Kino-touch phobias (sex charge/rejections)

[reallyfreakinlost]

Well, as they say with gambling, if you cant afford to lose, then you shouldn't play. But is it also realistic to believe most girls are legal parannah fish ready to bite, fight and pounce any guy that touches them.

I mean that type of fear also bites into approaching women because you wonder what type of psycho 'who may call the cops on you if you touch them' you are approaching.

Girls should get over themselves, unless a guy is actually violating them.

I usually just go for girls who aren't the type to screw up your life.

 

[rocky_mtn]

...

How would a bootcamp/mission be crafted to get used to kino? Should I bump into women 'accidentally' or just randomly touch women on their shoulder or something?

No, NO and No.

don't randomly touch women, that is creepy. Just like you can't have an orchestra with just an oboe, you can't build a house with just caulk, you can't seduce women with just kino. Its just one instrument or tool used in an overall process.

Luke, you seem to take aspects of the PUA and twist them into something that is creepy.

Kino will not get you in trouble. You wouldn't just go up to a random stranger and shake their hand, and that's it. You don't go up to someone and just touch them. Its part of a bond of becoming familiar with someone and getting comfortable with them.

 

[Luke Skywalker]

A PRIMING date does not constitute 'random' kino as you have established enough connection/rapport to have a date in the first place. By bootcamps/missions, we are talking about random actions to strangers in public. Would you go up to a girl you dont know and play with her hair?

But good one, dont wait for approval before playing with her hair on priming dates. In the not too distant past I've asked two girls for permission to play with their hair on a priming date because I never touched hair before, and relaxed once the novelty was through.

 

[everywomanshero]

LOL while you guys are worried about lawsuits, some other guy is going to be porking the little lady.

My friend used to go in bars and grab the girl's beer and make her chase after him. This same guy, one night we were talking about how girls like their hair pulled, and he went up to a couple random women in the bar and did it within 30 seconds of talking to them. He wasn't jailed or sued.

Yes, you can defintely cross the line between humerous into creepy. I am not suggesting anyone go around pulling hair. I am suggesting that worrying about being sued over basic kino: shoulder touch, palm reading, touching anywhere on the hand/arm is either A) an excuse to chicken out or B) a form of anxiety. It is not a reasonable fear. I've 'kino'd' thousands of women without being jailed or sued. The mathmatical probability that this will happen to you is so minute, that I'd venture to say you better never ride amusement park rides or swim in the ocean if this type of outside chance concerns you.

While the court system is hideously anti-male, I don't see a judge allowing a lawsuit like this to even go forward, much less any chance of convincing a jury to give an award. That's assuming someone even filed, which is unlikely at most. For starters, most attorneys won't file a suit unless they think they can win. If the case isn't a high probability, then they are going to want a lot of $$$$ to bring the case forward. Not too many women are going to shell out that kind of cash for something that has virtually no chance of success. That's assuming they even know who you are to name you on the paperwork.

A much more serious problem would be to get named in a paternity suit after you already took her home

 

[Luke Skywalker]

LOL while you guys are worried about lawsuits, some other guy is going to be porking the little lady.

My friend used to go in bars and grab the girl's beer and make her chase after him. This same guy, one night we were talking about how girls like their hair pulled, and he went up to a couple random women in the bar and did it within 30 seconds of talking to them. He wasn't jailed or sued.

But aren't bar-ladies more loose than other ladies? Would bar-behaviour be applicable to grocery stores and malls or what have you? Would you touch the hair of a cashier with a line of customers behind you? Where do you apply this stuff?

Yes, you can defintely cross the line between humerous into creepy. I am not suggesting anyone go around pulling hair.

Oh, I see. I guess what I mentioned above may seem creepy.

I am suggesting that worrying about being sued over basic kino: shoulder touch, palm reading, touching anywhere on the hand/arm is either A) an excuse to chicken out or B) a form of anxiety. It is not a reasonable fear. I've 'kino'd' thousands of women without being jailed or sued. The mathmatical probability that this will happen to you is so minute, that I'd venture to say you better never ride amusement park rides or swim in the ocean if this type of outside chance concerns you.

Ok, what about making passes? Suppose you like a girl and want to touch her a$$ and there seems to be a good raport. Is that a resonable fear?

 

[skip2mylou781]

luke, read wat i wrote on ur bootcamp thread

end of story

 

[Distant Light]

The TD thing was basically a kino opener, for example putting your arm around her and roleplaying, and starting Push/Pull real early. I was going to try this on a hb9 in school once because she kept trying to hold a conversation with me but I was too busy talking with some friends.

When doing Kino she will notice it from the start cause girls can sense it way more than us. Like for the first few months I was doing kino wrong I was just trying to touch touch touch. An it did get me used to girls but this one girl knew exactly what I was going to do she was like "Watch he is going to touch me" lol. So thats when I realize I'm doing something wrong because it wasn't natural.

I use accidental touching to like test the waters, like I made up my own kino routines which I do on every girl to see how comfortable she is towards me touching her. Both kino routine that I made ends up me touching there breast, first time is brushing it next time is touching it. It is easier not to touch with the palm of your hand or hand itself, that is why i try my brush kino first. I've done it to every girl I've gamed so far and has never failed yet. (I don't do it right away its usually when i get enough attraction.

My experiences with kino
Kino is basically an IOI so i only give as words, that is why if your playing hard to get you don't kino as much because she is going to end up chasing and kinoing you. I think Kino got so much easier for me because when I first started using it I was doing it wrong, I was just doing acidental touch and the playful touching, and embracing, etc. I would touch anytime i had to chance so i can get used to it.

I highly doubt you will ever get a lawsuit, unless you was looking like a perverted creep and just grabbed a girl ass or something. Because I've seen guys being playful and just smack a girl on the butt and nothing ever happens.

This girl who has a BF that I never talked to I've only kinoed and the rest was body language, I did some kino that I do to every girl (Put my leg next to there leg and if there interested they would usually rub there leg or thigh against me.) so she did all that so I knew it was on but she had a BF and I gamed her 2 friends. But one day during class accidentally touched her ass. An then one day on the street i seen her and she walk by me and I slapped her ass and both times she didn't mind.

Just get more touchy with everyone, to get used to it, it won't be awkward unless you make it feel that way. Maybe yall are laughing and you touch her arm or maybe your playing around with her and bump her.

 

[everywomanshero]

But aren't bar-ladies more loose than other ladies? Would bar-behaviour be applicable to grocery stores and malls or what have you? Would you touch the hair of a cashier with a line of customers behind you? Where do you apply this stuff?

In line there would be no real reason to move beyond very minor kino. I wouldn't grab someone's ass in a line.

Oh, I see. I guess what I mentioned above may seem creepy.

Anything can come across as creepy or fun-loving or serious, the words you say, how you say them, facial expressions, etc will al affect how it is perceived.

Ok, what about making passes? Suppose you like a girl and want to touch her a$$ and there seems to be a good raport. Is that a resonable fear?

There is few cases where someone having anxiety over kino should be touching women's assess in grocery stores. Just avoid touching asses in grocery stores and malls in general. Maybe playfully spanking is the only reasonable exception I can think of right now.

If you are taken down in a flood of litigation resulting from basic KINO, I'll be very surprised. With all the media attention PUAs are getting, it would be really funny if some crackpot bible-thumper tried to pass ordiances against talking to women in public.

 

[Luke Skywalker]

There is few cases where someone having anxiety over kino should be touching women's assess in grocery stores. Just avoid touching asses in grocery stores and malls in general. Maybe playfully spanking is the only reasonable exception I can think of right now.

What's the difference between playful spanking and touching asses, both are the same, I mean what are you going to possibly say that would lead up to that.

If you are taken down in a flood of litigation resulting from basic KINO, I'll be very surprised. With all the media attention PUAs are getting, it would be really funny if some crackpot bible-thumper tried to pass ordiances against talking to women in public.

Again, we dont have 'litigation' here in Canada, we have another system that this goes under a 'sexual assault' umbrella under the criminal code. If convicted on something like that it will likely be a probation, but the fact is it will be on record and suck.

So you are saying, if I were to go, talk to a few girls, and say spank one of them in the a$$ after some basic kino, assuming some IOI's are displayed and I'm very horney, that the risk of a charge or a girl freaking out like crazy would be an unreasonable anxiety?

Pooparu is trying to advise me act on emotions when going out there. Scary thought of where that could lead.

 

[Luke Skywalker]

Actually, I'm going to be restricting policy of kino - or any touching for female friends and go by 'escalating touch' each time I see them. So far there are about four of them listed.

So, no one here need not worry that I'm going on any Newbie groping mission or anything.

 

[everywomanshero]

You can spank women because it's more of a playful thing. This isn't some kind of technique. I mean, I don't go around spanking women at random. It's a playful like 'bad girl.. i'm gonna have to spank you'... really I haven't used that sort of thing in ages, I find it sort of lame, but it's not a problem usually either.

If you just go out a lot you'll automatically know when you can get away with something, and you'll very rarely be wrong after a while. When you are wrong, it's typically funny, not life or death.

Pickup 101 has ane entire DVD on KINO if you're really interested in specific examples of safe kino.

 

[manbearpig]

I'm scared to death of doing kino.

I've never touched women like that. I've never really had female friends for example, that I playfight with or anything like that. Its not natural for me to touch them.

I don't know how to get over this fear.

 

[Luke Skywalker]

KINO-TOUCH exercise with UG4 friend

Ok, I'm meeting a friend today to go for a walk with her. I'll likely be dressing a bit down because I'm thinking of going to a volleyball meet afterwards.

Background: She is spiritual/religious - and am not sure what her response is going to be for kino-touching, but it's the only thing I have to work on for purposes of experiment. At worst case, the friendship would be risked if I were to do something aggressive and do not think she's likey to do anything else.

I'm prepared not to waste too much time - if I have to be her 'asexual friend' then I'm prepared to terminate the friendship anyway as it's not likely going to be healthy, so I'm thinking of taking risks on her. All my 'friends' have kino-touch, kiss-close, pass, f-close objectives in order to remain 'friends' to see how far it can go before the friendship is blown out.

Today's kino-touch exercises:

convo - is assumed to be random - although a few priming date lines during the walk may be thrown in for kicks - like the first kiss line, love at first sight vs, gradual, and finally what is it about a man that she knows she's appreciated, and talk about romance general. Other than that, convo would be usual boring fluff convo with exception of these injections.

This is the proposed kino-touch overlay:

-- note: masturbated last night and night before, sexual energy is flattened out today - listened to some poster saying it doesn't matter if you masturbate or not, now I'm not sure. -

1) Upon meeting her - hug her and kiss her on cheek.

2) When walking occasional touch on shoulders, comment about hair, touch her hair, -- see how she responds back.

Practise escalating kino -- see her feed-back with each progress kino.

RULE: Do not stop escalation until she says 'stop' or is uncomfortable.
If she's not encouraging it, escalation will proceed anyway.

3) Hold her hand while walking - or look at some excuse to touch her hand.

4) Put arm around her while walking at least once.


---------

If there is no problems on kino, then when hugging her before going, hands will go down to her waist, and she'll have to withdraw hug before me.

---- A massage routine may also be offered while walking, just say, she looks a bit tense, I just learned this, let me just try this to see if it works: and massage her shoulders.

**********

These are the proposals that I'm setting to get over kino-touch phobias in the division of 'escalating kino-touch' and 'resistance of the other party' and the interrelationships of those two factors.

A FR will be forthcoming on this thread of her interest, resistance, and break-off point of kino-touch (if any), where she really resisted it.

***********

 

[Luke Skywalker]

Holy crap - its worst than I thought - I really have a phobia

I couldn't do it. The only touch that occurred with my friend was a hug and a kiss-cheek.

Here's the chronology:

- we took a walk to the coffee shop - where I did the 'first-kiss' line from the HTSWW book - and she told me about her 'past', and I'm like WTF this UG4 was like a wild girl. She asked me about my story, and my honest little WBAFC self just told her - blank - nothing, and she said I'm worst than a priest, I must be a bishop or a pope. My mouth dropped open when I heard her story, this 'nun asexual' girl was a wild girl before.

- she was kino-touching me, like laughing then touching my shoulder, I could not reciprocate.

THOUGHT PROCESS: Felt 'inferiority-complex due to her relative 'experience' compared to my lack of experience' and just held back.

No fear of prosecution was a factor here. I could have done anything and she likely would not have pressed charges. Now, in the absence of that factor, there was still a problem, meaning, this is more serious than I thought it was.

**********

ANY PROGRESS:

She invited me into her apartment to see her bicycle. The trust element seems to be there for now. I asked her if she had a DVD/VCR player and she did. I could try for isolation next time under the guise of renting a movie and watching it after going for a future walk. (i.e. bring a DVD with me - dont tell her, just let it appear to happen naturally)

I'm so crazy thought - that even if I went into isolation with her I'm not sure what the heck I'd do - the 'frame' that this first-kiss line is going I'm not sure.

The hug was a little longer than the last time, so there was a micro-escalation from the last date, but not much further.

***********

Frustration at lack of groping attempt: No frustration for now. Let's see if I can get an isolation with her at her apartment next time. Think I'm too phobic to make a move on an isolation, but I have to try it out for my own curiosity.

Was thinking of using a hooker in November if really phobic, but no way I'm going to kiss any hooker that a zillion guys have stuck their **** into their mouth - it will have to be natural, we'll have to fight this the right way, and that's it.

This thread and board shall symbolise a fight for freedom, and the fight will continue fair and square. Independence from home, and feeling free with woman.

 

[manbearpig]

Its kinda weird how you're so technical about it, Luke Skywalker.

 

[Luke Skywalker]

Well, you know what, I cant help being technical. I'm not a natural at this. Let's face it, everyone who has problems with girls for the most part are over analyzing and are technical. I make no apologies of coming into this with a problem - I do see that I do something about my issues, and anyone else here hsould.

 

[BingoBango]

for some reason i find u compelling, luke.

I have an idea:

Maybe u should get a hooker - but not actualyl have sex with her. Like u could even explain to her ur situation, telling her u just wanna get used to touching girls. She'd prob be like "whatever" and take the money. And u could touch her however u like, maybe get head or whatever, and leave - and still have ur virginity.

Just an idea.

 

[Chaos-Knight]

You go,, Luke! :cheer: The great PUA's have technologized the art of seducing women. Analysis leads to wisdom.

Couple of thoughts:

*Lose the phobia. Pets love being petted. Do you have a dog? The next time you pet it, watch its tail wag...I invite you to consider viewing touch as an absolute neccesity for feeling human. Problem is, we're so sexually screwed up and repressed.

Good post!

I think what luke really needs is a few experienced wingmen,
that way he can get some first hand training.
An escort might be a nice start,
it's not like your gona marry the first girl you sleep with,
just don't lose it to a real big woman or something...

 

[Luke Skywalker]

Now that I have taken a bunch of pictures out of my trip to Italy, I can now use that as a premise of isolation into my car or into the girl's apartment. Well, let's see how this goes with the 'four friends' and see what comes out of it.

I'm only going to work on those, and do not intend to expand any social circle, and am putting a deadline limit to October 25, 2006, where any ideas about entertaining an escort could be made in November, assuming nothing works out anywhere.

Thus, a follow up on this, or what happened will be made on that date (Oct 25), and that date only.

 

[Luke Skywalker]

Well, I saw that girl again today, and this time went into her apartment and watched some pictures. Her mom was also there. Nothing happened, but it was a novel experience for me to be inside a dwelling place with a girl, and it felt nice that someone trusted me.

As a result of this novel experience - during the scheduled 'porn-November' month, I will not be seeing any hooker and will defer that to the beginning of next year - I will be releasing a profile on lavalife and on craiglist, however, claiming I'm a 30 y/o virgin looking for a deflower and see what type of responses I get for kicks.

Whether I will get responses, or am able to follow through with the responses is another story. I have learned to keep the email correspondence as short and brief and pointed as possible, always a an email rule -- do not use more than two to three sentences on any email correspondence unless you risk saying too much and you want to lose her.

The responses to this special internet ad will be posted at the end of the October month, and will be compiled October 25th-November 1st, and released on the November 1st date and run for 30 days.