Gender Roles

[Marvin Gaye]

Gender Roles Part: I

Gender Roles Part: II

Talks about everything preached here...

The narrator is so chill. Gives calm sensible points, doesn't degrade women. Check out these videos if you want more knowledge, on what's going wrong with USA relationships today.

- 07: 40 woman speaks on Gender roles

- Narrator asks if gender roles were removed, then would men be providers?

- If a man is protector and provider, it doesn't prevent woman from being President. Household and [/i]workforce[/i] are two different things

- Is there's no roles, there's no STRUCTURE.

The reason I post this is because I'm making a documentary on this subject. I wanted some opinions.


This illustrates a respectable way to get your point across. Reminds me of Jophil.

 

[sighsigh]

Relationships (marriages) are breaking down more because men are getting pussier... I'm guessing that's your thesis, since I see it spouted so often here (and in that video you linked). You want my opinion? It would be difficult to make your case.

First of all - and for some reason everyone here gets this wrong - currently divorce rates are not the highest they've ever been. For the US they've actually been slightly dropping the past few decades. They started to truly rocket upwards starting from the 1960's and have roughly plateaued since then. Mainly because of the woman equality movement, easier access to divorce, etc. kicking in around then. These statistics are everywhere.

Then you've got to deal with pretty damning evidence that marriages fail due to many more significant and common reasons than the one you're citing. For example, marriages are relatively successful for people who are older (beyond early 20's), better educated, and wealthier.

"Take the '80s: a full 81% of college graduates who got hitched in that decade at age 26 or older were still married 20 years later. Only 65% of college grads who said I do before their 26th birthday made it that far. But just 49% of those who married young and did so without a degree lasted 20 years." That last figure is about equal to the US national divorce rate which is ~50%. http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1989124,00.html

And then you have to back up the claim that men are supposedly becoming less masculine. That's central to the argument, but it would be very tough to do. I don't even know how you would empirically test it. Everyone here loves to presuppose that men are getting pussier because of the feminist movement, so you could argue that if men are supposedly incorporating feminist values into their personalities then something like domestic violence rates would have decreased over time. Now that actually is true - domestic violence in the US has decreased sharply over the past decade or so (something like ~20%)... but the 30-page article where I got that statistic from attempts to explain the trend, and I'm sure in the dozens of reasons they give pussification isn't one of them. Eh, you could object that a decrease in domestic violence doesn't necessarily imply the men are getting more feminine anyway...

Even to me in my everyday life it doesn't seem that men are getting significantly more wimpy... and I go to a very academic university with a LOT of Asians.

Now, this isn't to say that acting your gender role isn't important to maintaining a functional relationship. I think that fact is pretty damn obvious (obviously, men are attracted to women, and vice-versa). That's why I'm on this site. But to say that there's a breakdown in gender roles in progress or that a disruption of gender identity is the main cause of society's many dysfunctional relationships... that, to me, is very unconvincing.

 

[FairShake]

Young men aren't pulling their weight anymore. Women are the ones who are on the come up more and more. Judging by the economic future forecasts I suspect this will continue.

http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2010/07/the-end-of-men/8135/

Not only are they cleaning our clock more and more in the work world but THEY are the ones who are still raising children, guaranteeing they are passing on a women-first outlook to the future generations. And really, why the fvck not? A man who doesn't take care of his own ain't sh!t.

I don't give a fvck how much you neg, how many plates you spin, how many tattoos you have, how many MMA fights you've fought, how clingy you AREN'T if you aren't taking care of business you aren't a man. We're forgetting that and all this other stuff is secondary to that.

 

[Marvin Gaye]

Relationships (marriages) are breaking down more because men are getting pussier... I'm guessing that's your thesis, since I see it spouted so often here (and in that video you linked). You want my opinion? It would be difficult to make your case.

First of all - and for some reason everyone here gets this wrong - currently divorce rates are not the highest they've ever been. For the US they've actually been slightly dropping the past few decades. They started to truly rocket upwards starting from the 1960's and have roughly plateaued since then. Mainly because of the woman equality movement, easier access to divorce, etc. kicking in around then. These statistics are everywhere.

Then you've got to deal with pretty damning evidence that marriages fail due to many more significant and common reasons than the one you're citing. For example, marriages are relatively successful for people who are older (beyond early 20's), better educated, and wealthier.

"Take the '80s: a full 81% of college graduates who got hitched in that decade at age 26 or older were still married 20 years later. Only 65% of college grads who said I do before their 26th birthday made it that far. But just 49% of those who married young and did so without a degree lasted 20 years." That last figure is about equal to the US national divorce rate which is ~50%. http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1989124,00.html

And then you have to back up the claim that men are supposedly becoming less masculine. That's central to the argument, but it would be very tough to do. I don't even know how you would empirically test it. Everyone here loves to presuppose that men are getting pussier because of the feminist movement, so you could argue that if men are supposedly incorporating feminist values into their personalities then something like domestic violence rates would have decreased over time. Now that actually is true - domestic violence in the US has decreased sharply over the past decade or so (something like ~20%)... but the 30-page article where I got that statistic from attempts to explain the trend, and I'm sure in the dozens of reasons they give pussification isn't one of them. Eh, you could object that a decrease in domestic violence doesn't necessarily imply the men are getting more feminine anyway...

Even to me in my everyday life it doesn't seem that men are getting significantly more wimpy... and I go to a very academic university with a LOT of Asians.

Wow! I didn't know that...thanks for the info

Now, this isn't to say that acting your gender role isn't important to maintaining a functional relationship. I think that fact is pretty damn obvious (obviously, men are attracted to women, and vice-versa). That's why I'm on this site. But to say that there's a breakdown in gender roles in progress or that a disruption of gender identity is the main cause of society's many dysfunctional relationships... that, to me, is very unconvincing.

Great stuff. That's what I'm struggling with...finding a way to sell my case.

 

[Marvin Gaye]

Relationships (marriages) are breaking down more because men are getting pussier... I'm guessing that's your thesis, since I see it spouted so often here (and in that video you linked). You want my opinion? It would be difficult to make your case.

First of all - and for some reason everyone here gets this wrong - currently divorce rates are not the highest they've ever been. For the US they've actually been slightly dropping the past few decades. They started to truly rocket upwards starting from the 1960's and have roughly plateaued since then. Mainly because of the woman equality movement, easier access to divorce, etc. kicking in around then. These statistics are everywhere.

Then you've got to deal with pretty damning evidence that marriages fail due to many more significant and common reasons than the one you're citing. For example, marriages are relatively successful for people who are older (beyond early 20's), better educated, and wealthier.

"Take the '80s: a full 81% of college graduates who got hitched in that decade at age 26 or older were still married 20 years later. Only 65% of college grads who said I do before their 26th birthday made it that far. But just 49% of those who married young and did so without a degree lasted 20 years." That last figure is about equal to the US national divorce rate which is ~50%. http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1989124,00.html

And then you have to back up the claim that men are supposedly becoming less masculine. That's central to the argument, but it would be very tough to do. I don't even know how you would empirically test it. Everyone here loves to presuppose that men are getting pussier because of the feminist movement, so you could argue that if men are supposedly incorporating feminist values into their personalities then something like domestic violence rates would have decreased over time. Now that actually is true - domestic violence in the US has decreased sharply over the past decade or so (something like ~20%)... but the 30-page article where I got that statistic from attempts to explain the trend, and I'm sure in the dozens of reasons they give pussification isn't one of them. Eh, you could object that a decrease in domestic violence doesn't necessarily imply the men are getting more feminine anyway...

Even to me in my everyday life it doesn't seem that men are getting significantly more wimpy... and I go to a very academic university with a LOT of Asians.

Wow! I didn't know that...thanks for the info

Now, this isn't to say that acting your gender role isn't important to maintaining a functional relationship. I think that fact is pretty damn obvious (obviously, men are attracted to women, and vice-versa). That's why I'm on this site. But to say that there's a breakdown in gender roles in progress or that a disruption of gender identity is the main cause of society's many dysfunctional relationships... that, to me, is very unconvincing.

Great stuff. That's what I'm struggling with...finding a way to sell my case.

 

[Marvin Gaye]

Relationships (marriages) are breaking down more because men are getting pussier... I'm guessing that's your thesis, since I see it spouted so often here (and in that video you linked). You want my opinion? It would be difficult to make your case.

First of all - and for some reason everyone here gets this wrong - currently divorce rates are not the highest they've ever been. For the US they've actually been slightly dropping the past few decades. They started to truly rocket upwards starting from the 1960's and have roughly plateaued since then. Mainly because of the woman equality movement, easier access to divorce, etc. kicking in around then. These statistics are everywhere.

Then you've got to deal with pretty damning evidence that marriages fail due to many more significant and common reasons than the one you're citing. For example, marriages are relatively successful for people who are older (beyond early 20's), better educated, and wealthier.

"Take the '80s: a full 81% of college graduates who got hitched in that decade at age 26 or older were still married 20 years later. Only 65% of college grads who said I do before their 26th birthday made it that far. But just 49% of those who married young and did so without a degree lasted 20 years." That last figure is about equal to the US national divorce rate which is ~50%. http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1989124,00.html

And then you have to back up the claim that men are supposedly becoming less masculine. That's central to the argument, but it would be very tough to do. I don't even know how you would empirically test it. Everyone here loves to presuppose that men are getting pussier because of the feminist movement, so you could argue that if men are supposedly incorporating feminist values into their personalities then something like domestic violence rates would have decreased over time. Now that actually is true - domestic violence in the US has decreased sharply over the past decade or so (something like ~20%)... but the 30-page article where I got that statistic from attempts to explain the trend, and I'm sure in the dozens of reasons they give pussification isn't one of them. Eh, you could object that a decrease in domestic violence doesn't necessarily imply the men are getting more feminine anyway...

Even to me in my everyday life it doesn't seem that men are getting significantly more wimpy... and I go to a very academic university with a LOT of Asians.

Wow! I didn't know that...thanks for the info

Now, this isn't to say that acting your gender role isn't important to maintaining a functional relationship. I think that fact is pretty damn obvious (obviously, men are attracted to women, and vice-versa). That's why I'm on this site. But to say that there's a breakdown in gender roles in progress or that a disruption of gender identity is the main cause of society's many dysfunctional relationships... that, to me, is very unconvincing.

Great stuff. That's what I'm struggling with...finding a way to sell my case.