DonGorgon
Master Don Juan
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WOW deep thread..
Hello Friend,
If this is your first visit to SoSuave, I would advise you to START HERE.
It will be the most efficient use of your time.
And you will learn everything you need to know to become a huge success with women.
Thank you for visiting and have a great day!
The importance of intimacy and it's relationship with trust.
- Thread starter LovelyLady
- Start date
LovelyLady
Senior Don Juan
- Joined
- Jun 7, 2007
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Bump
LovelyLady
Senior Don Juan
- Joined
- Jun 7, 2007
- Messages
- 437
- Reaction score
- 41
I thought I'd share some more of my journaling on intimacy; again Matthew Kelly is referenced here as well.
Tools For Surving Challenges While Building Intimacy
All relationships go through periods of challenge and it is important to prepare for them.
There are basic relationship tending skills/tools needed in order to insure that the relationship continues to serve it's primary purpose even through difficult times.
SHARING OF REAL TIME:
It is challenging to not become overwhelmed with the responsibilities of our daily lives and we often can neglect our partners/primary relationships. It is easy to spread ourselves too thin and have little left to give. With little energy to also receive, we then approach the relationship from a mindset of scarce resources, and subsequently fear and weakness. We must be mindful of how we spend our time.
Life has a momentum and so do our relationships. If the loving of one another is left unattended, the relationship will suffer.
I know within the seduction community, regular date nights are frowned upon as a sign of being too predictable and therefore boring. Genuine love seeks out meaning, not stimulation. To commit to a time and space to be together in an organic, primal, soulful, loving way nonetheless requires real world physical effort and planning.
To build true intimacy a commitment must be made to spend one-on-one time with one's significant other. (When not in a commited, loving relationship - I give the same amount of time on my "date nights" to actively creating opportunity for an intimate, loving partner to enter my life. I value intimacy and therefore I give my time to the people I experience it with - and make available time to creating the real physical and emotional space for it to occur. All of that to say, making a time commitment to creating intimacy is a must, regardless of your current "relationship status")
To commit to disciplining one's self to set aside time to focus on building intimate relationships/intimacy in an existing relationship exhibits our commitment to having true intimacy in our lives.
We have to value time with our partners, and not get in the habit of putting our primary relationship on the back burner for "later". Rather, choose to use the time with our partners to build a strong foundation of intimacy to weather the storms of life that you inevitably will face while together.
We all have the same 24 hours - and what we choose to do with our time reveals our true values. If we truly value intimate, loving relationships - our choices of how - and how much - we spend our time together reveals the truth of our level of commitment to building intimacy and maintaining an intimate, vibrant, and strong relationship.
SHARING SPIRITUAL EXPERIENCES:
Key to the intimate relationship thriving during challenging times is the sharing of our spiritual journeys. Whether it is to pray, meditate, or philosophize our intimate beliefs of the 'nature of man' together - this serves to support the individual journey and intimate self-revelation.
We do not know, really, the deep ways 'god'/life challenges our partners - not really. It is imperative to honor and support one another in the spiritual journey - to intimately share with one another how we
approach and experience the realm of the spiritual.
To support and share the experiences with each other is imperative to genuine intimacy building and it requires time together; communicating, philosophizing, processing your spiritual journeys, reading, praying, and meditating together.
SHARING APPRECIATION:
"Grounded in Gratitude, Nothing to Envy"
When we are striving to enhance our life journeys, it is too easy to become grounded in the negative and feel our relationship as a burden rather than a place of celebration. To release old hurts and express our gratitude for our mate allows our energy to flow freely and releases the tension in our bodies.
An idea of Matthew Kelly's to help ground you in joy in your relationship when you feel you cannot see the beauty of your partner that I think is terrific:
1. Take a notebook with you for a day and write down every time you complain and what about. Include the thoughts/complaints in your mind.
Then answer: What was the purpose of the assignment? What did you learn from the exercise?
Most people answer "To learn how much I complain and how stupid my complaints are".
But listening more closely, the people we complain about the most (either outloud or in our minds) are the people we supposedly love the most. Our complaints and faultfinding poison our relationships.
A favorite Rumi quote of mine I often meditate on when I struggle with this phenomena:
2. Next take a sheet of paper and make three columns and label them:
Spend a day filling out your gratitude list. Read and focus on the list for the whole day. Be sure to read it first thing in the morning, when you eat every meal, and before you sleep.
3. The third day, make a list "I am thankful for.." about your significant other that you are grateful for. And read it many times, daily, for a week as you continue to add to it. A week later, give a copy of the list to your significant other.
This is a profound gift, to voice our appreciation and joy for our partners. To strive to be the best person you can be is sometimes an exhausting endeavor. We all need encouragement. Be that source of encouragement and appreciation for your loved one. Loving is a privilege.
Joy does not come from the having of another - but in the appreciating the person we have in our lives. Without genuine appreciation and gratitude, there is no satisfaction or joy.
"Joy is the fruit of appreciation"
SHARING RESPECT:
Respect is inherently tied to reverence and the ability to clearly see people and things in their true value.
When we become too focused on the demands of our daily lives, we become self-centered, have a false sense of urgency and scarceness of time and internal resources, and lose perspective. Life and our relationships lose their meaning, value, beauty, awe, and reverence.
Respect builds trust. If we do not tend to respect in our relationships - trust suffers.
To nurture respect (and enjoy the fruit of trust) requires giving time to the relationship to share stories, ideas, insights, concerns, experiences; to seek to truly understand the other. To truly open ourselves to the other. To hear their stories: where they've been, where they are in this moment of their lives, and where they dream of being in the future.
To nurture respect also requires taking time in daily silence to think/meditate on the gifts the person brings to us - to quietly embrace the value the person has added to our lives and to appreciate them - to hold them close in our souls and wrap them in a blanket of love. To place the relationship in a mindful, conscious place of loving care.
To hold someone in true esteem and respect/reverence can be a scary spiritual journey - most of us are not trained to do this - but instead are indoctrinated to judge critically, focus on shortcomings, function from a place of fear to "protect" ourselves from harm.
To respect and revere the other means to embrace with reverence the beauty that is the truth of the spirit of the one we love - and to not trap our minds, them, or our relationship with them, in fear, scarcity, or irreverence.
There are times when we all lose sight of what is truly valuable in our lives. When we lose sight/perspective of who and what we value, we lose respect - and when we lose respect, trust suffers.
To see our significant other in the truth of who we know them to be (because we have laid the foundation of time well spent with them) - to value the very best of them, is imperative to building a strong foundation to weather difficult times, together.
Tools For Surving Challenges While Building Intimacy
All relationships go through periods of challenge and it is important to prepare for them.
There are basic relationship tending skills/tools needed in order to insure that the relationship continues to serve it's primary purpose even through difficult times.
SHARING OF REAL TIME:
It is challenging to not become overwhelmed with the responsibilities of our daily lives and we often can neglect our partners/primary relationships. It is easy to spread ourselves too thin and have little left to give. With little energy to also receive, we then approach the relationship from a mindset of scarce resources, and subsequently fear and weakness. We must be mindful of how we spend our time.
Life has a momentum and so do our relationships. If the loving of one another is left unattended, the relationship will suffer.
I know within the seduction community, regular date nights are frowned upon as a sign of being too predictable and therefore boring. Genuine love seeks out meaning, not stimulation. To commit to a time and space to be together in an organic, primal, soulful, loving way nonetheless requires real world physical effort and planning.
To build true intimacy a commitment must be made to spend one-on-one time with one's significant other. (When not in a commited, loving relationship - I give the same amount of time on my "date nights" to actively creating opportunity for an intimate, loving partner to enter my life. I value intimacy and therefore I give my time to the people I experience it with - and make available time to creating the real physical and emotional space for it to occur. All of that to say, making a time commitment to creating intimacy is a must, regardless of your current "relationship status")
To commit to disciplining one's self to set aside time to focus on building intimate relationships/intimacy in an existing relationship exhibits our commitment to having true intimacy in our lives.
We have to value time with our partners, and not get in the habit of putting our primary relationship on the back burner for "later". Rather, choose to use the time with our partners to build a strong foundation of intimacy to weather the storms of life that you inevitably will face while together.
We all have the same 24 hours - and what we choose to do with our time reveals our true values. If we truly value intimate, loving relationships - our choices of how - and how much - we spend our time together reveals the truth of our level of commitment to building intimacy and maintaining an intimate, vibrant, and strong relationship.
SHARING SPIRITUAL EXPERIENCES:
Key to the intimate relationship thriving during challenging times is the sharing of our spiritual journeys. Whether it is to pray, meditate, or philosophize our intimate beliefs of the 'nature of man' together - this serves to support the individual journey and intimate self-revelation.
We do not know, really, the deep ways 'god'/life challenges our partners - not really. It is imperative to honor and support one another in the spiritual journey - to intimately share with one another how we
approach and experience the realm of the spiritual.
To support and share the experiences with each other is imperative to genuine intimacy building and it requires time together; communicating, philosophizing, processing your spiritual journeys, reading, praying, and meditating together.
SHARING APPRECIATION:
"Grounded in Gratitude, Nothing to Envy"
When we are striving to enhance our life journeys, it is too easy to become grounded in the negative and feel our relationship as a burden rather than a place of celebration. To release old hurts and express our gratitude for our mate allows our energy to flow freely and releases the tension in our bodies.
An idea of Matthew Kelly's to help ground you in joy in your relationship when you feel you cannot see the beauty of your partner that I think is terrific:
1. Take a notebook with you for a day and write down every time you complain and what about. Include the thoughts/complaints in your mind.
Then answer: What was the purpose of the assignment? What did you learn from the exercise?
Most people answer "To learn how much I complain and how stupid my complaints are".
But listening more closely, the people we complain about the most (either outloud or in our minds) are the people we supposedly love the most. Our complaints and faultfinding poison our relationships.
A favorite Rumi quote of mine I often meditate on when I struggle with this phenomena:
Gamble everything for love...
Half-heartedness doesn't reach into majesty.
You set out to find God,
but then you keep stopping at mean-spirited roadhouses.
don't wait any longer.
Dive in the ocean,
leave and let the sea be you...
Half-heartedness doesn't reach into majesty.
You set out to find God,
but then you keep stopping at mean-spirited roadhouses.
don't wait any longer.
Dive in the ocean,
leave and let the sea be you...
2. Next take a sheet of paper and make three columns and label them:
- Things
- People
- Other
Spend a day filling out your gratitude list. Read and focus on the list for the whole day. Be sure to read it first thing in the morning, when you eat every meal, and before you sleep.
3. The third day, make a list "I am thankful for.." about your significant other that you are grateful for. And read it many times, daily, for a week as you continue to add to it. A week later, give a copy of the list to your significant other.
This is a profound gift, to voice our appreciation and joy for our partners. To strive to be the best person you can be is sometimes an exhausting endeavor. We all need encouragement. Be that source of encouragement and appreciation for your loved one. Loving is a privilege.
Joy does not come from the having of another - but in the appreciating the person we have in our lives. Without genuine appreciation and gratitude, there is no satisfaction or joy.
"Joy is the fruit of appreciation"
SHARING RESPECT:
Respect is inherently tied to reverence and the ability to clearly see people and things in their true value.
When we become too focused on the demands of our daily lives, we become self-centered, have a false sense of urgency and scarceness of time and internal resources, and lose perspective. Life and our relationships lose their meaning, value, beauty, awe, and reverence.
Respect builds trust. If we do not tend to respect in our relationships - trust suffers.
To nurture respect (and enjoy the fruit of trust) requires giving time to the relationship to share stories, ideas, insights, concerns, experiences; to seek to truly understand the other. To truly open ourselves to the other. To hear their stories: where they've been, where they are in this moment of their lives, and where they dream of being in the future.
To nurture respect also requires taking time in daily silence to think/meditate on the gifts the person brings to us - to quietly embrace the value the person has added to our lives and to appreciate them - to hold them close in our souls and wrap them in a blanket of love. To place the relationship in a mindful, conscious place of loving care.
To hold someone in true esteem and respect/reverence can be a scary spiritual journey - most of us are not trained to do this - but instead are indoctrinated to judge critically, focus on shortcomings, function from a place of fear to "protect" ourselves from harm.
To respect and revere the other means to embrace with reverence the beauty that is the truth of the spirit of the one we love - and to not trap our minds, them, or our relationship with them, in fear, scarcity, or irreverence.
There are times when we all lose sight of what is truly valuable in our lives. When we lose sight/perspective of who and what we value, we lose respect - and when we lose respect, trust suffers.
To see our significant other in the truth of who we know them to be (because we have laid the foundation of time well spent with them) - to value the very best of them, is imperative to building a strong foundation to weather difficult times, together.
LovelyLady
Senior Don Juan
- Joined
- Jun 7, 2007
- Messages
- 437
- Reaction score
- 41
DISCIPLINE
The very foundation of self-possession and self-awareness requires discipline.
To live a life and have realationships that have the foundational purpose of becoming your highest best selves requires discipline to carry out the tasks to enjoy the manifestations of this life choice.
Physically - discipline of eating, exercise, sleep habits. Emotionally - discipline to give priority to the significant relationships we have. Intellectually - to discipline the mind to read and explore. Spiritually - to discipline oneself to sit in the silence that is spirit.
Often people fear that a life of discipline will encroach on their freedom - that freedom is the ability to do what we want, when we want. This concept of freedom makes one a slave to momentary emotional/physical whims and desires.
However, true freedom is found in the having the strength of character to do what is right, true, noble, and good in celebration of living a life that is in alignment with your true, highest self. So, freedom without discipline is not possible.
Then we ask:
No, but freedom, through discipline in our quest to live true to our highest self, is a necessary component to love - which IS the essence of life.
Love is life's greatest lesson; genuine love is our ultimate spiritual lesson in this classroom of the physical.
(An aside: Often we pursue acquiring of "goods": monetary gain, physical perfection, fame, or intellectual excellence, as our primary purpose. But we discover the emptiness of the accomplishments at meeting that goal. While gratifying, these goals do not bring the true fulfillment that only love brings. That can be a part of this life's lessons, too. To learn what our true purpose is not is valuable as well.)
To love one must be free, because the giving of the self requires that you possess your self to begin with. And self-possession can only come through the discipline and it's byproduct of genuine, mature freedom. If we do not possess our selves, we cannot give our selves; so instead we often focus on outer manifestations of relationships and call that "love".
Discipline is a sign of freedom - and freedom is an imperative to love. A person without discipline is not yet capable of mature love.
Matthew Kelly writes:
In the lives of successful people, we find that discipline is indispensible.
Successful, loving, rewarding relationships do not occur in a vacuum - nor do they occur by chance or some fluke miracle.
You have to want it for your life. Your partner has to want it to. It has to be a priority for BOTH of you. There must be an agreed upon plan (which I will share about later when I have more time) and it must be addressed every day with commitment of discipline. Without discipline, there can be no love and genuine intimacy.
****************
The very foundation of self-possession and self-awareness requires discipline.
To live a life and have realationships that have the foundational purpose of becoming your highest best selves requires discipline to carry out the tasks to enjoy the manifestations of this life choice.
Physically - discipline of eating, exercise, sleep habits. Emotionally - discipline to give priority to the significant relationships we have. Intellectually - to discipline the mind to read and explore. Spiritually - to discipline oneself to sit in the silence that is spirit.
Often people fear that a life of discipline will encroach on their freedom - that freedom is the ability to do what we want, when we want. This concept of freedom makes one a slave to momentary emotional/physical whims and desires.
However, true freedom is found in the having the strength of character to do what is right, true, noble, and good in celebration of living a life that is in alignment with your true, highest self. So, freedom without discipline is not possible.
Then we ask:
Is Freedom Through Discipline the highest calling/ultimate essence of life then?
No, but freedom, through discipline in our quest to live true to our highest self, is a necessary component to love - which IS the essence of life.
Love is life's greatest lesson; genuine love is our ultimate spiritual lesson in this classroom of the physical.
(An aside: Often we pursue acquiring of "goods": monetary gain, physical perfection, fame, or intellectual excellence, as our primary purpose. But we discover the emptiness of the accomplishments at meeting that goal. While gratifying, these goals do not bring the true fulfillment that only love brings. That can be a part of this life's lessons, too. To learn what our true purpose is not is valuable as well.)
To love one must be free, because the giving of the self requires that you possess your self to begin with. And self-possession can only come through the discipline and it's byproduct of genuine, mature freedom. If we do not possess our selves, we cannot give our selves; so instead we often focus on outer manifestations of relationships and call that "love".
Discipline is a sign of freedom - and freedom is an imperative to love. A person without discipline is not yet capable of mature love.
Matthew Kelly writes:
In the lives of successful people, we find that discipline is indispensible.
- Why would relationships be any different?
- Is your primary relationship thriving or just surviving?
- How much is discipline a part of your relationship?
- Do you honestly want a successful intimate relationship?
- What makes a successful relationship?
Successful, loving, rewarding relationships do not occur in a vacuum - nor do they occur by chance or some fluke miracle.
You have to want it for your life. Your partner has to want it to. It has to be a priority for BOTH of you. There must be an agreed upon plan (which I will share about later when I have more time) and it must be addressed every day with commitment of discipline. Without discipline, there can be no love and genuine intimacy.
****************
dannyegg4575
Senior Don Juan
- Joined
- Sep 7, 2007
- Messages
- 311
- Reaction score
- 11
This goes back to my question on commitment on Rollo's "Desire Dynamic" thread.
http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=84124&page=3
commitment equivalent to ownership? The underlying reason why there is so much stress in a relationship? When two people cannot feel free but to force themselves through years of dissatisfaction?
And like Rollo asked, if one party found that the relationship becomes stale or no longer working, if her selfish need to end the relationship for her own happiness be immoral? What if it was for us guys? If we were to walk away, would that be immoral as well? I mean, a lifetime of misery?
I'm 34 now and I think I'll live to 80 or so. 40 if I'm lucky. but from 34-80, that's a very long time...
http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=84124&page=3
commitment equivalent to ownership? The underlying reason why there is so much stress in a relationship? When two people cannot feel free but to force themselves through years of dissatisfaction?
And like Rollo asked, if one party found that the relationship becomes stale or no longer working, if her selfish need to end the relationship for her own happiness be immoral? What if it was for us guys? If we were to walk away, would that be immoral as well? I mean, a lifetime of misery?
I'm 34 now and I think I'll live to 80 or so. 40 if I'm lucky. but from 34-80, that's a very long time...
LovelyLady
Senior Don Juan
- Joined
- Jun 7, 2007
- Messages
- 437
- Reaction score
- 41
bump
penkitten
Master Don Juan
bump
Interceptor
Master Don Juan
Bump.Interceptor
Master Don Juan
Bumping,again.
I think theres a lot of information that is really helpful here.
Thank you, LL.
This is good.
I think theres a lot of information that is really helpful here.
Thank you, LL.
This is good.
LovelyLady
Senior Don Juan
- Joined
- Jun 7, 2007
- Messages
- 437
- Reaction score
- 41
bump
