Maximus Rex
Banned
This is good sh*t.
Hey Savoy!
I'd like to hear your take on end game in clubs. Is it better to push for the makeout in the club and try to get the girl home that night or is it better to push for a day 2 [date]?
What would you say is the best option for solid game? On one hand, the risk of getting buyers’ remorse and trigger her ASD [anti-slut defense] is very much higher if you go for the makeout in the club.
On the other hand, you have to deal with the possibility of a flake when you go for the day 2. This is kind of confusing, and your opinion on this would be very much appreciated!
Fredde, January 20, 2007 4:22:00 PM PST
Hi Fredde,
Kiss her if you can and if her friends won’t see. But make it short. Just enough to get the point that this is the beginning of a romantic relationship and that you and her aren’t going to be “just friends”. Convey some sexuality if you can – touch her face of pull her hair slightly. Only pull her hair if you know what you are doing; there’s an art to this. Get a platonic female friend to show you. Or practice on yourself if you have to. The trick is run your hand up the back of her neck until you have a handful of her hair, near the roots. Gently but firmly pull slowly down. Not hard enough to actually move her head.
Be the one who stops the kissing. Leave her wanting more. Tell her “we should stop”. Many men who spend all night kissing in a club are desperate for physical contact. Men who don’t have any trouble leading women to sex don’t spend their nights in slobbery makeouts.
Now, it’s not the end of the world if you don’t kiss her. I often don’t, especially if I am conveying sexuality in other ways, especially through what I say and through my touch.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
These rules apply whether you going to bring her home or try to meet her again.
As long as you have energy, bring her home. Or go with her somewhere else after the club. This will solidify her connection to you and separate you from the other 5 guys she hung out with that night. Leaving with her doesn’t mean that you will sleep with her, or even that you should try to sleep with her in every situation. But all things being equal, your odds of getting a date are much greater if you hang out for an hour at your house after meeting her in a club than if you say your hurried goodbyes when the lights come on.
Oh, and let’s all stop calling them day 2s. They’re dates. Calling them something different doesn’t actually make them different.
Savoy
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Savoy -
I'm on The Lounge and have benefited from tons of success based on taking a bootcampand a 1 on 1 this past year. I get into a lot of relationships now and I was hoping to get some advice on how to end relationships properly. Is there any way that one can retain value amongst her friends and end a relationship?Steven - january 30, 2007 2:15:00 PM PST
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hi
I wasn’t on the [Relationship Management] seminar, but would like to learn more about that theme, so I’m waiting for the book to come out.
But for now I have a question for you Savoy. How to dump or break up with a girl? This is bothering me for past few months in that is an area where I have a lot of problems and I make a lot of mistakes.
The thing is that pickup material is so powerful that when I want to break up with a girl they become all crazy. They won’t let me go, and eventually when they realize that I’m not joking, they start talking about what a jerk I am, that I’m using women only for sex., etc.
So, how can I dump her or break up with her? Smoothly? With no risk of bad rumors, etc.?
Thanks,
peter - January 29, 2007 7:26:00 AM PST
Dear Peter & Steven,
Great stuff! I love it when I get letters that show much the bootcamps help people get the social lives they always wanted.
The breakup should be appropriate to the relationship. If you are seeing her a couple of times a week, you need to break up in person. If you text once in a while and hook up once a month, not returning her next text message should do the trick. If your relationship has progressed beyond the point at which it is appropriate just to not return a call, then your breakup needs to be “live”. In person or on the phone. Be a man and take responsibility for your actions. Don’t do any of this “it’s not you; it’s me” nonsense. Tell her that you’ve moved on, and that you want to be honest with her.
She may hate you anyway for a while. Most of my exes did at first, and then within a couple of weeks, all but one became good friends. But it’s a woman’s prerogative to hate her ex-boyfriends, and if that makes her feel better, then that’s what she should do.
As for her friends – even if she doesn’t hate you, her friends probably will. They have to. That’s the job of her friends. If they’re your friends too, they might be more neutral, but don’t count on it. Don’t argue. Let them hate. They’ll get over it and you’ll all be friends later. Unless you led her on, or were deliberately careless with her feelings.
You can prepare the ground for breaking up with a “soft landing”. If you normally return her calls the next day, return them after two days, then three or more. Cancel plans. After a week or two of this, she should be psychologically more prepared for the breakup. If you’re just casually dating, she may just stop calling you after a couple weeks.
Now, I’d like to get into why you are breaking up with so many women. As you get good, remember that you are the chooser. Just because a woman is attractive and is interested in you doesn’t mean you have to pursue her. Date quality. Figure out what you want before you go looking for more women. You might be pleasantly surprised about what happens when you set your sights higher.
By having a more active “screening” frame, you will naturally attract higher-quality women. A woman wants to know that you have high standards – so high that she needs to be at her best to win your attention. Of course, these standards have to be congruent with how you present yourself. You can’t be the loser who only dates supermodels.
My guess is also that you are sending boyfriend signals during the Comfort phase, or immediately after you sleep with a woman. We covered how not to end up in the “boyfriend frame” for about an hour during the Relationship Management seminar so I’m sure some of the material will make it onto the upcoming DVDs. In general:
Don’t see her more than once a week unless you want to be her boyfriend
Make sure she knows that you are seeing other women if you are
Never show jealousy
And a final piece of advice from someone who lost most of his CD collection in college - Get all your stuff out of her apartment before you break up with her.
Savoy
Savoy ,
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
My question remains the same as from a few posts ago: Can you clarify on the use of European style ****y/Funny, BT-spiking game vs. The Mystery Method intrigue-styled game, and how to use the former within the framework of the latter, etc.
Anonymous - January 30, 2007 5:42:00 PM PST
Dear Anonymous,
It’s a false choice. The Mystery Method is associated with “intrigue” because Mystery himself uses a lot of intrigue-based game. But Mystery never meant for people to become “little Mysteries”. What we teach is “The Mystery Method if you’re not Mystery”. Every successful man’s game includes elements that could be used by other men and elements that are specific to one’s own identity, personality, and circumstances. Fortunately, the material on the DVD Video Archive was chosen because of its quality and universality.
What we’ve done is taken the elements of the Mystery Method that are broadly applicable and combined this with techniques that were invented by myself, Sinn, Future, and others that made the Method work for large numbers of people, regardless of background, as well as our students. We have to make it work. We put our name on the line every night of every workshop, and students like yourself are paying money to watch us and learn, and you expect to see successes.
Intrigue is just one tool that builds attraction (via curiosity and an implication of higher value) and presents yourself as a challenge. Being ****y and funny is a tool that builds attraction (via tension, humor, and a presumption of higher value) and presents yourself as a challenge. Both tools primarily work in the Attraction phase, and also have relevance to Comfort. There’s no dichotomy. You should be able to use both tools – and many others besides – to account for different types of women and different social situations. Eventually, you will gravitate to the attraction techniques that best fit your identity and personality.
By the way, there are way more attraction techniques available to you than just intrigue and ****y/funny. Chapter 5 of the Venusian Arts Handbook goes through some of these pretty extensively.
Savoy
Hey Savoy!
I'd like to hear your take on end game in clubs. Is it better to push for the makeout in the club and try to get the girl home that night or is it better to push for a day 2 [date]?
What would you say is the best option for solid game? On one hand, the risk of getting buyers’ remorse and trigger her ASD [anti-slut defense] is very much higher if you go for the makeout in the club.
On the other hand, you have to deal with the possibility of a flake when you go for the day 2. This is kind of confusing, and your opinion on this would be very much appreciated!
Fredde, January 20, 2007 4:22:00 PM PST
Hi Fredde,
Kiss her if you can and if her friends won’t see. But make it short. Just enough to get the point that this is the beginning of a romantic relationship and that you and her aren’t going to be “just friends”. Convey some sexuality if you can – touch her face of pull her hair slightly. Only pull her hair if you know what you are doing; there’s an art to this. Get a platonic female friend to show you. Or practice on yourself if you have to. The trick is run your hand up the back of her neck until you have a handful of her hair, near the roots. Gently but firmly pull slowly down. Not hard enough to actually move her head.
Be the one who stops the kissing. Leave her wanting more. Tell her “we should stop”. Many men who spend all night kissing in a club are desperate for physical contact. Men who don’t have any trouble leading women to sex don’t spend their nights in slobbery makeouts.
Now, it’s not the end of the world if you don’t kiss her. I often don’t, especially if I am conveying sexuality in other ways, especially through what I say and through my touch.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
These rules apply whether you going to bring her home or try to meet her again.
As long as you have energy, bring her home. Or go with her somewhere else after the club. This will solidify her connection to you and separate you from the other 5 guys she hung out with that night. Leaving with her doesn’t mean that you will sleep with her, or even that you should try to sleep with her in every situation. But all things being equal, your odds of getting a date are much greater if you hang out for an hour at your house after meeting her in a club than if you say your hurried goodbyes when the lights come on.
Oh, and let’s all stop calling them day 2s. They’re dates. Calling them something different doesn’t actually make them different.
Savoy
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Savoy -
I'm on The Lounge and have benefited from tons of success based on taking a bootcampand a 1 on 1 this past year. I get into a lot of relationships now and I was hoping to get some advice on how to end relationships properly. Is there any way that one can retain value amongst her friends and end a relationship?Steven - january 30, 2007 2:15:00 PM PST
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hi
I wasn’t on the [Relationship Management] seminar, but would like to learn more about that theme, so I’m waiting for the book to come out.
But for now I have a question for you Savoy. How to dump or break up with a girl? This is bothering me for past few months in that is an area where I have a lot of problems and I make a lot of mistakes.
The thing is that pickup material is so powerful that when I want to break up with a girl they become all crazy. They won’t let me go, and eventually when they realize that I’m not joking, they start talking about what a jerk I am, that I’m using women only for sex., etc.
So, how can I dump her or break up with her? Smoothly? With no risk of bad rumors, etc.?
Thanks,
peter - January 29, 2007 7:26:00 AM PST
Dear Peter & Steven,
Great stuff! I love it when I get letters that show much the bootcamps help people get the social lives they always wanted.
The breakup should be appropriate to the relationship. If you are seeing her a couple of times a week, you need to break up in person. If you text once in a while and hook up once a month, not returning her next text message should do the trick. If your relationship has progressed beyond the point at which it is appropriate just to not return a call, then your breakup needs to be “live”. In person or on the phone. Be a man and take responsibility for your actions. Don’t do any of this “it’s not you; it’s me” nonsense. Tell her that you’ve moved on, and that you want to be honest with her.
She may hate you anyway for a while. Most of my exes did at first, and then within a couple of weeks, all but one became good friends. But it’s a woman’s prerogative to hate her ex-boyfriends, and if that makes her feel better, then that’s what she should do.
As for her friends – even if she doesn’t hate you, her friends probably will. They have to. That’s the job of her friends. If they’re your friends too, they might be more neutral, but don’t count on it. Don’t argue. Let them hate. They’ll get over it and you’ll all be friends later. Unless you led her on, or were deliberately careless with her feelings.
You can prepare the ground for breaking up with a “soft landing”. If you normally return her calls the next day, return them after two days, then three or more. Cancel plans. After a week or two of this, she should be psychologically more prepared for the breakup. If you’re just casually dating, she may just stop calling you after a couple weeks.
Now, I’d like to get into why you are breaking up with so many women. As you get good, remember that you are the chooser. Just because a woman is attractive and is interested in you doesn’t mean you have to pursue her. Date quality. Figure out what you want before you go looking for more women. You might be pleasantly surprised about what happens when you set your sights higher.
By having a more active “screening” frame, you will naturally attract higher-quality women. A woman wants to know that you have high standards – so high that she needs to be at her best to win your attention. Of course, these standards have to be congruent with how you present yourself. You can’t be the loser who only dates supermodels.
My guess is also that you are sending boyfriend signals during the Comfort phase, or immediately after you sleep with a woman. We covered how not to end up in the “boyfriend frame” for about an hour during the Relationship Management seminar so I’m sure some of the material will make it onto the upcoming DVDs. In general:
Don’t see her more than once a week unless you want to be her boyfriend
Make sure she knows that you are seeing other women if you are
Never show jealousy
And a final piece of advice from someone who lost most of his CD collection in college - Get all your stuff out of her apartment before you break up with her.
Savoy
Savoy ,
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
My question remains the same as from a few posts ago: Can you clarify on the use of European style ****y/Funny, BT-spiking game vs. The Mystery Method intrigue-styled game, and how to use the former within the framework of the latter, etc.
Anonymous - January 30, 2007 5:42:00 PM PST
Dear Anonymous,
It’s a false choice. The Mystery Method is associated with “intrigue” because Mystery himself uses a lot of intrigue-based game. But Mystery never meant for people to become “little Mysteries”. What we teach is “The Mystery Method if you’re not Mystery”. Every successful man’s game includes elements that could be used by other men and elements that are specific to one’s own identity, personality, and circumstances. Fortunately, the material on the DVD Video Archive was chosen because of its quality and universality.
What we’ve done is taken the elements of the Mystery Method that are broadly applicable and combined this with techniques that were invented by myself, Sinn, Future, and others that made the Method work for large numbers of people, regardless of background, as well as our students. We have to make it work. We put our name on the line every night of every workshop, and students like yourself are paying money to watch us and learn, and you expect to see successes.
Intrigue is just one tool that builds attraction (via curiosity and an implication of higher value) and presents yourself as a challenge. Being ****y and funny is a tool that builds attraction (via tension, humor, and a presumption of higher value) and presents yourself as a challenge. Both tools primarily work in the Attraction phase, and also have relevance to Comfort. There’s no dichotomy. You should be able to use both tools – and many others besides – to account for different types of women and different social situations. Eventually, you will gravitate to the attraction techniques that best fit your identity and personality.
By the way, there are way more attraction techniques available to you than just intrigue and ****y/funny. Chapter 5 of the Venusian Arts Handbook goes through some of these pretty extensively.
Savoy
