FR: sage's n00b @$$ goes for another solo adventure in the Windy City

[sageproduct]

So day game is becoming more and more a part of my everyday lifestyle, to the point where my approaches mostly come from when I'm out doing my normal thing instead of going out specifically to sarge.

Did some approaches yesterday, which I'll skip over for brevity. They all had boyfriends.

I had told myself to go out and sarge at night instead of staying in and playing video games. Bought a 3 day CTA pass, looked up some PUA info on where to go in Chicago because I HAVEN'T GOT A CLUE about the nightlife here.

Right before I leave, I start getting those nervous feelings. "It would be so nice and easy to just stay in, get my free pizza from Papa John's, and watch Nikita." "C'mon who goes out alone on Friday night?" Blah blah self-doubt anxiety blah. Luckily I don't succumb and leave my place nice and early around 9:30.

NOTE: Should I mention the names of the venues I went to or leave them out? I kind of want to just so anyone else who's familiar with Chicago can get a better idea yet feel like I shouldn't for confidentiality.

ANYWAY, I start with this club that some PUA guy said was his favorite on a Friday night. I arrive at 10. It's closed. Doh.

Check my phone for address of the place that the guy said was his 2nd favorite on a Friday night. I walk there, am at the exact location of the address, but don't see it.

Then I spot this other club that seems pretty lively. There's a short line of some fwcking sexy chicks. I get in line behind them. Should have opened.

The bouncer takes my ID away. FWCK. I don't even care about getting in at this point, I can always go somewhere else, but I need my fwcking ID back. I can't get in trouble for this sh1t. He doesn't give it back to me. I around the corner, tell this other guy I need my ID back. He says it'll cost me $40. I pay up, he gets my ID and tells me not to come back.

Obviously I'm not feeling great. I'm in that state where if someone talked to me, they would instantly know something's up. I walk over to McDonald's, go to the bathroom, look at myself in the mirror. Holy sh1t, my eyes are red and it looks like I'm about to cry. Wtf lol. I wipe my eyes off, get my sh1t together.

There's a sexy girl at McDonald's, I approach. Rejection, but now my head's back on straight.

In the next hour, I check out about 4 venues of different kinds. Nothing happens, but sage has found himself some nice new date spots/places for outings.

Around 11:40 I'm at this piano bar. I hadn't been to one before, it was pretty fwcking cool. I chill and enjoy the pianoman for a few mins, and this 40-something year old man and I get to talking. Hispanic guy, later reveals he's well into his 50's. He eventually tells me "Look son, I can get a good read on you. You've got thick eyebrows, small eyes, BIG intelligence. But your ears are too small. You don't LISTEN enough."

Fwcking profound. I'd totally talk to this guy for a longer while, but I came out for a reason. I shake his hand, pat him on the back, and excuse myself.

Wandering around the joint, everyone's in groups. Hang around a bit, then spot two 20-something ladies chilling on the windowsill talking to each other. I approach.

Me: You guys look cool! I had to meet you.

I'm holding up both my hands to give each of them a high five. It's a little awkward, but instead of backing away I commit until they high five me.

I chat with both of them for a few minutes, not a very substantial conversation. I was pretty cool and comfortable though, nothing weird really. One on right is giving me decent eye contact, one on left eventually starts losing interest in talking to me seemingly.

The man I was talking to earlier comes over and starts talking to the one who's losing interest. FWCK YES WINGMAN! Turns out they're all really good friends lol. He joins in, we all share some laughs, he validates me and makes me look cool/socially intelligent.

Piano man starts playing again, I turn away from the chicks momentarily to observe. Then I notice the less interested girl was doing something else, so that means I get to only talk to the one who might like me. I reopen her.

After a bit:

Me: Alright, I have to be totally honest, the real reason why I came over here was cuz you (point at one on right) were really cute, and I wanted to meet you
Girls: Hahaha
Me (just to the one on right now): You and I should hang out sometime. Like a date.
Right: I don't give out my number to strangers though!
Me: Ok fine. How about this. Uh...
Right: I'll take your number!
Me: Do you have Facebook?
Right: Why don't you give me your number?
Me: No. Because then, tomorrow you're going to think back and say, 'Man this asian guy I met last night was pretty cool. But I can't text him because I'm a lady and I'm not going to text a guy first!'
They laugh at this.
Left: Oh, she's the kind of girl who WILL text you.
Right: Yeah I will!
Me: Let's do this. (pull out phone) You can leave me your Facebook, then we'll talk through there.
Right: Do you really think I'm going to give you my first and last name if I won't even give you my number?
Me: Some people would, ya.
Right: Let me take your number.
Me: No
Right: Then what do you want??!

Eventually I give her my number.

Uhhhhhh. That's not a number close, that's a rejection.

No matter. It's 12 now, so I head to McDonald's and take my 20 minute nap to stay in line with my polyphasic sleep schedule.

Cutie texting by herself at McDonald's, I approach.

Me: You're absolutely adorable. I had to meet you.

We talk. She's not really interested. Her friends are calling her over. They seem to like me though, because they're nice to me and say "I'm REALLY SORRY for stealing her away from you. You can totally come with us though!!"

I can't, I have to take my nap. No loss though. The girl wasn't interested, and no matter how much value you seem to hold in a group of girls's eyes, it's only a matter of time before they get tired of you and move on.

After my nap, I walk a few blocks to another club that the PUA guy had recommended. No cover, get in right away, and it's SOLID. Good amount of people there, good crowd, plenty of chicks.

It takes me a while to warm up, but eventually I start opening. As the night goes on, I gain momentum and start approaching more and more as I defeat my AA more and more.

It's hard getting chicks who are in groups at a club. Conventional PUA wisdom is you open the group, not the girl. Fwcking hard to do when you can barely hear well enough to hear someone in a 1 on 1 conversation, let alone a whole group.

I'm getting better at this bit by bit. There were a few different interesting things, but I don't feel like going into them and this FR is long as fwck already.

Basically, every approach was like this - I'd go up to the girl, put my arms around her right away, turn her so we're face to face, then tell her that she's absolutely adorable, and I had to meet her. Out of 20, 30 approaches, only two, MAYBE THREE girls blew me out immediately.

Soooooo many girls had boyfriends ughhhhh. Or were from out of town. The ones who were the most receptive always did. Overall, I just tried to work kino by holding their hands, placing their arms on me if I could get away with it, brushing their hair if they let me, kissing them on the cheek, etc. I kissed several girls on the cheek, but every time when I followed up with "ok now on the lips" they would laugh and resist.

None of my interactions were very long. They'd either lose interest or get pulled away by their friends. I was very reliant on playful stuff like "Holy sh1t you're awesome let's get married." or "Wow you're so cute, you're gonna be my girlfriend for the next 5 minutes".

Sage went home alone empty-handed in the tangible sense, but he had gained much knowledge, both experience and practical logistical knowledge of his own backyard.

One girl turned out to be a lesbian with her girlfriend there. After approaching, I later caught them gently making out in the corner.

Another girl, the MOST receptive girl all night, holy sh1t...She was a third year medical student at a top ten medical school. Much respect, that's a fwcking difficult position to attain. Gorgeous with a cool, aloof kind of personality, and really sweet. She was the kind of girl who would kind of look down and be flattered in that shy way when I compliment her, ahhhh I love that sh1t. She was from out of town, with her friends for the weekend. I told her that I was going shopping tomorrow, and that she should come hang out with me and grab a cup of coffee when I was done. She said she was with people who she couldn't ditch though. Bummer. I knew there was no way I could pull her. Hugged many times, kissed her on the cheeks several times, tried to kiss her on the lips lol she didn't let me.

Back when I first started pickup, after lengthy strings of rejections occasionally I would get p1ssy and lament how I'm not a great-looking guy, and oh how easy is it for all those handsome naturals when they don't even try, while I'm over busting my @$$ getting nothing. I've finally cut that sh1t out though. I'm not fwcking going to let myself blame my looks for my failure, because I can't control them. If I'm blaming anything, it's my own GAME. I control my game. I work at my game, I improve my own game. The limitations of my game are my own limitations. Kill the resentment for the ones who won the lottery, I live in my own world, and my own reality.

 

[floydb25]

Hmmmmm... Doesnt sound too bad. Casual and light-heartedness is good for initial approaches, and you made some adjustments. One thing that sticks out, though, is your over-aggression. It sounds like you're scaring a lot of women away - by coming on too strong. There are many ways you can do this - not just by sharing your feelings, setting up a bazillion dates, talking too much, etc. If you go right in for the kill - by touching, grabbing, flirting, complimenting, calling them your girlfriend (even as a joke) - they're going to feel a lot of pressure, and bail. Especially when they have NO idea who you are.

You want women to invite you into their bubble, and flirt with / touch you, after you build some rapport - not you going in like Frankenstein, bulldozing your way through, touching everyone in your path, and talking about wedding chapels. You set 'em up, and she knocks 'em down. You're there; you're interested in getting to know them... They know this already - especially since you should have a flirtacious / charming vibe going on throughout. Once she shows interest back - THEN you go in for the kill.

But you dont want to verbalize your interest so much, or compliment them directly. That just makes them the prize, and gives them all the deciding power.

Never put a woman on the spot, either - to where she has to decide right then and there. It's not going to be in your favor. She hasnt even gotten any time to know you, and is going to think you're a huge player or man-*****.

It's better for them to not know, and try to figure **** out - than having it all in their face at once. This includes everything from your interest, to the approach, and how they perceive you. Just as they'll view you as a man-***** for coming on too strong physically and verbally - they'll view you as a desperate, insecure, virgin loser - if you're too shy, nervous, passive, afraid, etc. Neither extreme is effective, IME.

But the main thing is, you're coming on too strong, and not building enough rapport, or letting the women come on to you - after you approach and get the conversation going - with some imbedded witty / charming banter. You lead; she decides; you escalate. Its a give and take process. But you need to know their interest signals, or you'll blow a lot of chances. It all happens so suddenly, and you need to be on-point.

But it all comes with experience - just like any other skill.

Of course, there are other methods, and different ways of doing things. Some people do the direct approach, and whatever else. I find this way to work well - even back when I had no idea what was going on, and **** was just happening.

 

[sageproduct]

Thanks. I know I'm spewing out too much attraction material with hardly any comfort-building true substance in my interactions. For me, this is a good initial over-adjustment though.

This was probably my first night out where I had this free-roaming anonymous playground to just be overly aggressive and start feeling out the game.

Quick snapshot of what I (was) like in the usual social setting:

Sage sees girl he likes
Doesn't talk to her at all

OR

Sage somehow starts talking to girl he likes
Doesn't build ANY attraction
Doesn't kino at ALL
Conversation ONLY builds comfort and inevitably becomes boring since NO comfort-based conversation can be more interesting than the crazy sh1t going around everywhere at night
Girl gets bored, conversation ends

OR

This happened once.
(year and a half ago at a party)
Sage somehow gets to talking to girl
On off-chance, comfort-only conversation is actually really good as sage and girl connect on many things
Sage wants to build attraction but is too much of a pvssy to do anything
He only talks about "safe" topics
Sage is lucky, since he and the girl connect so well they talk for a whole hour and she still likes him
Sage is a pvssy and shows NO interest because he is too scared to
Girl has more balls than him and gets HIS number
Girl even sends him a text right away
Sage is so scared he doesn't even say bye to the girl when he leaves

 

[floydb25]

Ha ha... Thats how we all used to be, man. I mean, I was the WORST. But you gotta realize whats going on, and adjust accordingly. Because, you didnt fail because you were ugly, or did EVERYTHING wrong. So, you dont need to pull a complete 180, and become a ruthless caveman. You just needed to escalate, not be so shy and insecure, fearful of rejection, etc. Simple **** like this was holding you back - thats all.

But the chicks were MORE interested back then - than when you decided to start acting fake, being super aggressive, becoming a jokester, etc. Its just those negative traits that were holding you back, and in need of adjusting. A complete overhaul is unnecessary.

But I think a lot of this has to do with putting women and sex on a pedestal. Thinking that the only way to get laid is by approaching, pulling, and bedding on the first encounter. Like, it HAS to be done immediately... There is no other way. Or, there's a mystic force required, or only top-tier guys can do it, or they have superhuman powers and uncanny abilities... Just making things out to be WAY bigger than they are. Same as the nice guy mindset. They have to do this and that, and everything must be perfect, traditional, and in order.

All nonsense. Its a lot more simple than that. You just dont see it when you're failing and getting rejected, AND focusing all your emotional energy thinking about it... Thats what causes a lot of irrational beliefs. Some people just make things harder and more complicated than they have to be, and are too busy focusing on the negatives to see how simple and easy things really are. ****, they could have girls be all interested in sex, or them, and they STILL wont believe it. "It cant be this easy; this isnt how things are. I need this and that and do all these different things - THEN I can get a girlfriend, and have sex - in mystic fairytale land. Maybe some day...."

Ironically, all these fears and delusional beliefs (and complete overhaul that comes with it) just causes them to fail even more (and worse) than before - because things were never as bad or grandoise as they made them out to be IN THEIR HEAD.

They werent, for example, not getting laid because they didnt push for sex within .05 minutes, but because they never flirted, showed interest, or escalated. EVER. Big difference. Same as the FZ theory / fear... "Oh noes... Gotta run towards her at full-speed and launch myself on her from 5 feet away, or she might friend zones me's!!!"

Low self-esteem certainly has a lot to do with it, though... Believing you are unworthy and undeserving, and that other's (including women) are better than you, and requiring all this **** to get them. Or that all these mystic guys are pulling and getting laid by women left and right, and never getting rejected, or having to escalate and build rapport over time. It doesnt happen instantly, with random strangers, on the spot.

Thats why you might not see women leaving with guys at the bar, or whatever, but they surely built some rapport, exchanged numbers, are going to escalate further, etc. Thats how it works. Not, "hey"... "hey"... "sex"... "ok"...

But there's also societal and peer pressure, and their obsession with status and getting laid (and belittling / judging those who arent doing it), and placing women / sex / relationships on a pedestal. Eliminate all those things, and you wont have any pressure or fear, or overblown / irrational beliefs like this. You also wont try so hard, make getting laid the holy grail, worry about having girlfriends, etc. Its just another basic, NATURAL part of life. No big deal; no need to obsess, or blow things out of proportion, or change your entire being, or prove to yourself and others that you're "good enough", and all that crap.

 

[Demonpenz]

You my friend are an animal. Good work. Just have to tone it down bit. It is easier to tone it down a bit than be that dude who it takes a large effort to even walk up to ladies.

 

[Atom Smasher]

Ima tell my niece to look out for you. She's going to school out there.

 

[Trump]

You also wont try so hard, make getting laid the holy grail, worry about having girlfriends, etc. Its just another basic, NATURAL part of life. No big deal; no need to obsess, or blow things out of proportion, or change your entire being, or prove to yourself and others that you're "good enough", and all that crap.

Floyd awesome post as always, but it almost IS a big deal. Why? Because no one will help you out with getting laid, NO ONE. People will help with finances, work, health, moving, emotions, death, but when it comes to help getting laid or introducing someone, that's where they draw the line. People mock, laugh, judge, steal, ruin reptuations, all for the purpose of not helping with getting sex. I've had best friends, family members, relatives, and coworkers do it and they still do, albeit subtly. Same people will RUN if you need help on ANYTHING else, just don't ask for help on getting laid.

Nowadays having a wife or girlfriend, or getting laid on a consistent basis is alot more important than money or job you have, and the ones who have them make sure to flaunt it and put you down. I've had husbands fly across the Atlantic to beat me up because I've emailed their wives a friendly email, I've had people hire private detectives to make sure I wasn't going out with one of their coworkers, I've police at my door because I asked a girl out and she didn't like the color of my skin.

That's why guys here have so much trouble and get nervous, they know its every man for himself. It's rough out there.

 

[TillTheEndOfTime]

Cutie texting by herself at McDonald's, I approach.

Me: You're absolutely adorable. I had to meet you.

We talk. She's not really interested. Her friends are calling her over. They seem to like me though, because they're nice to me and say "I'm REALLY SORRY for stealing her away from you. You can totally come with us though!!"

If I said it once, I said it a million times. A girl out and texting alone is waiting for someone and purposely avoiding social interaction. She might as well be holding a sign that says "LEAVE ME ALONE". Stop buying into this PU bullsh1t mentality to approach every girl you like and that maybe, with just the right "game", you will turn her into a social butterfly and she will want to jump you.

It ain't happening. Ever. Move on. Pick targets who are actually holding eye contact. At least there is a remote possibility they might want to be approached.

 

[TillTheEndOfTime]

Back when I first started pickup, after lengthy strings of rejections occasionally I would get p1ssy and lament how I'm not a great-looking guy, and oh how easy is it for all those handsome naturals when they don't even try, while I'm over busting my @$$ getting nothing. I've finally cut that sh1t out though. I'm not fwcking going to let myself blame my looks for my failure, because I can't control them. If I'm blaming anything, it's my own GAME. I control my game. I work at my game, I improve my own game. The limitations of my game are my own limitations. Kill the resentment for the ones who won the lottery, I live in my own world, and my own reality.

You're using a stone age approach to meeting women. Do you drive around in a Fred Flintstone car too?

Look, you think a handsome guy can go to a club and pull without trying? Delusional thinking. I know tall good looking guys who can't get ANY action at a club (okay, maybe a ONS 1 out of 20 times). But that is terrible efficiency.

Stop going to clubs alone. You're going to spend years going to club after club. I know a couple of guys who have done so for over a year and have NOTHING to show for it. You're going to grow into an old lonely man with no friends and no prospects.

Girls don't go to clubs to meet men. I thought that getting reject 100 times with similar stories "sorry, I have a boyfriend" and sorry "I can't leave my friends" would drive that through your thick skull. Apparently not. You think that your "game" is the issue? PUA brainwashing nonsense. Have you spent hundreds or thousands of dollars on PUA material and seminars? I hope not.

No amount of "game" is going to reprogram the state of our society in modern times. We have the internet EVERYWHERE. We have smartphones. We have Facebook. You can keep in touch with the friend you met when you were 7 years old at the click of a button. Social circles are solidified by high school or early college and maintained on Facebook, Twitter, etc.

By the time people are clubbing in their 20's, they made 90% of the friends that they will EVER make. EVER. Every single person they will talk to till the day they die and are buried 6 feet under has been determined to about 90%. What does this mean? People stop socializing by the age of 24 when they go out. Especially women. Their social circle of male friends who hope to one day get in their pants is determined and gives them the option for a relationship or sex at the drop of a hat. They don't need to go to a club for that anymore. Most women born after 1970 never have to.

What I am trying to say is that you need to use a MODERN approach to meeting women. Stop using the approach that your FATHER used 40 years ago. Do you still have a Pentium 90 at home bro? You need to link into social media to find events in your area. There are websites dedicated to activities of interest. People also set up mob events on Facebook. Those are people who want to socialize and meet other people. Nobody goes out randomly to socialize anymore.

Work on expanding your network of friends. Most people meet their girlfriends and wives through their own social circle. Making more friends, women AND men will only increase your chances of striking hot with a girl of interest. Quit the tunnel-vision bro. Stop focusing on trolling nightclubs alone. And quit focusing on only meeting girls. That might have worked for your father in the 70's, but it's not a good strategy today.

 

[floydb25]

Trump: agreed, and I have tons of stories similar to yours. People will also ****block, plant seeds of doubt in your head, sabotage, disbelieve your successes, and the whole nine. Especially if women are approaching you, flirting with you, checking you out, etc, and they see this happening. The ego-competition is in full force, then, and they WILL tear you down for it. "Oh, you're ugly; she's out of your league", etc - even if that is not at all the case, and everything they are saying is the exact opposite of what's actually going on - and what SHE'S saying. Or, if you fail over time - they'll be the first to boast / brag and lament about it. In many instances, they're just WAITING for you to fail, and will do many things to ensure that you do.

Deep down, though, they're just really insecure about themselves. If you spend enough time with them, and follow what's going on - this becomes clear as day. Not that they won't deny it, and say you're just an ugly loser - because they can't attract what you are, dont have the balls to approach, arent socially likeable, etc. Or because their girl likes you - which they arent oblivious to. They see only what they want to see, and believe what they want to believe - as it suits their ego. There's also a LOT of competition behind all these behaviors.

I partially disagree with the not helping getting laid part, to an extent. They might SAY they want to help, but they'll be the first ones to sabotage, and keep you where you are. They dont really, genuinely want to help, or see you succeed. Their actions definitely SHOW this. They love the fact that you ARENT succeeding, and that they can bring you down for it - and want to keep it that way. You'll find a lot of criticism and belittling and snidey remarks in their pleas to "help", and they won't be bringing you up - because they DONT want to see you succeed. They even get off on the fact that you are failing, and can be put in a position where they can SAY they're trying to help. They ain't trying to help ****.

I've experienced a lot of this back in the day. All my fake friends, co-workers, and acquaintances did was compete, tear me down, sabotage, ****block, destroy my self-esteem, try to make me look bad, etc when it came to women. Whether women were approaching, or I was sharing success stories, or even failures and rejections... The story was ALWAYS the same. Nothing was positive, inspiring, uplifting, or supportive when it came to women. It was always the opposite. And I sabotaged a lot of potential successes by believing this ****, and dwelling on their negativity towards me.

In contrast, everything they said about themselves was always positive and boastful - in the same damn context. IE, "Oh, you're ugly; that's why you failed... But I would've had her; easily" - when they saw the girl approach, flirt, etc, and they didnt get jack ****, because she was never interested in them. True story, btw. The *******s were even there the whole time, watching from a distance - then went on to brag and degrade as we drove home. The real reason I failed was because I came on way too strong, and practically dry humped her as we were playing pool (which she invited me to, after approaching, and was all smiles throughout... which they saw). Lots of stories similar to this - with so-called friends.

This is why I prefer to fly solo, and not tell people ****, or really have any close friends. When it comes to women, men view you as competition - friends or otherwise - and won't be supportive or helpful - even in the sense of emotional support. You're not going to get it from them, or any kind of positive energy. You're only going to end up feeling worse.

None of this matters how you are, either. I used to HELP people approach, get girlfriends, saved their marriages, provided emotional support, etc - and they'd STILL turn around and do this ****. The same damn people. Some were best friends. It was even worse when the girls that I helped those *******s get with would talk to me later on - even if casually. But they always acted like it was cool - so as to not share any weakness, jealousy, or insecurity in front of them. Simply unbelievable how fake a lot of people can be.

ALL of my successes came from 1 on 1 encounters, in places where I didnt know many people. Its actually a curse to be well-known by everybody when you're trying to get women, because if they know any weaknesses, they'll be the first ones to spout off at the mouth - right in front of them - to make you look bad, and sabotage your intentions. Or just compete with you in general. And definitely dont be bringing girls around your "friends".

So, you're right that it's ruthless; friends will backstab you over women; and they're all competing over getting laid, and being the "best". Thats why you dont tell people ****, dont trust so easily, dont depend on others, and focus on yourself, and improving you, and succeeding alone, on your own terms.

By doing this, you also avoid all the pressure, wont be pushed around this way and that, being told what you are doing wrong by selfish, egotistical *******s, being defined by how people view you, wont feel like you NEED to get women to impress them, or prove your worth, etc. No matter what you do, or how much you succeed - nothing is going to change, either way. They're just going to keep on keeping on, like always, and helping you fail along the way. So, **** them.

 

[Demonpenz]

As a person who has put in serious time opening up girls, I feel it is my duty to help other guys get laid. I want to see most people succeed especially a smart hard working dude that hasn't had the time to really practice speaking to girls. When can help other people interact I feel great.

 

[floydb25]

Gotta disagree with Time... There are opportunites EVERYWHERE, and its better to be in physical proximity - than **** around with AWs on Facebook, and ****. Most of that **** doesnt go anywhere. I never used online, and always did **** in person. Every encounter, ever, was in person. You get the vibes going, build rapport, share smiles, get connected, etc, right there. They dont build up this fantasy of who you are by chatting online. Approach; escalate; get number; date.

It's not the "stone age" way - its being real and upfront, outside, in the real world (though, lolz at the Flinstone remark :crackup. This very much still exists, and most people meet up through random encounters. You go out, you talk to people, you flirt, you have fun, you meet them again, etc. All in reality. Could be at a club, a library, a store, a business, a fair, a park, a gym, a restaurant; a cashier, a waiter, a desk person, someone who's just standing outside, or walking their dog... People are everywhere. Just gotta talk to them, and get acquainted. You might not even "approach", or just bump into them again, and find that they are very receptive this time - even excited to see you again; flirting and ****. Even if you were just making small talk.

Not just going to the alternate online universe... This isn't The Matrix, or Demolition Man.

And, its not hard to pull at clubs. Thats where I was probably most successful, and the women approached without hesitation. I also went solo - away from my friends (they were usually playing pool)... Chicks LOVE to dance, and if interested, will flirt, ask for your number, call, set up dates, etc. They're very aggressive at clubs. Of course, they're also crazy, and have more baggage than an airport.

I recommend avoiding clubs and bars - not because its hard to get women - but because they're INSANE and useless. Bottom-feeders... Very dysfunctional... Parasitic... And HUGE *****s.

 

[foreverAFC]

all of this guys posts reek of desperation, there is such a thing as trying too hard, i think you need to step back and work on yourself for a while, i think you would be better off spending your time and energy hitting the gym or doing a martial art instead of constantly wandering the streets aimlessly looking for some pssy

 

[sageproduct]

Woah. Thanks for all the long replies guys, seriously, I appreciate it.

You my friend are an animal. Good work. Just have to tone it down bit. It is easier to tone it down a bit than be that dude who it takes a large effort to even walk up to ladies.

Thanks man. I've found that there's only one way for the AFC to improve, and that is to approach, approach, approach. Of course, work on yourself at the same time, but your game itself will not progress if you don't approach (or at least socialize). (at least for AFCs)

Ima tell my niece to look out for you. She's going to school out there.

Sage: Do you have a boyfriend?
Niece: No, but I have an uncle. He's Atom Smasher, and I know all about your virgin a$$ sageproduct!
Sage: NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

And now on to the main discussion.

RE: People (not) helping you get laid

IME, people resent anyone who is in the same scene as them yet is trying to move up. It's only natural. A guy on a sports team who obviously wants to be captain. A girl in student government who is obviously trying to become president. And of course, a guy in your social group who is trying to improve himself socially and become "cooler". Change is uncomfortable.

The longer I've been into pickup, the more comfortable I've become with sharing this aspect of my life with other people. Some are encouraging, others are not. Funny thing is, the people who have been the most encouraging are my FEMALE friends. The guys are more likely to say things like "you're wasting your time dude" or "and how much have you gotten laid from doing this? none ok cool bro"

Re: Bars/clubs

I'm usually the first to say I don't like the night scene, and I don't like the crop of girls there (generally).

Is it possible, improbable, or impossible for a guy like me to pull from the night scene? Who knows. I try though because it's undeniable the chance I have to grow myself from doing this. There's stuff I can work on and get out of it that I can't with day game, my preferred game. Quick escalation, heavier attraction stuff, high volume of approaches, and just general perspective on the social scene.

It's funny, when I first got into pickup by daygaming, my mindset was this: "There's no way a good girl I'd actually want to date would go out with me after just meeting me randomly. I don't expect to get anything out of this, I'm only doing this to make my game good enough to where I can attract girls who are a part of my everyday life."

Then when I actually started getting some dates, my mindset shifted. Daygame became my new ideal way of meeting a girl, not through class, work, friends, whatever.

Kind of funny how my mindset with the night game now has some parallels: "It'll be very rare that I find someone I actually like in the night scene, but the sheer volume of approaches and socializing I'll be doing will just make me that much better at socializing so that I'll be better at daygaming and social circles".

You're using a stone age approach to meeting women. Do you drive around in a Fred Flintstone car too?

Lol. Actually, I think game in the stone age was purely social circle-based. Our hunter-gatherer Don Juans had to be born/raised to be so in their bands of roughly 30 people. The stone age AFC would have no opportunity to go to the gym, get a degree, and sarge at the mall

A girl out and texting alone is waiting for someone and purposely avoiding social interaction. She might as well be holding a sign that says "LEAVE ME ALONE". Stop buying into this PU bullsh1t mentality to approach every girl you like and that maybe, with just the right "game", you will turn her into a social butterfly and she will want to jump you.

This, I really, really have to outright disagree with. A girl out and texting is bored/awkward and is waiting for something exciting to happen. They will most likely be resistant at first, but all you gotta do is get her mood up. I remember times in my life when I've been out and in an anti-social mood, and at times all it took was just one person to break down my walls and get me going. It doesn't matter what the girl is doing when you approach her. Of all the girls I've cold approached who went on dates with me, here's what they were doing when I approached:
-at her job at a clothing store
-on her computer, working on her homework at starbucks (lolololol)
-sitting w/two friends, guy and girl, at a table at the bar
-sitting alone at the train station on the phone
-also at her job at a clothing store, was in fact TRAINING another employee and i blatantly interrupted their conversation

And that's me, lifelong AFC who has been doing pickup for less than a year. I think I can do better.

Anyway, I do want to get some social circle game in. When school starts again in a week I'm going to be really social in my classes. Don't have time for student orgs unfortunately. I'll try to go to parties and stuff when I get invited, but that sh1t takes time to get to a level where I can really benefit from it. Until then...



Someone on this board, I think it was bukowski actually, once posted a LONG time ago that he never shares his sexual exploits w/men who don't get sex, because all it does is build up resentment in a male-male relationship when one guy gets laid and the other doesn't. Never forgot that lol.

 

[Plutoman]

All I can think is - you would have benefited from the trip I took last night with Demonpenz.

All you can do is keep at it - it'll come. Every success story is marked by many failures along the way. My first thoughts are that you are pushing each individual interaction too far, too fast - need to relax and just be a social guy, not focusing on the outcome with each interaction.

 

[foreverAFC]

sounds like you are more interested in being a pickup artist than actually improving yourself as a person, have fun wandering the steets desperately looking for pssy night after night

 

[Demonpenz]

sounds like you are more interested in being a pickup artist than actually improving yourself as a person, have fun wandering the steets desperately looking for pssy night after night

If it gives me a good feeling of doing it and putting in effort writing about it good for him. If the results aren't there he can tweak them, but the important thing is you get those feet moving towards the girl/gym/school/work day in and day out.

 

[floydb25]

I'm with Sage. Girls are ALWAYS texting, because they get bored easily, and dont want to look like losers in public. Same reason they usually go out with at least one person - even if its a female friend, or a family member (of appropriate age). Same reason they claim to not be sluts. Same reason they seek approval from EVERYBODY when they date someone. Same reason they're always dating someone, in general. Social acceptance is huge to them, and they're horribly insecure about this.

Its rare to find a girl who's NOT texting, or talking to a friend - at least, outside of a business environment (which is a great way to pick-up - if the signs are there, and its not just a stroll-by conversation, or them acting "nice" for the customer).

This doesnt mean they're "too busy", or are dating someone they like (if anybody at all), arent just texting any random Shmoe, arent open for opportunity, etc. If they like something they see, or are otherwise open to opportunity, they'll be putting that phone down, and focusing on you. Even if their friend is there... Their focus will be on you instead - IF they like you.

I never really "opened up" (I hate PUA lingo) a group, or anything like that. Not even into the PUA "mastery"... That stuff comes off as way too fake. Just making basic conversation, and feeling the vibes from there. Usually, if its just one friend (which is usually the case) - the friend will just stand aside, and grin / smile - as you're talking to the other one. That's assuming they "approve", arent catty, competitive, two-faced *****es, etc. But those types tend to be alone, since everyone is their "competition", and they have no female friends - just a swarm of guys everywhere. Easy to spot and avoid.

RE RE: Getting laid. Yes, exactly. MEN arent going to help you for **** - which is what we were talking about. They're just going to say you're ugly, your standards are too high, nobody is looking at you, she's just looking for attention, you're wasting your time, you're never going to get a girl... Anything to tear you down - while simultaneously bringing themselves UP in comparison. Its all just one big ego-based competition to them, and they can be ruthless in their attacks. Pure hate.

But if you share successes - they're going to say "nobody cares", "not interested", or look for any signs of weakness or rejection to tear you down. Or just planting seeds of failure, such as "Did she tell you just wants to be friends yet?", "I dont see why she chose you", "She's not that interested", "She's out of your league", "She likes that other guy more", etc, etc. But again, they'll be bringing themselves UP in comparison. None of this applies to them, of course - only you. They're so sexy; they can get any girl they want; blah blah bull****. Then, they get ANGRY and start the bullying tactics if they find out they dont know ****, and arent "better" than you.

Men are only "loyal" - even immensely so - until it comes to women. Then, they practically turn against you. Even beyond the back-stabbing, ****-blocking, sabotaging, and fail-mongering... If you start spending more time with the women, or are out dating and having fun. They'll say "bro's before hoes", you dont spend enough time with them, you're *****-whipped, and all this ****. Reasonable enough, you'd think. But they are the FIRST ones to do the same ****, and even go out and get married - and tear you down for not having women - when they do - even if you helped the mother****er's get women in the first place. Not to mention all the sabotaging and **** that goes on. And they'll STILL tear you down if other women are checking you out, or you have nicer things than them.

It's like a never-ending competition - even if you dont give a ****, and arent trying to compete. They always want to be "better" than you at everything, have their hand in your life, keep you below them, and will gladly try to steal women from you, or get THEM to break up with you (Not that it ever worked... Ha ha, ****suckers).

**** them, man. The most successful guys I knew flew solo, and didnt spend a lot of time around the "bro's", or share their stories and be open to insults. At the time, I thought they were selfish, didn't care about us, didn't want to hang out, etc, but they were just really smart, and knew that the only way to be successful was to do it alone, and not have all these distractions and frenemies sabotaging their intentions. As well, that these other ****ers would just turn around and do the same **** - if given the opportunity.

And, I was always most successful when I was alone. Just didn't see it at the time, and wanted the safety of the "bro's " having my back, and hanging out in social environments to make things more fun and relaxed. Didnt help ****, the "bro's" just sabotaged to the best of their ability, and the girls werent into it. They always wanted 1 on 1 time, in private environments. Always. But I was also very insecure about being alone with a girl back then, and was totally against sex - even when they laid all the opportunities right out there.. "No, not sex! Please dont go there! Love and marriage and babies!" Ha ha... What a *****. :nono: