Why bother getting married anymore??

[The Logical Player]

Why do so many guys disagree with me on not having a guuurlfriend that you commit to, yet everyone is pretty much on the same page about not getting married???

having a girlfriend brings all of the same burdens as being married to an american woman, only without the legal issues

 

[piranha45]

the legal issues obviously make all the difference.

 

[Bass-Turd]

this is pointless

the only reasons i've heard for not getting married are as follows

-American women svck. don't ever marry them
-The system will rape you!!! because divorce is almost a given, despite what you might do to stop it
-American women svck. they can't even cook
-why get married? it's stupid, you're a brainwashed pig if you actually wanna get married
-Marriage ruins dreams( despite most successful men being, *gasp* married!!! imagine that)
-i can't fvck other girls anymore
-nothing in it for the man (so..what do women get that is so one sided? most women today work, which means that supporting a family wouldn't be just your responsibility)
-American women suck

did i miss any?

 

[FutureSpartan]

A live-in LTR can come under defacto law (essentially making it a marriage) after a while, depending on where you are. It's usually between 6 months and 2 years. You're right that if you're gonna cohabitate with a chick for the long term, you might as well marry her, for if you're gonna get fvcked in the arse by her & the Divorce Industry down the track, you'll take it from behind with pride of yourself having done the right thing (getting married) and having genuine victimhood to b!tch about on MRA blogs.

I have older people, including my parents with 32 successful years relationship + marriage, telling me either to not get married at all or to delay it as much as possible until they sort the law out.

Good post.

When my own mother tells me not to get married, it really makes me cringe when I read the shaming-tactic rebuttals from OTHER GUYS.

 

[Colossus]

A live-in LTR can come under defacto law (essentially making it a marriage) after a while, depending on where you are. It's usually between 6 months and 2 years.

I mentioned this in my previous post in this thread about not signing a marriage license, which apparently no one read. What you're talking about is common-law marriage, which is currently supported in only 11 states. The rest of states allow you to live with a gf indefinitely without being viewed as a de facto marriage; however there may be other civil laws that come into play after some years, even if you dont have children.

STR8UP-

Nowhere in my posts did I say I want to "sign away my life". Dont misconstrue my bilateral view of the issue as me being some deluded marriage proponent. The ONLY thing I have been trying to counter here is the belief that marriage is ALWAYS a loosing bet, because I dont think it is.

Are the odds of success in men's favor? No.
Is it likely your woman will change after marriage? Yes.
If it does end in divorce is likely you will get bent over? Yes.

These reasons alone are cause for a guy to determine the risk is not worth the potential reward, and that's perfectly acceptable.

BUT--what's happening here is guys tend to demonize marriage as an entity instead of being critical of the circumstances and motivations surrounding it, and THAT is irrational. Instead of looking at all these negative outcomes and assigning the blame to marriage itself, assign it to the idiots who ARE getting married with some false presumption of the differential outcomes; OR who dont take the considerable time to qualify their future wife and learn WHERE the legal pitfalls stem from.

Which is why I said if you do get married, it would be wise NOT to sign a marriage license. Go back and read the post.

 

[STR8UP]

Good post.

When my own mother tells me not to get married, it really makes me cringe when I read the shaming-tactic rebuttals from OTHER GUYS.

No doubt.

This brings to mind those infamous shaming words women use on men-

"Why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free?"

How one sided, hypocritical, and SEXIST can you get?

Women have been calling men out for being "sexist" for a long time now, yet a double standard exists that does not allow men to call women out for being the hypocritical fukks that they are when it comes to stuff like this.

Think about these words for a minute.

Essentially what a woman is saying is that she expects you to "buy the cow" (marry her....fitting term) because if you DON"T then she is "giving the milk away for free".

Lets examine the "giving away the milk for free" thing for a minute.

Here, not only is a woman ADMITTING to something that most vehemently deny (sex is an economic exchange where a woman gives up her pu$$y for some other form of benefit), but it is also implying that you as a man aren't bringing anything to the table unless you commit to marriage.

Pretty insulting, if you ask me.

I don't know about anyone else, but I have lived with a few different women, and I can tell you right now that most of the time you split the bills, split the chores, etc. If anything the man usually pays more than his share.

Even if you aren't living together, it's usually the man who ends up paying more than his share, if it isn't 50/50.

So whats this "getting free milk" business? Free would imply that there was some form of inequity between the exchange, that the woman wasn't getting value for what she is putting in.

SO what exactly ARE women saying here? They won't come out directly and say it, but what they are implying is that marriage is their "payday" for giving up the pu$$y.

If this is the case I'm proud so have looted the coffers of many a woman in my day.

 

[Colossus]

SO what exactly ARE women saying here? They won't come out directly and say it, but what they are implying is that marriage is their "payday" for giving up the pu$$y.

They love to frame it like her pu$$y, available 24/7, is your "reward" for marrying her. As if you werent already taking that box 24/7 before you got married.

and LOL at "buying the cow"...:crackup:

 

[STR8UP]

BUT--what's happening here is guys tend to demonize marriage as an entity instead of being critical of the circumstances and motivations surrounding it, and THAT is irrational. Instead of looking at all these negative outcomes and assigning the blame to marriage itself, assign it to the idiots who ARE getting married with some false presumption of the differential outcomes; OR who dont take the considerable time to qualify their future wife and learn WHERE the legal pitfalls stem from.

Which is why I said if you do get married, it would be wise NOT to sign a marriage license. Go back and read the post.

Marriage as an entity SHOULD be demonized because today it is nothing more than a one sided contract that favors women.

And even though I will acknowledge that you DO have a point about it making a difference WHO is getting married, I have been around the block enough to see that 1) The number of women who meet even my minimum qualifications are slim 2) I have seen plenty of cases where the man THOUGHT he was with a "good girl" just to learn differently after they married.

The point here though is that you are defending a flawed entity that has no benefit to you. Even if you had a crystal ball and KNEW that your woman would be a perfect little angel, why would you support something that has zero reward?

 

[FutureSpartan]

No doubt.

This brings to mind those infamous shaming words women use on men-

"Why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free?"

How one sided, hypocritical, and SEXIST can you get?

Women have been calling men out for being "sexist" for a long time now, yet a double standard exists that does not allow men to call women out for being the hypocritical fukks that they are when it comes to stuff like this.

Think about these words for a minute.

Essentially what a woman is saying is that she expects you to "buy the cow" (marry her....fitting term) because if you DON"T then she is "giving the milk away for free".

Lets examine the "giving away the milk for free" thing for a minute.

Here, not only is a woman ADMITTING to something that most vehemently deny (sex is an economic exchange where a woman gives up her pu$$y for some other form of benefit), but it is also implying that you as a man aren't bringing anything to the table unless you commit to marriage.

Pretty insulting, if you ask me.

I don't know about anyone else, but I have lived with a few different women, and I can tell you right now that most of the time you split the bills, split the chores, etc. If anything the man usually pays more than his share.

Even if you aren't living together, it's usually the man who ends up paying more than his share, if it isn't 50/50.

So whats this "getting free milk" business? Free would imply that there was some form of inequity between the exchange, that the woman wasn't getting value for what she is putting in.

SO what exactly ARE women saying here? They won't come out directly and say it, but what they are implying is that marriage is their "payday" for giving up the pu$$y.

If this is the case I'm proud so have looted the coffers of many a woman in my day.

This is kind of borrowing from Gunwitch and Mr. Tomassi, but if you want an answer to your question I say the only men that benefit from marriage are beta males.

Now I am saying "beta male" from an evolutionary biological perspective.

In the animal kingdom, we all know the males that are physically attractive and know the mating dance are "alpha males" and tend to get all the females, while the beta males are forced to be providers in hopes of getting the scraps.

I can see the same dynamic with men. Beta males push for the marriage institution because it keeps most women from gravitating towards all the sexually arousing alpha males and forces them to pick a stable long-term partner.

Kind of like "spreading the wealth." Marriage was a democratic institution that ensured most men would have at least 1 mate. Not a bad thing at all because it ensured social stability.

The whole institution worked fine for a while because beta males could count on their women not straying for fear of social reprisal and the stigma attached to divorce.

With the women's rights movement, anti-husband/father legal changes to family law, and a general attitude that makes it okay to cheat and divorce...it seems that mother nature has found a loophole for women to allow them to pursue the men they truly desire without social consequence.

This is a big reason why terrorism is so rampant in the islamic countries. Islamic code permits a man to marry up to four wives, so naturally the women would rather share a successful man than have a loser all to herself. Wala....a bunch of angry single men with no sexual outlet ripe for extremist brainwashing and dreams of 72 virgins.

So if me, an attractive young man, benefits from this current arrangement....like str8up asked, why buy the cow?

 

[ketostix]

My beef with marriage isn't really with the woman or that there are so few marriage-worthy ones. It's the fact that if you marry a woman these days, you're forced to effectively marry a third party - the government / Family Court (and their friendly divorce lawyers who make a living from screwed up marriages) / the law / feminazis who have the same agenda as the divorce lawyers. It's hard enough to deal with a wife, but when you have that third party on her side, it's an impossible fight.

Well I've gotten to this point so far . I think it's page 2 lol. I'm going to spin off this quote to make my point. I blame men just as much or more than women for the state of marriage and for how western women are in general. Marriage got the way it is due to the collaboration of mostly male legislators, judges, lawyers, even cops. Women can be untrustworthy "wh0res" because many men want to fvck every guys' GF or wife, or take her away from him. Many men have little sense of honor or respect for other men. There's been a loss of objective right and wrong in recent years. Then you have the AFC sell outs that will do what ever women want and shame other men. They put the pvssy on the pedistel, and are probably jealous of any other man getting pvssy anyway.

Women really only have the power that men give them. In short, what is really happening is so many men are collaborating with women and even using women as weapon against other men. Sure women have a responsibilty and blame for being corrupted themselves. But women are really just like mischievious children that men need to keep in line.

While I think marriage can expose you to more risks, it can expose you to more rewards, which do get downplayed on this site. The fact is dating is messed up, having a GF is messed up, and marriage is messed up. By not getting married you're not going to escape a societal problem completely. Men are fvcking it up for other men (often intentionally) and for themselves too (mostly unitentional consequences).

 

[piranha45]

somehow those 'big advantages' dont seem very big or very advantageous.

 

[Jitterbug]

I mentioned this in my previous post in this thread about not signing a marriage license, which apparently no one read. What you're talking about is common-law marriage, which is currently supported in only 11 states. The rest of states allow you to live with a gf indefinitely without being viewed as a de facto marriage; however there may be other civil laws that come into play after some years, even if you dont have children.

It won't stay that way (just 11 states) for too long. Other countries in the Anglosphere, the UK, Australia (where I am) and New Zealand have that already. Going by the history of previous changes to marriage law (like no-fault divorce) the whole of America will be subjected to it soon. Your VP, Biden, is the cvnt behind VAWA. I think your administration is preparing the anal lube for every American man before it bends the lot over.

ketosix

You are right. It's also males, not just females that are fvcking it up for all of us. They are the males conquered by females and their "ideals".

 

[Phenomenal One]

Instead of looking at all these negative outcomes and assigning the blame to marriage itself, assign it to the idiots who ARE getting married with some false presumption of the differential outcomes; OR who dont take the considerable time to qualify their future wife and learn WHERE the legal pitfalls stem from.

totally agree

it's crazy that at the age of 20 i know more about those legal pitfalls than probably most guys know when they get married.

a person should really think if they really know the person they're about to marry.
it takes a long time to really know someone and people change.
you have'nt met a delusional person until you meet someone that thinks the person in their lives are EXACTLY the same person they were when they met.
its insanity, doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.

something to look for when thinking of marrying someone (or be in a relationship with) is to see if they're easily influenced by what other people say or do. it'll always be you vs. them and the crowd (their friends & family)


i don't think marriage is bad but i strongly disagree with the divorce presidings.

after a divorce the guy is always linked to the woman. if you've ever been in a bad relationship you'll know the feeling of relief to be out of that situation, to be away from that person. a guy does'nt have that option. he has to pay monthly child support and support the woman. he should support his children but why his EXwife?.

here's a transcript from a chris rock comedy show on this very topic :

Chris Rock: When it's time to get a divorce, women got it made. You go to court, start talkin' that sh!t. "I'm used to this, I'm used to that. I'm accustomed to this." What the f**k is accustomed? Whats that got to do with sh!t? You go to a restaurant, you accustomed to eatin'. You leave, you ain't eatin' no more. They don't owe you a steak. What about what the man's used to? It might not be money, but during the course of a relationship, a man grows accustomed to a few things. I would love to see a man go to court and say, "Your honor, check this out. I'm accustomed to f**kin' her four times a week. Now I feel I should be able to f**ck her at least twice a week. I mean she can have the alimony, but I want some p*ssy payments."

 

[future_strongguy]

Many young people swear, with all their heart, that they will NEVER end up like their parents. However, 20 years later, they end up just like their parents!

Many young guys today swear they will NEVER get married. Yet, 20 years later, they get married (maybe even some of the guys in this thread!)

The question that has been stated over and over in this thread is: "Why the hell are men throwing away their lives and giving their wife a guaranteed ticket to 50% of their stuff?"

The answer is NOT that "the sexist laws are well hidden," because they are not. Men often joke to the friend about to get married. They tell him things like "Have fun having sex with the same woman for all of eternity!" All men know the downside of being married, yet the question remains.

"Why do men fall for the trap despite being aware of it?"

The reason is because these men have little or no souls. They have no dreams. They have no ambition. They just want to make it through the day... to survive. Eventually, they turn to family and children, thinking this will make their life have meaning. Years later they realize this is not the case, and they become fat and bald and eventually wither away into nothingness.

How to not get married: strengthen your soul.

Take the guy who dreams to one day become a professional bodybuilder. His soul will not let him get trapped by marriage. Why? Because marriage and kids come with expenses. You lose time: taking care of the kids, driving them to school, diapers, etc. You lose money: kids are expensive, wives are expensive. You lose your well being: doing stupid activities that women do and men never do.

The guy needs his time, his money, and his well being to follow his dreams. He needs time to sleep, eat, and work out. He needs money for food, gym equipment/memberships, and supplements. He can't be distracted and be forced to watch Oprah with his wife. If his soul is strong enough, it wont allow him to get married.

But if you're soul is not strong enough, you will eventually succumb to marriage.

You can put a dam to a river, but if there is no outlet the water will eventually overflow.

Many hardcore, man-bashing Feminists in today's world eventually get married. Why? Because they poured their soul into a USELESS cause. They realize this and turn to family and marriage, hoping it will give their life meaning.

It is our nature to seek woman companionship, whether it be marriage or girlfriends or random sluts, but you must harness that nature and direct it towards your goals.

Remember, Nature set us up to be average. Average people have little or no soul. Average people get married. Average people get divorced. Don't let Nature take over and instead try to strengthen your soul. You will be able to avoid the plague of marriage.

Ways to strengthen your soul:

1. Better your personality. If you're confident now, try make yourself "super confident." If you're unique now, try make yourself more unique.

2. Be who you are at all times. Even if it goes against popular opinion, be who you are. Remember, you aren't average, so people will always be disagreeing with you.

3. Strengthen your dreams. If you want to be a golfer, don't just strive to be a pro golfer. Strive to be the best golfer EVER. The more ambitious your dreams are, the stronger your soul will be.

Think about it. Does marriage cross your mind if you want to be the greatest golfer in the world? Ben Hogan knew and openly stated he couldn't have kids, because he was spending 8+ hours a day playing golf. He said that it would be either him or the kids, and he also said that his soul wouldn't let him leave golf and that would be selfish toward his kids.

 

[user43770]

I think the real name of the thread should be...

I'm a victim, I was born an American man and I am too stupid, lazy and chicken sh1t to do anything about it!

This is probably the stupidest thread I've seen yet, not to mention its been posted in one form or another once a month. Why are you so afraid of the judicial system anyway? I swear you guys are terrified of your women. If things get THAT bad just leave the country.... take up residence in some other country... its not hard. I've done 5 countries in the last 4 years. Take all your money, throw it into an un-named account and vanish... you can live the good life down here in Mexico on the beach for less than 400 dollars a month. You can live an outstanding life in Brazil, where the women are unbelievable hot for about 700 a month.. why you're even choosing to stay in that country if things have REALLY gotten that bad is a mystery to me.

I also like that everyone here is an expert on foreign women but like 1/100th of you have actually lived outside of the united states... I have news for you! Women who were born in america with slightly foreign facial features are NOT considered foreign women. Women who have lived in the US for over a year are NOT considered foreign women. Foreign women are women who live in FOREIGN COUNTRIES with foreign circumstances... and this whole american feminist regime is completely FOREIGN to them. My gf is appalled at the typical american/canadian who can't cook, clean, or is insulted when she says "How do you plan to take care of your kids?". Now that said.... she garners alot of cold stares and disgusted looks from american born warpigs... I am proud to be with her.

If you want quality, you must go to a country which has the women you want (AND LIVE THERE). I really look at all of you Americans as competing for the best looking trash in the worlds biggest dumpster (THE USA). A lot (not all) foreign women do their fair share of everything... The majority of JAPANESE women you read about in the paper are the rich spoiled mambya chicks. I figured you guys would be smarter than to trust a feminist run media but nooooo. I lived in Japan, I know FROM EXPERIENCE what the hell I'm talking about. So quit complaining, quit eating garbage and go get a jewel from the third world. Yes balls will be required, yes you will have to leave your security blanket at home and yes you will have to stop being a victim but whats the alternative?

Yeah, let me just move to Mexico. Great place to meet women...and live in poverty...and get shot by drug lords. I love how you condone moving to a sh1tty country just to meet women. lol

Tighten up.

 

[STR8UP]

Great post strongguy.

Too many people look at marriage as filling a void (which their might be but marriage generally won't fill it) or finding "the last piece to the puzzle".

I think one of the BIG things that has kept me from ever even considering marrying any of the women I have had the opportunity with is my ambition. For the past 12+ years I have been focused on building businesses. This has taken me through times where I was basically retired all the way through the opposite where I was stuck working 90+ hours per week.

Had I gotten tied down to a woman it would have CERTAINLY slowed my progress. See my signature for an eloquent quote by Redpill. Women don't take well to the PAINS of building wealth....trust me. They want the benefit without the drawbacks. They might be attracted to your ambition, but as soon as you can't make it to dinner three nights in a row because you are tied up with work they become impatient REAL fast.

I think it was Roissy who stated in his blog that marriage is for beta men. Leykis makes a good case for marriage being for poor people (take out the financial aspect and the woman has less incentive to leave and you have less to lose).

I don't want to sound like ALL men who marry are poor or beta.....that certainly isn't the case. But marriage benefits these types of men the most, and has the potential to be detrimental to alphas and guys who are rich.

 

[user43770]

fuzz, I just get sick of your "find a foreign woman and all your problems will be solved" posts.

 

[piranha45]

I just don't know how fuzz has managed to stay here over the years and make so many posts with a group of people he just can't stand; the guy hates us rotten.

 

[martinM.]

This forum is rife with absolutism.

I guarantee you all these guys who slap the label of 'never' on marriage, kids, girlfriends, etc are the ones most likely to fail in such endeavors because they are so stalwart in their absolutist views that when they finally DO meet a woman who they really jive with, they will automatically have to assign her the magical "exception" status to their long-held views and place disproportionate time and emotional energy into the relationship, or in simple terms put her up on a pedestal.

Dealing in absolutes is always dangerous.

But seriously, i think Colussus makes a good point here.

 

[vagrant]

If you are over 30 years of age and you have the feeling that getting married is the worst thing in the world then I can tell you that you have never met a real woman before. Just as there are real men there are also real women. Stop dating little girls.