Did I call this one right?

[Mr. Me]

Edger, it seems to me that she showed interest for sure. But you kept doing the same thing over and over again, only to have the same results. Specifically, when I read your account of your interactions, you kept trying to get close body contact going.

I don't think you built any comfort in her first though. I think you sent the message that all you wanted was a dry hump/feel on the dance floor. It looks like she was hesitant, maybe it was because if that. Maybe it was because you were younger then she's used to. But whatever it was, building comfort may have gone a longer way. Why does close dancing with her body HAVE to be the goal when at the end of the day it's just about getting a number?

And I'd have to agree that "Wassup, are you enjoying the party/the band/the place?" is mundane and common, although it didn't particularly impact this incident. That's on par with "How you doin'?", "Are you from NY?" and "Nice weather we're having!"

 

[evesman]

I'm going to be blunt, but I hope you don't take it personally.

1. get rid of the ponytail. Ponytails have been out of style for at least 25 years. If they ever were in style. Which they weren't. Or shouldn't have been.

2. How many times have you used the term "attention hor?" If you FOCUS on something, it will become your reality. This is so obviously a self fulfilling prophecy, it's not even funny.

3. When you call women "hors," this is likely a reflection of your own feelings of low self esteem. If you were feeling GOOD about yourself, you would be feeling GOOD about others, and noticing what's positive about them.

4. It's really unbelievable how outcome dependent you are. Instead of wondering if she's attracted, just assume she is, and proceed from there. She's obviously playing push pull game with you, so she is clearly interested, if not strongly.

5. also, it's not the end of the world if this one woman isn't into you after all. If it doesn't work out, it doesn't mean she or other women are "attention hors." It just means that one girl on the planet wasn't feeling you. So what? Just move on.

Conclusion: forget about how one particular "sarge" ends up. Focus on developing your skillset. And before you do that, work on your inner game. That's your main challenge.

At my regular club hangout last night with my buddy, and spotted a very attractive MILF(in her 40's) across the other side of the room(extremely rare to see a MILF here), and said to myself, "I've gotta talk to this one, this one's f*ckin' hot". So she's on the dancefloor by herself, and I work my way up to her and cold-approach her with a, "How you doing? You liking the party?" She's like "Yes", but doesn't act interested. So I back away from her a little as I'm dancing, and gesture with my hand for her to come join me. She joins me. She ends up telling me she likes my pony-tail. "Oooh, pony-tail" she goes. I try to get in closer with her, with more body contact, but she doesn't reciprocate. I try to get the conversaton flowing, but it's like trying to pull teeth. I'm the only one initiating the conversation. So, I'm like, "f*ck this", and I back away and continue dancing by myself. So, I don't know, 5 minutes or so goes by, I'm dancing alone, and I feel a tap on my back. It's her. She reaches out to offer me a piece of gum. I'm like, "Ok, it's possible she's interested". So I work my way in to her as I'm dancing and proceed to get closer body to body contact. But again, no reciprocation on her part. Try to also get a conversation going, but again, feels like I'm f*ckin' pulling teeth, as I have to initiate everything. So, I'm thinking to myself, "seems like yet another attention wh*re". So I pull back and continue dancing on my own. So, a couple of minutes later, she's like "I'm going to the bathroom" or something like that, I couldn't hear her too good. I continue dancing in the same spot. A few minutes later, she comes back to the same spot. So I'm thinking, "Ok, she came back". Perhaps she's interested". But then again, I'm also thinking to myself, "What if this is all attention wh*ring?" So I work my way in again to try to get body to body contact, but again, no reciprocation on her part. A little small talk though, she asks me my name, we talk about the song that's playing, I joke with her a little, yada yada yada. So, I pull back again because she's not reciprocating in trying to get close to me with some body to body contact as we're dancing. About 5 minutes later, I take my hair out of a ponytail to fix it. She's dancing with her friend at this point. She see's me let my hair loose and immediately comes up to me and starts straddling my hair, "Oh I love your hair, yada, yada, yada". So, like an idiot again, I say to myself, "Let me start dancing with her again and work my way in close to her for some body to body contact. Again, no reciprocation(at this point, I'm thinking, "For sure, this woman is an attention wh*re". I felt she was one early on when she wasn't too receptive the second time, but said to myself, "What the f*ck, I'm just going to keep at it with her, I don't give a f*ck"). So anyhow, I pull back and just dance away by myself. She's dancing with her friend at this point. 5 or so minutes go by, and as she's passing me, she say's, "I'm leaving". I say "goodbye", and that's that.


Now, like I said, I suspected early on that she was an "attention wh*re", but who knows, maybe I'm looking into it too much, though I'm pretty sure I'm not. Keep in mind, this woman was making NO effort to have body to body contact with me as we danced, let alone dance with me in general. I just want some opinions anyway by the TRUE seasoned players. And please, we're all adults, so be constructive, and not an a**hole about it. I'm not here to argue with anyone.

 

[edger]

Hey edger, which club was this? Just curious.

Why, you wanna come and scope me out? "I wanna see who this guy Edger is". Lol, I'm just messin' with ya man. Look at your PM.

 

[edger]

1. get rid of the ponytail. Ponytails have been out of style for at least 25 years. If they ever were in style. Which they weren't. Or shouldn't have been.

You couldn't be more right, long hair on men has been "out" for quite a number of yrs...but like you even said too, was it really ever "in" to begin with? I would say no, at least not within the last 150 yrs or so, in which prior to that, most men kept their hair long, which is evidenced in history through portraits, paintings, etc. Me personally, I've always liked the look, I've always thought it looked "cool". I've always thought it gave a guy sex appeal(if it was taken care of and cared for of course). But that's my opinion of course. There are others out there who would disagree with me, and that's cool, it's what makes the world turn. We all have different things that float our boat.

Personally, I look at long hair on guys this way: eventhough it may not be the "trend" for men in 2009, I think it looks "cool" and gives a guy sex appeal. So, I say, as long as a style looks "cool", keep it, regardless of whether it's a current trend or not. The choice to not follow a trend, displays confidence, because you're doing your own thing, something that YOU wanna do, and could care less what any woman(or man) thinks. Like we always say here, you must live for yourself, not a woman. Do whay YOU wanna do, not what some dumb twit wants you to do. Secondly, from observation, I can tell you anyway, that MOST, not all of course, but MOST women, could care less what you look like. It's all about how smooth you are with them(your game), as well as other factors. So obviously my hair length doesn't matter much to them, regardless of what they might say(we all know women are notorious for saying one thing, then doing another). If these ugly and dorky guys can pull attractive women, then I'm pretty certain they could care less about my hair. If those guys can do it, then I sure as f*ck should be able to pull them too. You even said yourself in one of your recent threads, that a mans looks don't matter.

Out of curiosity, what exactly is it about long hair on men that you don't like? You said, "it shouldn't have ever been in style".

 

[evesman]

Personally, I've gotten many more compliments with a short haircut rather than with long hair. YMMV.

I agree, overall, you can still date quality girls regardless of looks. That's the big picture. But being good looking helps. This means proper grooming, and developing a sense of style that works for you.

In daygame, I don't think looks matter as much. But with nightgame, it takes on increasing importance. Take a quick glance at the makeup of clients in any bar or club at night. It is rarely 50/50. Often men outnumber women 3 or 4 to 1, or more. In these situations, it helps if you stand out in some way. And women will screen for looks.

So I would modify my earlier post and say looks don't matter, except in situations where you need a competitive edge. And when you encounter the typical sausage fest, being good looking helps.

 

[edger]

Personally, I've gotten many more compliments with a short haircut rather than with long hair. YMMV.

And I'll say that can be attributed to the fact that long hair on men isn't the trend at the moment. I would say it's somewhat human nature to have negative opinions on things that aren't "trendy", regardless if they look good or not. I personally can look past it though - if I see a girl wearing 'petal pushers' tomorrow, or has her hair teased out with a little hairspray, I'd still think she looks hot. Do you think the average person from the Middle Ages or 18th century Europe/America, would've had the same opinions that a lot of people today have of long hair on guys? No. If you spoke to someone living in the Middle Ages or 18th century Europe/America at the time, they would've been most likely to tell you that your long hair looked good.

Another good example...women who polished their nails "black" back in the 90's were considered "Gothic freaks". Now today, every trendy woman is sporting them and it's considered sexy. See what I mean, see how stupid it is?

 

[samspade]

1. get rid of the ponytail. Ponytails have been out of style for at least 25 years. If they ever were in style. Which they weren't. Or shouldn't have been.

edger...Wear your hair the way YOU want to wear it. Don't go by what's in style. Besides, you may have noticed that just about anything can be worn ironically in this era. Trust me, a woman will not pass you up on hair alone, and if she does, she's a waste of your time. You'll attract far more women if you're not worried over whether your hair will impress or disappoint (and I don't think you are, I'm just rebutting evesman's point).

In fact, a ponytail may even set you apart, since they are rare on men.

 

[dark god]

The more i hang around this site the more it baffles me.ok I worked in night clubs and strip clubs for years and u made a few mistakes:
1) Tryin to talk on a loud dance floor is weak sauce. If ur tryin to talk make it quick and to the point. "like hey wanna do a shot?" once u lured her away from the dance floor THEN run some game.If she doesnt wanna go then fvck her move on.
2)after the first time she gave u the cold shoulder u shouldve left. Stickin around makes her feel she has the uppper hand.
3) u kept pushing the body to body issue. After she denied u the first time why keep tryin? all shes thinking is that ur just another dude tryin to get cheap feels.
IMO I dont think shes an attention ***** its that u took the wrong appoarch.

 

[evesman]

Conforming is not stupid, it's an attempt to get people to like us, or to at least not dis like us.

Now, on this forum, the goal is to increase our attractiveness to women. Clearly, the things you are doing now are not effective. Yet you are reluctant to change, since to do so is to conform and hence act like other 'stupid' people.

For whatever reason, you continue to sabotage yourself with your negative cynical mindset.

And I'll say that can be attributed to the fact that long hair on men isn't the trend at the moment. I would say it's somewhat human nature to have negative opinions on things that aren't "trendy", regardless if they look good or not. I personally can look past it though - if I see a girl wearing 'petal pushers' tomorrow, or has her hair teased out with a little hairspray, I'd still think she looks hot. Do you think the average person from the Middle Ages or 18th century Europe/America, would've had the same opinions that a lot of people today have of long hair on guys? No. If you spoke to someone living in the Middle Ages or 18th century Europe/America at the time, they would've been most likely to tell you that your long hair looked good.

Another good example...women who polished their nails "black" back in the 90's were considered "Gothic freaks". Now today, every trendy woman is sporting them and it's considered sexy. See what I mean, see how stupid it is?

 

[edger]

Clearly, the things you are doing now are not effective. Yet you are reluctant to change, since to do so is to conform and hence act like other 'stupid' people.

For whatever reason, you continue to sabotage yourself with your negative cynical mindset.

Who said me not picking-up has anything to do with hair length? Anyhow, this woman mentioned twice how she "liked" my hair, and even started groping it.

 

[guru1000]

Edgar, half your problem is in the company you keep. I can bet you have a circle of friends that play in bands with long hair and dress like degenerates.

A little tough love is what you need.

- Cut the pony tail. Shave and present yourself clean cut.
- New wardrobe- Jeans and a button down shirt when you go out
- Grab a circle of friends that complement the "A" lifestyle

Edgar, I have never seen you but know exactly how you look.

Time for a change or you will end up with a gothic girl with a hundred nose piercings

 

[edger]

Edgar, half your problem is in the company you keep. I can bet you have a circle of friends that play in bands with long hair and dress like degenerates.

A little tough love is what you need.

- Cut the pony tail. Shave and present yourself clean cut.
- New wardrobe- Jeans and a button down shirt when you go out
- Grab a circle of friends that complement the "A" lifestyle

Edgar, I have never seen you but know exactly how you look.

Time for a change or you will end up with a gothic girl with a hundred nose piercings

Whoa whoa whoa, don't get too ahead of yourself there.

First, actually, none of the people I currently hang out with have long hair. Not one. And the ones that I used to hang out with, had a good wardrobe going like me.

Second, I have no facial hair. What are you talking about? Where you getting that I have "facial" hair? Lol.

I love how you can paint such a precise picture of me without ever having seen me. "Edgar, I have never seen you but know exactly how you look". That's funny. You wanna know what I look like, ask Mr. Me. He's seen me. Tell him Mr. Me. Or better yet, ask DJ Kid or Lord Shinra who are also members of this forum.

By the way, what's your definition of "degenerate" dressing? I'm curious. If you're thinking I wear ripped, acid-washed jeans with high tops and a band tee-shirt, you are so far off. Nothing like Wayne and Garth from 'Waynesworld' if that's what you're thinking. My particular wardrobe consists of Dr. Marten boots or shoes, tight black jeans, and flashy black tops. Both ears are pierced with silver hoop earings(one in each ear), I wear a thin silver piece of jewelry around my neck, complimented with sunglasses hanging from my necklace. I'll wear a black leather jacket in the winter. I'll show you a pic. of who I look similar to, if I can find one.

Also, have you ever gone to a goth club? Have you ever really, really seen gothic women? I can promise you, you'd jizz your pants if you were to see some of these goth women. Talk about corsets, lingerie, garter belts, sexy fishnet stockings, nice make-up, nice hair, heels, etc., etc., etc. All in an elegant style, just hot, real hot. Go see for yourself if you don't believe me. Go to the next fetish ball or major goth event in Manhattan. You'll see EXACTLY what I'm talking about and will never look at gothic women the same again, I can promise you.

 

[guru1000]

My particular wardrobe consists of Dr. Marten boots or shoes, tight black jeans, and flashy black tops. Both ears are pierced with silver hoop earings(one in each ear), I wear a thin silver piece of jewelry around my neck, complimented with sunglasses hanging from my necklace.

Also, have you ever gone to a goth club? Have you ever really, really seen gothic women? I can promise you, you'd jizz your pants if you were to see some of these goth women. Talk about corsets, lingerie, garter belts, sexy fishnet stockings, nice make-up, nice hair, heels, etc., etc., etc. All in an elegant style, just hot, real hot.

I rest my case.

 

[evesman]

Edger, reading this thread is becoming increasingly painful. You really need a gameplan. There's a link to the bootcamp for mature men at the top of this page. You can very easily obtain information on MM or Style's variation on it with a 5 second search on amazon. You can easily obtain information on direct game by visiting websites for charismaarts or badboy.

But you need a plan of some kind. Right now, you're flailing around with no direction. Good luck.

 

[dark god]

Why is everybody fixated on the ponytail long hair thing? I know plenty of dudes with hair to their shoulders that get azz. It all depends on what type of club or scene that ur going to. EXAMPLE: Im am shaved head,tatooed up muscle head looking type guy Im not goin to score that many chicks if i go out of my element like if i went to a goth club or rave scene.

 

[decades]

edger would do ten times better with chicks if he cleaned up his act and sharpened up his presentation.

 

[edger]

edger would do ten times better with chicks if he cleaned up his act and sharpened up his presentation.

Again, if these ugly and dorky guys can pull attractive women, then I'm pretty certain they could care less about my hair or my wardrobe stye. Furthermore, I see lots and lots of longhaired guys just like me pulling in some fine women. I see this when I go to shows or at the clubs/bars. Most of the time I see a fellow longhair and he's with a chick, in the majority of cases, she's hot.

 

[edger]

Why is everybody fixated on the ponytail long hair thing?

Cause these guys obviously have some deep rooted issues with long hair on men and don't know how else to explain my situation, so they latch on to the hair excuse. Little do they know, lots of these longhaired guys(except me at the moment) are pulling in some fine sexy women. I see it all the time. I'm being completely honest here. If any of you doubt me, just go to a place or show/concert where longhaired guys frequent, for your own curiousity. Really, do that.

 

[edger]

I rest my case.

You had a case?

 

[samspade]

You guys sound like a bunch of women, ripping on edger's hair. Presentation is important, but if you honestly think a man's hair style is the key to whether he's pulling women, you better go back to the home page and start over. Two fundamental precepts that you should have learned on this site a long time ago are 1) confidence matters far more than appearance, and 2) be your own man.

I've seen guys with crazier and worse styles than the pony tail get plenty of a$$. Guys with no hair at all, for that matter. Not to mention fat guys, ugly guys, and smelly guys. The pony tail is a non-factor.