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My mother (covert NPD of the highest order) is exactly as described. Do as I say, not as I do, all hell breaks loose if you call her on it, constantly runs me down to the rest of my siblings after I cut her out of my life for disrespecting my then husband (and despite extremely minimal communication with me over the past 7 years)...she still thrives on trying to manipulate family...say what a bad actor I am to anyone who might listen...tried to draw my minor children into her manipulative drama (I simply overtly cut her off from my children and told her why...then hung up the phone & explained her behavior to the children. That's a fun conversation.)They were married for 50 years.
My Grandad's life was a misery from the outside looking in. He & my Gran lived in complete isolation for as long as I can remember. I don't actually know how he felt about it. My Dad asked him why he puts up with the grief once and he wouldn't answer.
I think my Grans behavior became normal to him. He was controlling in some ways and her isolating herself suited that. I know she had some form of breakdown in her 40's & likely has a variance of a mental health disorder.
He mitigated the impact of her negative behavior & she would belittle him in front of me & my Dad. She fell out with every single person around her & he went along with that.
My Dad's side of the family exists, but I only know my Dad & Gran.
Being honest, most of the major betrayals in my life have come from my Gran & Grandad. This is despite them being a relatively small aspect of my life.
I used to take it personally, but I have realized that she will do this to anyone who comes into her life.
She rang me today actually, complaining about some trivial issue, trying to play mind games so I would pander to her.
I'm sorry you had to go through that with your Mother. That must have been tough. Was one of the hardest things not really believing or constantly questioning whether it was your Mom that was at fault? I've found that when we're talking about covert NPDs, they tend to leave people reeling simply because you've never quite sure if they were actually the problem, i.e. their covert abuse and like you said they are incapable of taking responsibility for anything. Is this something you experienced with your Mom?My mother (covert NPD of the highest order) is exactly as described. Do as I say, not as I do, all hell breaks loose if you call her on it, constantly runs me down to the rest of my siblings after I cut her out of my life for disrespecting my then husband (and despite extremely minimal communication with me over the past 7 years)...she still thrives on trying to manipulate family...say what a bad actor I am to anyone who might listen...tried to draw my minor children into her manipulative drama (I simply overtly cut her off from my children and told her why...then hung up the phone & explained her behavior to the children. That's a fun conversation.)
NPDs are notoriously masterful at both manipulation and gas lighting. They are not for amateurs to deal with. They are victims of their own lives. It is too painful for them to be accountable, as that would run completely counter to their warped self narrative.
They are like roaches in the sense that they hate the light exposing them for what they are. But therein lies the kryptonite for them. Shining light and directly calling out the behaviors, while it is not for the conflict averse, it's the single most effective way to defuse them, especially if done with indifference or better, amused mastery.
As in: That's interesting you would do/say/think xyz. How's that working out for ya? And smile. Do not get ruffled & never react. Never engage the crazy except to call it out through ridicule. NPDs hate ridicule when they are seeking supply. It's like them trying to drink sea water.
They will learn not to cross you overtly. But understand that covertly they will work to influence others and tear you down FOREVER.
So best to leave them to stew in their own grandiose paranoia. Avoidance is how you remain unscathed by their tentacles of bs and drama.
Yes. Now. Don't feel sorry for me. I was lucky because I am strong. When you grow up being gas lighted constantly it either beats you down or it makes you start questioning everything.I'm sorry you had to go through that with your Mother. That must have been tough. Was one of the hardest things not really believing or constantly questioning whether it was your Mom that was at fault? I've found that when we're talking about covert NPDs, they tend to leave people reeling simply because you've never quite sure if they were actually the problem, i.e. their covert abuse and like you said they are incapable of taking responsibility for anything. Is this something you experienced with your Mom?
Yeah, it seems when you call them out on their B.S. is when you really face the wrath of God. I noticed that too.
You become quite a threat to the NPD psyche.
If you cannot be controlled or manipulated you are a threat to an NPD. Threats must be destroyed.
I forgot to note...that article explains my mom to the Nth degree. Glad you shared it @btownbuck2012
I've watched just about all his videos. You can see how a piece of him is missing and how angry he still is. Can't believe he lasted I think 10 years with her. I felt just like he mentioned after my relationship was over.Something that is extremely common coming out of a relationship with a person like this is wondering to yourself "Was I the problem? Maybe I have the personality disorder...?"
God almighty I can relate to that.My words hitting a wall
The paint never sticks
But the more I try
The messier it gets
I've noticed the ones that do have friends when they are around their 'friends', you'll notice their friends tend to ignore them and treat them as if they're a bit of a cumbersome third wheel.Yup. My mother has no friends. Zero, Zip, Nada. It's sad really. But completely of her own doing.
That's what's great about online communities. We can all come together and realize we're NOT crazy because anytime you cross a person like the type we're describing, our experiences will all be EERILY similar.Dam guys im reading through stuff and feeling better and better. My ex's ex wich i still talked to was married to her for 10 years and said this very thing one time. Holy chit
Yeah big time. The gaslighting and emotional invalidation gets so bad that you eventually think you are the cause of the relationship failing and you start questioning everything "They loved me so much and now they hate me, what the hell is wrong with me, I must be an awful person to lose that kind of love and not only to lose it but to now be thought of as a weak pathetic person by that very same person. What the hell is wrong with me", etc. ...Btown no chit is it common for them to make you feel like a NPD? Like a codependency situation?
This! I felt that way at first, but quickly snapped out of it. I've been helping people from all over the world recover from Cluster B relationships. One guy I help cries almost everyday blaming himself for being discarded. When in fact it wasn't his fault. No matter what I tell him, he still believes he is at fault and now hates himself to the point he wants die.Yeah big time. The gaslighting and emotional invalidation gets so bad that you eventually think you are the cause of the relationship failing and you start questioning everything "They loved me so much and now they hate me, what the hell is wrong with me, I must be an awful person to lose that kind of love and not only to lose it but to now be thought of as a weak pathetic person by that very same person. What the hell is wrong with me", etc. ...
It's almost impossible to give an answer on whether they will hoover or not. I've talked to people who had a hoover 5, 10, 15 years later. When their looks fade, their charm no longer works like it used to and a lot of bridges have burnt, they tend to hoover certain victims back.Guys i have a quedtion about this mans other video. In the first one hes saying that NOD easily detaches and drops you and moves on. Then in this one here hes saying they still come back and try to whoo you and feed off of it again.
Seems conflicting and confusing.
My NPD experience was gas lighting smokescreening and then pretty vicious language towrds the situation.
Thoughts??
I swear to God man, every single post I've read on SS about cluster b's, more specifically the covert narc type that you describe is almost like I'm reading about the girl I dated. It's as if you were describing her specifically. It really is chilling.these women should be put down. I swear the woman ive been with for a year is a covert narcissist. Cant take accountability for ANYTHING she does. shes ungrateful, doesn't reciprocate. Ive honestly felt like alone in some ways with her. what a waste of this year of my life. what a selfish cvnt.
When she was young the other cambodian kids harassed her a lot because she didn't look as asian. she looks more indian. this must have fvcked her up, but fvck her. that is not my fault. its like they want to earn the abuse they received a a child by being a piece of sh!t to other people as an adult.
im ten years younger than her and shes not really hot, but not ugly either.. i bet shes lied a lot because ive caught her, never over anyything big. i've been treating her indifferently for a few days and she came and started sh!t with me at the first opportunity.
what she does the most is basically, she does her best to make me think she doesn't really give a sh!t about me, my well being, my happiness. I think ive realized she doesn't care about that ****. She cares about the validation she gets from me. constant push and pull with mostly push. basically her push is to more or less become detached, doesn't want to talk much, doesn't initiate affection ect. Im so sick of this stupid cvnt.
I can't wait untill im out of her place and I can treat her with indifference where she cant instigate. I will be laughing when she tries to make contact or hit me up.
She had surgery a few weeks ago. ovarian cyst. so i was there for her, especially after the surgery. and she still had the nerve to say "what have you done for me??" during a fight recently.
We were having an argument over text the other day, and in the middle of her talking sh@t like the stupid @ss mouth cvnt she is, she says "at the doctor now, i have to have another surgery, I probably have cancer". so later that day I went to go talk to her, I didn't want her to have cancer. I felt guilty because we were fighting too. She brushed me off saying "Its none of your business, dont worry about it" and went back to giving me the cold shoulder like she does it her pushing stage.
Tell you what. After her women will not be able to easily play games with me. I know better now. I can see it, and I could see it with her because I never really let her get away with it. but she is relentless. Doesn't give a fvck about how she affects other people.
I tell her "the next guy might beat you, or he will just leave your @ss" she says "there wont be another one after you".
Honestly good. She deserves to be alone. I now understand why she was alone for so long before me and why the father of her son lost his sh!t, got locked up because of her, and got out and destroyed her parents windshield ect.
Shes a fvcking b!tch. thats not being sassy. thats not attractive. thats what results in men choking your @ss out.
I believe most women who get abused legit want it. They provoke it. they antagonize. But its fine. I just need to get out of here asap, but I cant just yet. Plus I dont pay rent or pay for food. But when I do leave im leaving when shes not here and im not letting her know where I went.
her generosity is a result of her being 40 (but if you look at her face she looks 30, not saying shes an 8 or anything, but looks youthful) and the fact that she knows she generally sucks in relationships. It was all fake kindness.
I even said to her more than once when she tries to bring up how she "helped me out" that she neglected every other part of the relationship (never refused me sex though, just never initiated it or any affection really) that what else is she good for? I mean for real. I looked her in her eyes and said "how else would you have gotten me to stay with you for this long? you're a sh!t girlfriend"
just a sarcastic, disrespectful b!tch. She'd start an argument with me and say **** like "get louder" "get madder" "go ahead, hit me".
NEVER takes accountability. Sometimes she'd admit to what she did wrong, but only after a fight and I had to tell her to do it. Then eventually I'd say "nope, your sorry doesn't mean anything because I had to solicit it and you don't alter your behavior, even if you know what you did was fvcked up and wrong, you dont have remorse because if you had remorse you'd stop doing it."
Sorry for the rambling. But I feel better typing all that. This b!tch is a negative, vindictive, passive aggressive , soul sucking, time waster. Her son is a little dishonest, selfish brat too, and I pretty much was done with him 4 months ago. They deserve eachother.
Oh and I know it sounds a little harsh about her 14 yearold son, but this boy has been jealous (only child) of me and his mothers relationship this whole time. he used to come try and knock on the door, once he opened it while I was fvcking his mothers brains out. But once i was slamming her and he knocked on the door and said "mommy" in like a whiney voice. His mother ALWAYS told me to keep going, dont stop, which i thought was weird. This kid has wanted me gone the whole time. Hes a little mamas boy who never had a father and is as emotionally manipulative and dishonest as his mother. Oh and he is passive aggressive like her too. Hes disrespectful to me because he heard his mom talking sh!t during a fight. I've litterally caught him lying about stupid sh!t that wouldn't even benefit him.
He would come up trying to be all affectionate with his mom in front of me (which i didnt even care) and she told me later on "he never does that normally, hes doing it because you're here" just evidence he was extremely jealouse. Also sometimes when his mom and me would have an argument, he all of a sudden wants to be her bestfriend (which normally, she told me he doesn't do that much, not since he turned like 12).
He even straight up asked her "why do you treat him better than me".
NEVER get into a serious relationship with single mothers. We should be teaching male children to shun and avoid single mothers in our public schools.