Quality Gains

[cinephile]

I started working out serious about two years ago. Since then I have gone from 150 to 172. The problem is that there has been very little change. I'm not substantially bigger or stronger. My bench has probably only incresed 15 LBS, while my waistline has grown only an inch to 33. I feel stronger and have more enegry overall, but not a sustantial amount. At what point should I start to see some real changes either positive or negative? I know this is somewhat subjective question, but I need to determine if I am doing something wrong.

 

[manuva]

Sounds like a classic case of improper nutrition.

Post your current diet up here.

 

[Shiftkey]

Post your reutine also. How often do you increase the weight of your bench? Do you rep to failure?

 

[semag]

two years... you shoulda at least put 30-40 lbs on all your big lifts man... sounds like you got something wrong.

 

[cinephile]

Thanks for the replies.

My diet definately could be better. I try to eat at least 3000 calories a day, but more definately lneeds to be protien. I probably have maybe at most 150 gm a day. Yeah, I know I need more.

More routine is pretty simple. 4 days a weeks, based around compound lifts.

Day 1. Bench
Military

Day 2 Lat Pull Down bar
Rows

Day 3 Squats

Day 4 Cable Pushdowns
Barbell curl

In general I try to do these all to failure. My form is pretty good. I am not doing any major sholder work for right now because I hurt it playing basketball over the holidays.

All coments are appreciated.

 

[Warboss Alex]

My diet definately could be better. I try to eat at least 3000 calories a day, but more definately lneeds to be protien. I probably have maybe at most 150 gm a day. Yeah, I know I need more.

Simple: you're 170lbs, want to get bigger and eating like you're still 150lbs.

Your protein intake is abysmal, it's not even 1g/lb. 350g absolute minimum though I'd recommend you aimed for 400 every day.

At your current weight I doubt bodyfat is an issue, but it's best to stay away from starchy carbs a few hours before bed (unless you train at night of course). Your diet shouldn't be squeaky clean but not full of junk either.

Source your protein from red meat, whole eggs, chicken, turkey, tuna, lowfat dairy, etc.

Carbs should be from oats, white/sweet potatoes, brown/basmati rice, wholegrain bread, veg (you need lots of fibre when consuming large amounts of protein).

You will be getting fats from red meat and eggs but olive/flax oil are always good to include as well.

Don't forget the micronutrients either: a good multivitamin and EFAs are the bare minimum.

Your routine isn't the worst I've seen but could be a bit better. Try this:

flat db press
incline press (db or bb)
close grip bench or skullcrushers
military press or db press

bicep exercise of your choice
forearm exercise if you feel the need
pulldown variation
deadlift variation

abs of your choice
calf press of your choice
sumo leg press or leg curl
squats

Do two hard sets, except for calves (just one set), deadlifts (1 set of 10) and squats (1 set of 6-8 heavy, then drop the weight by 25-30% and do 20 reps, quad mass pronto!) - rep ranges will vary but I would say 8-10, some like lower but I prefer higher reps for the safety factor. Some exercises (mostly bis/tris/calves) will benefit from higher reps.

Your mission is to add AT LEAST 2.5lbs or 2 reps to each exercise, EVERY workout. If you don't feel you can make the weight jump then go for more reps - if you fail to beat your exercise then change it for a different exercise.

Example (using 8-10 rep range):
Bicep barbell curl:
Workout 1: 10x75lbs, 8x75lbs
Workout 2: 11x80lbs, 8x75lbs
Workout 3: 8x85lbs - oops.

So you maxed out on barbell curls at 85lbs for 8 reps, next time do preacher curls (say) until you get stuck on them, then either change back to barbell curls or you could also choose a completely new exercise like db curls, drag curls, spider curls etc.

Follow these guidelines, don't be afraid to eat, train hard, be patient and consistent and weigh yourself every MONTH, not every DAY - otherwise the scale will mess with your head.

Good luck!

 

[silverwex]

Yep, the above routine Warboss gave you is what Im on. Seems to work well for me.

PS - Warboss im making strength gains in the gym again - usually repping 2 or 3 reps extra every time I come back to a certain exercise (e.g. 6 reps of 18kg each side of BD Shoulder Press one week, 8 the next...)

Thing is, I dont seem to be growing bigger, just getting stronger - maybe its the fact I see myself everyday I wouldnt notice?

 

[Warboss Alex]

Originally posted by silverwex
Thing is, I dont seem to be growing bigger, just getting stronger - maybe its the fact I see myself everyday I wouldnt notice?

Yes, it's because you look at yourself constantly, you're a vain git who lives in front of the mirror ..

Assess your progress in the mirror/scale every MONTH, not every day, week or even fortnight.

There's so many variables here that you really can't gauge success from daily checks. Few people add mass linearly, they might go two weeks and not gain a lb then by the end of the third week the scale's shot up ..

Just take it from me:
IF YOU ARE CONSTANTLY GETTING STRONGER ON A PARTICULAR EXERCISE THEN YOU ARE ALSO GETTING BIGGER - (providing your caloric and protein intake is sufficient for growth).

Looking in the mirror constantly is fatal. Just don't do it, keep pressing on and your clothes will let you know how you're doing.

 

[semag]

silver... you may wanna try a picture diary.

Draw up a spot in your house or something and take a pic of yourself (digicam) and make sure you can replicate the lighting/pose pretty well. Then say "hey, i'm gonna take a pic here every wednesday" or something.

THEN you'll have a reference to 3, 4...7 weeks ago, and say "whoa, i'm huge"

 

[cinephile]

Thanks for the comments

Okay what you say makes sense. I will modify my current routine to take in the changes you recomend. Diet will be harder since it can take a bit of planning to get 400 grams of protien in. Does anyone know a good site that give accurate information on food? I would like to find the most effiecient way to get that 400.

 

[Warboss Alex]

Re: Thanks for the comments

Originally posted by cinephile
Okay what you say makes sense. I will modify my current routine to take in the changes you recomend. Diet will be harder since it can take a bit of planning to get 400 grams of protien in. Does anyone know a good site that give accurate information on food? I would like to find the most effiecient way to get that 400.

nutritiondata, fitday etc. Generally 3oz/100g of meat will be 20-25% protein:

100g ground beef = 20g
100g chicken breast = 24g
100g turkey breast = 22-23g
100g tuna = 23g (varies from can to can)
whey = depends on type
egg = depends on size
milk = usually around 20g per pint

Get 350g of protein from protein sources eg meat, fish, dairy, whey etc and the protein you get from carbs will bring it up to 400g.

I only intake 100g of whey protein every day, that's around 20% of my overall protein intake - I'd say at least two-thirds of your protein should be from whole foods instead of powder.

 

[Warlord]

I thought your body can only digest about 40g of protein at a time? And the extra g of protein just gets wasted and becomes useless.

Seems almost impossible at your 2g of protein x 1lb of weight method. I weigh 160lbs, I usually measure myself eating up to 160g of protein and any other meals I have (which is usually 1 more) I just eat whatever but focus on protein content, I am gaining about 5-10lbs of extra weight per muscle workout every 4-6 months if you were wondering.

I don't think eating all that meat is healthy on you, meat eating animals tend to have much lower life span than vegetable/ veg-meat eating animals. I'm focusing on health and body building not just primarily on bodybuilding - I've read enough stories of bodybuilders in their 50s suffering from heart problems.

 

[silverwex]

Thanks for replying guys.

Warboss: I cant help being vain man - just gotta love me! But yeah, good points, cheers.

Semag: Good idea man. Might just do that!

 

[Warboss Alex]

Originally posted by Warlord
I thought your body can only digest about 40g of protein at a time? And the extra g of protein just gets wasted and becomes useless.

30g actually, and this drops to 22.567g if the intake is before 7pm on a Wednesday night when the moon is full and West Ham are playing an away game somewhere north of Watford - if Christian Dailly is in the starting lineup then I'm afraid it's just 20g.

In other words, myth - the body will adapt to digesting the higher protein levels just fine without any ill effects, so long as you're intaking sufficient fibre and water (which you should be doing anyway).

Bodybuilders in their 50s have heart problems probably down to their drug (ab)use - there is no, repeat NO evidence of a high-protein diet being harmful to your health (even what is considered an 'extreme' protein diet, 2.5 or 3g of protein per lb).

If you're training PURELY for fitness/aesthetics then lower protein levels will do you just fine, but for any sort of serious size calls for serious protein intake.

Your gaining 5-10lbs every six months just proves this. (unless you meant weight added to the bar, in which case you're even worse off)

To each their own; when somebody gives me proof that high protein is bad for you I'll consider eating less. But for now, pass the beef please semag.

 

[Warboss Alex]

Originally posted by silverwex
Semag: Good idea man. Might just do that!

I second the idea - if you pay your dues then picture comparing can be VERY pleasing.

 

[Warlord]

I think you may be right Warboss. I have a friend whose been working out for 7+ years, he is the typical skinny asian guy now he's practically medium built with huge ass arms, yet he's been looking "about" the same for the past several years. He even admits he feels he's plateauing, he's tried creatine and I asked him about his diet. His diet doesn't consist of a lot of protein just enough for his weight though. I think you may be on to something Warboss, but 2-3g of protein can be expensive so I'm going to up my protein intake to 1.5g.