LMR: Where's the line between persistence and rape?

[OnTheWayUp]

Hi guys,

So, I'm still on my quest to lose the v-card. Something I've noticed as I've got better with girls over the last year is that I'm finding it increasingly easy to make entertaining conversation, getting the number and even a first date, but I'm absolutely terrible (clearly, being a virgin ) at closing.

I've read a lot on here and other sites (rsd nation was particularly good if I remember correctly) about LMR, but every time I find myself in a situation where I need to move the escalation onwards, I find myself struggling. Even though I am fully aware that if a girl comes back to your room/ finds a reason to invite you to her's, the game is on regardless of what she says, I find it very difficult to escalate when she's always like:

"We're not going any further."
"Stop."
"OntheWayUuuuuuuuuuuuuuuup" in kind of a whiney tone

I'm meeting up next Monday with a girl I made out with in a club last Wednesday. She seems very interested: she's been initiating the texting rather than me, she's been moving things in her schedule to see me, says we can't meet at her place because her roommate's bf will be coming over etc. All this leads me to believe that I will get another shot to escalate next Monday.

To give myself the best possible chance of sealing the deal, here are the details of the girls I've made out with/ had in my room in the last year. See if you can see what I'm doing wrong. These girls range in age from 18-22.



1) Initially hooked up drunkenly for the first time when she had a bf. Got the usual LMR, didn't even know what it was then, plus I was content just to make out! Hooked up again multiple times after she had dumped her bf (2 months later). Managed to get her top off and nothing more, too much LMR.

2) Went on a "midnight walk" after a party which ended up back at mine. She was unofficially seeing another guy at the time. Got massive LMR, managed to get her top off (took me like 2 hours!) and finger her a bit whilst she still had underwear on. She invited herself to my room a week later. We watched a DVD, but I couldn't get any further than the last time. Strikes me as a ****tease who gets off on male attention without giving it up.

3) Found an excuse to take me back to hers after a gig we both played in. Absolutely no LMR until she was naked, I was almost naked and I had gone down on her. After that, she "had to go to bed to study the next day." Doesn't want anything to do with me anymore.

4) Met a girl in my halls, thought she was hot and quite flirty, took her out for a drink the same day. She came back to mine, went for the kiss after about 1.5 hrs of building comfort, got rejected.

5) Met a girl several times at friends' parties, dated 2/3 times. The last time, got her back to my room, but never found an opportunity to make a move. Definitely have regrets about this one.

6) The girl who I'm meeting next Monday. Watch this space.

7) Girl with a bf who plays in one of my bands and is very flirty. Invited me out multiple times for drinks, I declined. Came to watch one of my other gigs and let me know that she was coming. Very easy to isolate and get back to mine, absolutely no complaints. Easy to get onto my bed, responded well to kino... BUT when we made out and I pulled away after 5-10 secs, she gave LMR, despite kissing passionately. Her making out then saying "this can't go any further" etc happened about 5 times.


Any ideas? I have a feeling I need to be more persistent... but I don't want to be accused of taking advantage of her. Help?


OnTheWayUp

 

[NorwegianDJ]

So what I extracted was that you want help with LMR and the line between persistance and rape?

Answer to the latter: http://www.rsdnation.com/node/152765?page=2 (You can go pretty fvcking far if you're good).

To the first one: Two Step on RSD has a solid article on LMR. Basicly you just ignore it. If it doesn't work, remain unreactive, take 2 steps back and 1 step forward. If it doesn't work, wash rinse repeat a few times.
If nothing works, do a freeze out. You immediately stop what you're doing, put some clothes on and do something completely non-sexual. Going on your phone or something like that. I think you might want to ignore her too (Not in the context of what she says, just in the context of acknowledging her presence).

 

[OnTheWayUp]

So what I extracted was that you want help with LMR and the line between persistance and rape?

Answer to the latter: http://www.rsdnation.com/node/152765?page=2 (You can go pretty fvcking far if you're good).

To the first one: Two Step on RSD has a solid article on LMR. Basicly you just ignore it. If it doesn't work, remain unreactive, take 2 steps back and 1 step forward. If it doesn't work, wash rinse repeat a few times.
If nothing works, do a freeze out. You immediately stop what you're doing, put some clothes on and do something completely non-sexual. Going on your phone or something like that. I think you might want to ignore her too (Not in the context of what she says, just in the context of acknowledging her presence).

Thanks for the advice dude, appreciate it. I'm familiar with both the articles on RSD you referred to. I'm aware of the need to push/ pull, take 2 steps back, 1 step forward etc. I've also read a lot about freeze out tactics before. I have tried all the above on the first 3 girls I gave examples of (on the first one, this was after I discovered what LMR was, so only from our second hook up onwards). I am aware of the need to verbally agree with her when she says "we need to stop" and carry on anyway physically.

In short, I'm familiar with everything you mention in theory, but when it comes to putting it into practice either I freeze up, or it doesn't work (or hasn't yet).

 

[Big Overseas 1]

The line between LMR & RAPE is usually made out of yellow tape that has the words ""crime scene" written across it.

Lol...be careful, dude.

 

[OnTheWayUp]

The line between LMR & RAPE is usually made out of yellow tape that has the words ""crime scene" written across it.

Lol...be careful, dude.

Haha, I like that one. In all seriousness though, it is very hard to know when a girl actually wants to to stop and when she is just saying no to test how persistent you are/ make her feel less slutty. Especially when, as a guy, you're horny and the logical reasoning part of your brain is impaired.