Why is our culture is so obsessed with monogamy....

[sstype]

Yet despite this our divorce rate is 50% and majority of relationships end in a break-up?

How is someone who jumps from one monogamous relationship to another, leaving behind a string of broken and bitter hearts, any different or better of a person than a man/woman in a long-time relationship who has an affair behind their partners back?

Or take marriage for example. It was only until recently people started marrying for love and commitment......whereas before marriage was strictly sought to merge family assets and provide for proper transfer of family assets to a man and wife's offspring. If a man decided to have a mistress or concubine, it was generally tolerated, as long as he was properly providing for his wife and kids.

For over 10,000 years this was the norm, and miraculously the world didn't implode yet you would have thought otherwise watching the media hysteria that ensued when Anthony Weiner got caught merely texting his weiner to someone.

And, btw I am not condoning cheating.

I just happen to think that everyone, both sexes, need to think more broadly about love and possession, guilt and shame and the nature of commitment -

When all statistics point to the fact that we CAN'T seem to make the very commitment we hold as the ideal.

Has anyone ever thought for a second that maybe our ideal is wrong?

The definition of love and commitment needs to be questioned. You know what they say about crazy - doing the same thing over and over again the same way and yet, expecting different results. Obviously, we keep getting the same results from every generation - divorce and "broken homes," broken hearts, bitterness and hatred between the sexes, and yet here we are still perpetuating the same lie. We as a society spend so much time obsessing over the "pulse" of our romantic relationships, whether our SOs continually meet our ridiculously high standards, or if not in a desperate quest to find that person.


Have you ever asked yourselves in whose interest it is to keep people soo distracted and "tied up"?

 

[Scars]

It's getting to the point now where society and the media is now promoting promiscuity as well. You still hear about love fairy tails, and all these girls keep saying "I'm just looking for the right guy to treat me right", but take a step back and look at other things. We are starting to be more conscience of it everyday. We have artists like Ke$ha and Lady Gaga teaching girls at a very young age how to seduce men and be "independent". Even chick flicks often revolve around it. The girl ends up cheating on her boyfriend for this suave man who says all the right things at exactly the right times but she is portrayed as innocent because they make the current boyfriend look like an assh0le and was already cheating. Either that or they make these girls look so independent to the point where they don't NEED a man. You got TV shows like Sex And The City, Desperate Housewives, and the worst of them all Jersey Shore. This is the kind of garbage our youth is getting hammered with. Yet, we are still told to be faithful?

For the men. We got some pioneers trying to spread the word. Rap artists like Snoop Dogg etc.. You may not like it, but they often portray woman for how they really are. Disgusting unfaithful *****s. You can't turn a ho into a house wife.

We are ENTERTAINED by unfaithfulness. The drama and reality of it we can relate to. That's why it sells, and everyone sulks in it.

I agree that bringing awareness to the situation is helpful, but at the same time we are also PROMOTING it. Due to the current situations of society now, I know for a fact I will not be having a steady girlfriend or marriage any time soon. It would just simply be stupid. The best we can do now is just adapt to the times and make the most of it. We can chip in our two cents here and there and hope future generations can learn from us, but there won't be a dramatic change over night. Not until all these garbage woman realize that spending all this time d!ck hoping was a waste, and now they're 40 and single, with 2 kids from different daddys and NOBODY wants to date them.

As long as men keep trying to pursue these garbage woman nothing will get better. The problem is there is too many desperate men out there. The price of ***** is going up every day and the quality continues to fall. There's guys who are happy settling with slvts, strippers, potheads, alcoholics, BPD crazies, rape/molestation victims, and these woman realize that they have the ball in their court and don't really have to do anything. We need to educate men more, and woman too that this whole thing is actually destroying both genders. Woman aren't finding their prince charming anymore because all of them are sick of their garbage. Men are becoming just as cold and calloused because they continued to get fvcked over by all these same woman.

The state of things are depressing. And as much as I'd like to find some "true love" with a beautiful woman who is completely faithful I know it's not going to happen. Not in this lifetime, and not in the next. Just take advantage of the situation. We are in a newage sexual revolution, ride it out and take it for what it is. It's so easy to get pvssy now. You just can't expect it to be anything of quality.

-Scars

 

[supremacy]

Scars:+1 for the above article, a very well informed post highlighting grave areas of concern for us all. This society is a real mess at the moment and your post articulates some examples very well.

However, I have to disagree on the following, however pertinent you may think the point is;

Due to the current situations of society now, I know for a fact I will not be having a steady girlfriend or marriage any time soon. It would just simply be stupid

as much as I'd like to find some "true love" with a beautiful woman who is completely faithful I know it's not going to happen. Not in this lifetime, and not in the next.

Now I totally understand where the pessimism stems from and the arguments are indeed totally valid given the circumstances we all face ourselves in today. However to state we can never achieve this "love" we all yearn for and find the perfect partner is irrational to say the least, for a few reasons and more. Lets explore;

Culture:Different cultures have different values and beliefs. Different upbringing, different outlook. There are some women who know what respect is, that is how they have been taught. They know morals and a healthy idea on what a faithful marriage is. I know, because I have friends who are from different cultures and have happy marriages with only the one they marry.

Religion:With different cultures come different religions - or indeed none at all. You won't find many girls in clubs dancing in thongs religious or even knowing where to begin. Nor the guys. The principle remains the same; where are you finding these women? Religion and the principle it promotes is important.

Education:How educated is she. Does she share the same values, principles as you? Does she know about what you are talking about (nodding doesn't count) nor does agreeing for that matter..how sensible is she?

There are many aspects to look at and consider when looking for a potential partner. Just where we are looking, who we are looking at (that hb9?) and our attitude in regards to women and life in general.

Attitude:How can we ever find something we don't believe exists? It doesn't make sense does it? Such negativity with no belief system = certain failure. How many women in the world and you make a judgement that is sosuave all over(negativity towards women) because lets face it - 90% of choofs on here have been shat on and hate women, or just desperate, looking to score with plenty of hot (sluts, bpd, strippers et al.) and to tally up their bird count.

Who are we dating!
Unfortunately many men look at the ass and tits rather than the person.

 

[AAS]

^^ Agreed.

Self fulfilling prophesies are real occurrences. If you believe you will never find love and be monogamous, yet believe in it, you will not get what you seek.

I completely disagree with the thread starter. I believe I have found my life partner, yet we struggle to find other couples who uphold monogamous values that display respect for both partners. Our generation is sex obsessed and female independence is promoted through sex. Beyonce has got to be the most sexist artist out there today, she basically chants sexist degrading remarks in every other song, and promotes promiscuity. AS mentioned before Lady Gaga, Jessie James, the b*tch from *****cat dolls, and what seems to be every X factor/idol/AGT/ winners encourage women to seek empowerment through being attention whoring sluts. Mind you, male rap artists often encourage the equivalent for men. So to state that society (western society I assume) is obsessed with monogamy is absolute bull.

There are still men and women out there who have the cognitive ability to distinguish between moralities and understand the meaning of respect. However, if men claim that they want steady women who hold the values many men claim to have, then they really need to start acting on their beliefs or women will continue to follow men's example. I'm not an ultra conservative, and I'm also not a man-***** and I would not be with a woman from either side of that spectrum.

 

[AAS]

I find that most single people I meet who claim to enjoy screwing random women, admit that they wish they could find a steady girlfriend for whatever reason but don't believe they will find one. Yet I find friends who are in relationships who wish they were single and could enjoy a different set of legs every once in awhile. It just feels like many men can't deal with one without the other-- so want both. Can you have both if your betrothed is human? I doubt it. Would the same men accept it if the woman they actually like or love also spread their legs for someone else? doubt it.

What we have is a society obsessed with indecisiveness and insatiableness.

 

[Wilko]

Well I agree with the OP's sentiment. There is a huge amount of conditioning used to instruct us that monogamy is natural, desirable and just. And yet, whatever the ideal may be, in practice it does not come naturally or easily, people are lousy at it on the whole and I don't think there's any reason to expect that they should be better at it than they are.

Monogamy seems to be about ownership to me. Personally, I don't need to "own" a girl in order to enjoy her company, frankly as long as we're having a blast together once a week I don't care what else she does or who she does it with the rest of the time. Seriously, how does it affect my time with her? It doesn't.

Anyway, long story short, I think it's ok, maybe even preferable, and definitely more realistic to get your needs met through more than one woman. And, there is no reason why you can't share deep intimacy with one or more of them. Bottom line OP, I agree, I think monogamy is overvalued.

 

[sexysuave]

This is true AAS, but it's because everyone "wants what they can't have" and many people think the grass is "greener on the other side". Also, there indeed is a double standard on cheating, and you are right, plenty guys want that special girl but also want something on the side. Would they tolerate their chicks doing the same thing? Absolutely not.

However, this is much more complex than what we can talk about in this thread. Guys cheating and girls cheating is simply NOT the same thing. We as guys all know that we can simply just fvck a girl and not give a damn about her. Hell, we can even HATE the chick, not know the chick at all, whatever, and still fvck her just because she looks hot. For girls it's different, as we all know. If a girl sleeps with a guy, usually there is an emotional connection there. Not so much for us guys.

I think this was known throughout history and many wifes throughout years had suspicions or even knew deep down that their husbands are probably getting some on the side here and there, but they knew that they didn't give a damn about these girls and they are just getting their nut in and will be back home to their family to feed, provide, take care of them. So most of these wifes usually sucked it up and put up with it, and some even accepted it as reality of things. They KNEW that their husbands loved them, and were simply getting a nut in on the side here and there. If a woman did that to the husband though, it was a whole different story. She probably CARED about the other guy, was emotionally connected to him, and probably caused her feeling for her husband to diminish. This was almost never tolerated! It is what it is, and it's totally different.

So yes, there is a double standard that has been there throughout our existance. And whether we like it or not, it does make sense when you think about it. Tell me you can't be TOTALLY IN LOVE with you girl, and screw some random girl that you only have known for 15 minutes, and still be TOTALLY IN LOVE with your girl? We all know that we didn't give a damn about that girl we got a quick nut on and we still LOVE our girl just as much! Well, the same just does not work for girls. It's different. That's why deep down we all sort of support the double standard to a certain extent.

And yes, it is possible to have a happy relationship because YES different cultures and upbringings make a HUGE difference. Don't get me wrong, it is HARD nowadays to find something like this, but it DOES exist out there. I do know people in happy marriages. My parents have been married for 32 years without any issues. I know of people my age also in very happy relationships. I also know of MANY MANY people in ****ty relationships also, so yes, the odds are kinda against you, and there is probably ALWAYS a chance of things turning sour, but thats just the reality of things. You have to definitely WORK AT IT and it is not easy. I think today there are many options for all of us, men and women, so I think a lot of times when the going gets tough, the tough gets going, and one of us simply moves on rather than trying to work through it. It's a lot easier to meet people now than it was even back in early 90's. This all plays a role. And it HELPS us out tremendously when it comes to dating, PUA stuff, DJ stuff, but it sort of backfires on us when it comes to serious relationships, where the access to so many options creates a "why put up with it, just find someone else" mindset.

 

[AAS]

@Sexysuave: I can see where you are coming from with this. I suppose its to each his/her own. I can see the reasons why people (both men and women) cheat, why most guys end up wanting something on the side, and I can see why it might have been tolerated back in the day.

However, if we remove the curtain hiding the context of the past-- men and women were often promised to each other by their parents form a young age, men and women were pushed to get married, and some still are. How can you be expected to truly love someone you were pushed or forced to marry? How much would you actually care about the other person and would you truly enjoy her company? In all likelihood you wouldn't because you can't stand most people after a few days of constant encounters. Back then were the bedroom games satisfying? Probably not. So men, in a very established patriarchal society, were getting satisfaction elsewhere and it probably did not mean anything.

People today have the opportunity to date and court only the women they actually like, and women have more options and can play games too. You can choose to fvck randoms, or look for something more serious. There's choice. There is, for the most part, no defensible reason to have something on the side because now monogamy is a CHOICE.

I do not agree with your generalization that women who have something on the side do it for feelings. I know a handful of women who have one-night stands that mean nothing to them. Many women today are doing it constantly. It is very plausible for your own girlfriend to fvck another guy she meets at a club and never see him again and never think about him again. Would you still be okay with that?

People are very different from each other. While I do not believe that my way is the only correct way of doing things, I do believe others are only speaking about their own limitations when they say its impossible for a man to be monogamous and be happy.

 

[sexysuave]

I do not agree with your generalization that women who have something on the side do it for feelings. I know a handful of women who have one-night stands that mean nothing to them. Many women today are doing it constantly. It is very plausible for your own girlfriend to fvck another guy she meets at a club and never see him again and never think about him again. Would you still be okay with that?

Ha ha, no I would NOT be ok with it, only a wimpy guy would be ok with this, which is actually the reason he got cheated on in the first place (no pun intended). Once again, I'm not saying that cheating is RIGHT and OK, but I'm saying that IT IS different, and usually if a girl cheats on a guy, that guy is fvcked!!! She is VERY LIKELY not happy with her guy. He is probably too weak for her and lets her run all over him and hence she is not feeling that MANLY attraction anymore. If a girl is cheats on a guy, there are (USUALLY) wayyyyy bigger problems than if a guy cheated on a girl. This is proven over and over so much that I would almost call it a fact!

MOST girls have to have some kind of attraction and emotional connection built up in order to have sex with a guy.. unless they are just total sluts that anyone can run through.. Sometimes this can happen in a night.. A lot of PUA stuff out there is built up to create such a strong connection in one night that a girl ends up sleeping with you. I've had my share of one night stands, and whether it was the combination of how much attraction I have built up and how good the sex was, I almost always had an option to do it again. So they always ended up liking me enough. This is a pretty big problem for the other guy if that girl is not single. Now, like I already asked, a lot of guys can screw another girl just to get a nut in, and really don't care two sh*ts about her, and will never even let it affect their relationship with their current girl.


But you are right on everyone having a CHOICE nowadays. I do agree with that. We do HAVE a choice, but I also know a lotttttt of people who want their cake and to eat it too. (once again, not saying that it's right, just is what it is though)

 

[sstype]

SexySuave....agreed on the inherent differences between male and female infidelity

"Women need a reason to cheat, men just need a place"


Wilko....good post...agree 100%

When I hear someone obsessive over "loyalty" and "commitment" in a relationship, it sets off red flags of possible possessive and control-freak attitudes/behaviors.

I think some of you guys are missing the point...

No one goes into a relationship thinking they would cheat, but it happens. Be careful when speaking in absolutes...there's no guarantee that the those that preach fidelity and loyalty today will feel the same 20 years later. What happens if you're wife stops having sex with you. You still love her and the children she's given you...but you need to have your needs met somehow. Hassling her only makes things worse.

Do you stick to your morals and remain celibate till death to your part, hoping you won't eventually resent your wife? Do you breakup your family in order to find your "perfect woman" while reassuring your sense of self-righteousness (Hey at least I didn't cheat!)

Do you have a discreet affair? Yes, its having it both ways....of course the wife will be justifiably upset if you're caught....but does it really make sense at this point to say "Oh, I should have just stayed single and f*cked randoms before I settled down?" You will still have sexual urges regardless of your marital status.

Its not as simple as "Ok...I'm done playing the field.....let me flip my switch to "Monogamous" mode now" Human relationships are way too complex. People change. It's not black-and-white yet we refuse to accept a grey area, and thus, set ourselves up for disappointment and bitterness.

 

[Jaylan]

repetitive thread is repetitive.

Simply put: some folks are monogamous, some aren't. Some sides of the media push relationships, other parts of the media don't.

And people and different media outlets can change their opinion on the matter as they grow and time changes.

 

[Wilko]

repetitive thread is repetitive.

Lol, aren't they all? Makes a nice change from yapping about the presidency or the weather though.

 

[squirrels]

The "ideal" is fine.

People aren't perfect.

 

[sstype]

The "ideal" is fine.

People aren't perfect.

What is idealistic about this pursuit of selfish love?

Eros is known as the selfish love. The name Eros came from the Greek god of lust, beauty, love, and intercourse. That alone should explain to you what eros means. I love you only for what you can bring to me and I do not receive that feeling anymore, my love is gone. Many relationships are built on a Eros love and can not grow into any other form of love.

Shouldn't we strive for agape love instead? We love someone not because they deserve to be loved but because its in our nature to love. Even for those who care nothing for us, even for those who hate us. What a utopia the world would be if we all thought like this instead.