moms is an avoidant personality condition to protect yourself.

My parents divorced. They never had a healthy marriage. I haven't married and I'm in my late 30s. There might be something to my environmental experiences.

 

[CornbreadFed]

The hesitation to not be married, to not entertain single moms is an avoidant personality condition to protect yourself.

Why should I consider single moms when I have plenty of viable non-single mom options available? In fact, I would have to go out of my way to even meet one because they all live in the burbs and farther. I have a lay count of 50 and I am pretty satisfied with it.

 

[The Duke]

Why should I consider single moms when I have plenty of viable non-single mom options available? In fact, I would have to go out of my way to even meet one because they all live in the burbs and farther. I have a lay count of 50 and I am pretty satisfied with it.

I get it, makes good sense.

 

[Peaks&Valleys]

Why should I consider single moms when I have plenty of viable non-single mom options available? In fact, I would have to go out of my way to even meet one because they all live in the burbs and farther. I have a lay count of 50 and I am pretty satisfied with it.

Good for you.

 

[CornbreadFed]

Good for you.

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late 30s and 40s I should easily be able to pull a childless girl from 28-35. My current age is irrelevant because I know plenty of guys my age and younger hitting single moms.

 

[SW15]

Why should I consider single moms when I have plenty of viable non-single mom options available? In fact, I would have to go out of my way to even meet one because they all live in the burbs and farther. I have a lay count of 50 and I am pretty satisfied with it.

You shouldn't. Not at age 28. Most men who live in the main city of a big metropolitan area don't need to think about single moms until at least 35. You likely live in an area near many childless women who are unmarried and close to your age.

 

[Pierce Manhammer]

Why should I consider single moms when I have plenty of viable non-single mom options available? In fact, I would have to go out of my way to even meet one because they all live in the burbs and farther. I have a lay count of 50 and I am pretty satisfied with it.

I don’t think anyone is saying you should.

 

[devilkingx2]

My take on single moms is that most of the ones I've ever met or known fall into one of two categories-

1. Working class - usually busy working hard in retail, food service, etc. Or busy spending her free time parenting her kid. Not a lot of time, energy or money for fun. Baby daddy is probably just a relationship that didn't work out for normal reasons.

2. Ghetto - the type to still be partying and hoeing, while her kid is with some babysitter. baby daddy is either a criminal or an obvious player/f-boy.
Due to her obvious irresponsibility expect to bail her out of trouble (often spending your money) if you're a nice guy and not another obvious f-boy/player. She's probably crazy in a relationship too.

Often times they're somewhere in the middle of those two extremes but each one presents its own challenges that would turn off most men who had a choice.

 

[CornbreadFed]

So is there a difference between Milfs and single moms?

 

[SW15]

My take on single moms is that most of the ones I've ever met or known fall into one of two categories-

1. Working class - usually busy working hard in retail, food service, etc. Or busy spending her free time parenting her kid. Not a lot of time, energy or money for fun. Baby daddy is probably just a relationship that didn't work out for normal reasons.

2. Ghetto - the type to still be partying and hoeing, while her kid is with some babysitter. baby daddy is either a criminal or an obvious player/f-boy.
Due to her obvious irresponsibility expect to bail her out of trouble (often spending your money) if you're a nice guy and not another obvious f-boy/player. She's probably crazy in a relationship too.

Often times they're somewhere in the middle of those two extremes but each one presents its own challenges that would turn off most men who had a choice.

What about the white collar office worker single mom? I've met some of them.

 

[devilkingx2]

So is there a difference between Milfs and single moms?

A MILF doesn't have to be single. And arguably doesn't even have to be a mom (what else would you call a hot woman over 30?)

 

[CornbreadFed]

A MILF doesn't have to be single. And arguably doesn't even have to be a mom (what else would you call a hot woman over 30?)

What about a milf with a kid from a marriage or divorce.

 

[SW15]

A MILF doesn't have to be single. And arguably doesn't even have to be a mom (what else would you call a hot woman over 30?)

If a woman is 30+, childless, and attractive, she is not a MILF. She's a hot older woman. A lot of hot older women who aren't mothers are called MILFs though.

A MILF has to be a mother. A hot 23 year old with a 2 year old toddler is a MILF, though it is rare for a 23 year old to be called a MILF.

 

[devilkingx2]

What about the white collar office worker single mom? I've met some of them.

I can only think of one I've met in my life.

Pros & Cons:
+She was really hot
-she hates her ex so much that even as her coworker it was the first thing I learned about her
-she has several kids
- she was most likely very busy because she was one of the best salesmen in the office.
+She had great taste in music

 

[Doctor Europeo]

A MILF doesn't have to be single. And arguably doesn't even have to be a mom (what else would you call a hot woman over 30?)

She is hot and has at least one kid: Milf, regardless of age.

Older than me: Cougar or Invisible.

 

[CornbreadFed]

I can only think of one I've met in my life.

Pros & Cons:
+She was really hot
-she hates her ex so much that even as her coworker it was the first thing I learned about her
-she has several kids
- she was most likely very busy because she was one of the best salesmen in the office.
+She had great taste in music

White collar environments are not immune to trash lol.