17% of Women are Addicted to Porn

Bible_Belt

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http://www.guardian.co.uk/culture/2011/apr/07/women-addicted-internet-pornography

Why more and more women are using pornography

Increasing numbers of women admit to being hooked on internet porn. Why is this happening, and where are they finding help?

Thursday 7 April 2011
by Tanith Carey

It was an ordinary weekday morning when Caroline first noticed how much pornography was taking over her life. With 15 minutes to go before she was due to leave for a job interview, she opened up her laptop to print off an extra copy of her CV and there, onscreen, was a grab she'd saved from pornhub.com.

"I remember the feeling of being sucked in, really wanting that two-minute fix, that numbness I got when I used porn," says Caroline. "I was stressed out, and I risked being late for my interview, but I pressed play anyway and fast-forwarded it to the bit I wanted. It took two minutes." But the relief was to be short-lived. "Afterwards I just hated myself for giving in and getting off on images that treated women like pieces of meat. But I kept going back."

Although there is much debate about whether "porn addiction" even exists, Caroline, a 21-year-old English graduate, has just finished seeing a sex addiction therapist to help get her porn habit under control. Having started watching porn out of curiosity when it became available over the internet in her mid-teens, she and her mates used it as a graphic form of sex education. She saw nothing wrong with it, particularly as she was raised in a generation of girls for whom it was seen as hip and liberated to enjoy watching sex.

Then, as she entered a depressed job market after university, it became a form of escape, a default she turned to whenever she felt anxious or bored. "I'd be stuck at home in front of my laptop on my own all day. I'd wake up with all these ideas for the day – and end up surfing for porn, trying to distract myself, eating and then going back for more porn. No one would ever have known. But I didn't get much done. It was like a constant battle between my sexual urges and my self-control. I'd think to myself: 'It's not doing any harm.' But then I started to loathe myself for giving in and wasting so much time on it."

Caroline is not alone. While it's accepted that women are watching – and enjoying – porn more and more, it's less recognised that some are also finding it hard to stop. At Quit Porn Addiction, the UK's main porn counselling service, almost one in three clients are women struggling with their own porn use, says founder and counsellor Jason Dean. Two years ago, there were none.While more than six out of 10 women say they view web porn, one study in 2006 by the Internet Filter Review found that 17% of women describe themselves as "addicted".

Dean says: "I remember getting my first woman contacts about two years ago and thinking that was fairly unusual. Now I'm hearing from about 70 women a year who are coming for their own reasons, not because their male partners have a problem."

There is little difference in the way the genders become hooked, says Jason. There is the same pattern of exposure, addiction, and desensitisation to increasingly hardcore images. The main contrast between male and female porn addicts is how much more guilty women feel. "Porn addiction is seen as a man's problem – and therefore not acceptable for women," says Dean. "There's a real sense among women that it's bad, dirty, wrong and they're often unable to get beyond that."

Orgasm releases a dopamine-oxytocin high that has been compared to a heroin hit, and many regular users of internet porn report experiencing an almost trance-like effect that not only makes them feel oblivious to the world, but also gives them a sense of power that they don't have in real life. "The PC becomes an erogenous zone. The more you keep trying to put porn out of your mind, the more it keeps popping back in. The brain then learns that porn is the only way to cope with anxiety."

Yet, what strikes you on the porn addiction websites is the real sense of despair and loneliness for the women who get caught up in it – and how early it starts. Many talk of a problem dating back to their early teens, before they've even had a relationship.

One 19-year-old college student writes: "It started seriously when I was about 14, I stumbled across some pictures while doing homework. Because all I had typed into Google was 'cream and sugar', I knew my parents wouldn't notice. I learnt all the ways round the parental controls, meticulously deleted my activities on the history and deleted the search engine entries every time."

Psychotherapist Phillip Hodson, of the British Association of Counselling and Psychotherapy, says that in consulting rooms, the issue of woman habitually using porn "is something that has not been aired before. It's something new that's just beginning to surface . . . Traditionally women's voices have been against porn. It's seen as more of a male thing, because it's men who are supposed to be visually stimulated. But that doesn't mean that women aren't. Men are just maybe more so."

Women who become regular users can suffer depression and low self-esteem because it can be hard to reconcile their enjoyment of porn with their intellectual dislike of seeing women used as sex objects. "Porn has an instant effect on the human body and mind and the psyche, even if you disapprove of what you are seeing . . . So women may find their body is saying yes, even though their mind may be saying no – and that can be upsetting."

But as porn becomes more pervasive, Hodson observes that women are now also using it as a quick way to have sex without emotional investment, just as men traditionally have. "For women, just as for men, the internet is able to satisfy that need in rather a raw, crude sense, quickly and easily. Why serenade someone and go through all the courtship rituals with another person when you have Google?"

But it's important not to turn lone use of porn into a catastrophe, adds Hodson. For many women, it's a phase that will pass – either because they take stock, they realise it's becoming a problem, it becomes boring – or their life fills up again with better alternatives.

"I have a problem with the word addiction," he says. "Sex is a very natural function – and what is an abnormal level of sex to have or to want? If a woman is taking two minutes to orgasm to porn, and she's doing it, say, 10 times a day, that's still only 20 minutes a day.

"But if porn does become a habit that interferes in other areas, it might be an opportunity to take stock and realise there's not enough happening in your life. Forgive yourself for being tempted and having a few orgasms. If it goes beyond that, there are people outside who can help."

The first support group in the US run for women by women was founded by Crystal Renaud, who also wrote a new book on women's addiction to porn, called Dirty Girls Come Clean.

A committed Christian, she first came across porn at the age of 11 in a magazine that belonged to her brother, and was addicted for eight years before she got her wake-up call when she arranged an anonymous hook-up with a man she met over the net. Renaud recalls: "I had no friends. No passions. I had one mission and purpose in my life: pornography. Any way I could find it, I would. It didn't matter where I was or what I was doing. Home, school, my friend's houses, summer camp and yes, even church: my addiction came too.

"Porn. Masturbation. Cybersex. Webcam sex. Phone sex. Anything you could think up, I watched, experienced and enjoyed. No matter how many times I said I would stop, I would just keep doing it."

As a trained counsellor, Renaud now calls women's addiction to pornography "widespread and silent". In almost every case, the women she meets believe they are the only ones ever to have struggled with the issue. "Porn and sexual addiction has always been referred to as a man's problem," says Renaud. "But for women it's an unspoken struggle. We have to give them the opportunity to say: 'Me too.'"
 

Kerpal

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Since most women can get laid whenever they want, I have the feeling most of these women are very unattractive and have no options that they'd prefer to porn. If the only people you can get with are unattractive, masturbation to porn is preferable. That's why I use it.
 

Strelok

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"I had no friends. No passions. I had one mission and purpose in my life: pornography.
Attractive girls no matter how b1tch they are,usually have many friends and a high amount of orbiters.
You can guess how this girl look like.

Women who become regular users can suffer depression and low self-esteem because it can be hard to reconcile their enjoyment of porn with their intellectual dislike of seeing women used as sex objects.
Yeah and masturbation makes you blind,yeah blind people are blind because they masturbate so much not because blinds in past have nothing to do so masturbates often thus creating the stereotype....

Yet, what strikes you on the porn addiction websites is the real sense of despair and loneliness for the women who get caught up in it – and how early it starts. Many talk of a problem dating back to their early teens, before they've even had a relationship.
Loneliness is the key word,no attention no orbiters that's what drive a woman crazy,having no guys asking you out or staring at for a woman is like hell,thats why women are not as accomodating as before,they don't need a man anymore for attention if 100 afcs comment their pictures on facebook.

But as porn becomes more pervasive, Hodson observes that women are now also using it as a quick way to have sex without emotional investment, just as men traditionally have. "For women, just as for men, the internet is able to satisfy that need in rather a raw, crude sense, quickly and easily. Why serenade someone and go through all the courtship rituals with another person when you have Google?"
Bvullsh1t here,any professional wanker would do any god damn serenate if convinced to have even a 1% of getting laid with the good looking girl.
People rely on porn cause they cannot get any or as Kerpal said what they can get is so bad that is not worth.


I mean why journalists and so called psycologists have to bvllsh1t people when it comes of certain topics instead of just being trutful?
I mean Kerpal in his two lines made much more sense than this professional bull****ters.

A question to the guys here,would you pay attention to porn if you had an easy laid with a goodlooking girl? would you if you get rejected from any cute ones?
The consume of porn end when someone gets what he really wants so he doesnt need a surrogate or a stress reliever anymore.
 

Kerpal

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Strelok said:
A question to the guys here,would you pay attention to porn if you had an easy laid with a goodlooking girl? would you if you get rejected from any cute ones?
The consume of porn end when someone gets what he really wants so he doesnt need a surrogate or a stress reliever anymore.
Yup. I'd much prefer ****ing a hot girl over masturbating to porn, who wouldn't? But for the vast majority of men who don't have that option, porn is a much better substitute than an unattractive woman. That's why so many men are "addicted" to porn.

BTW this also explains why so many more men are "addicted" to porn than women - women don't want sex nearly as much as men do, and can get it with an attractive partner much more easily.
 

Bible_Belt

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Your negative, self-hating attitudes are what is keeping you guys from getting laid. It's not your looks, and it's not your porn. It's all in your head.
 

backbreaker

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I'll throw something else in the pot

4 of the top 10 male actors are African American. I actually have a source on that but don't ask me beucase it's been a while since I saw it and I"m tired.

Anyway, There are two viable explinations for that.. actually three.

1. 4 out of 10 people who watch porn are african americdan, which woudl mean that basically black people are 4 times more likely to watch porn than white people or any other race, since there are only 12% african americans in america.

2. white guys just get off on watching white women getting pile drived lol. Not as lkely though you are never suprised

3. both white women and black men like interracial sex. when i watch porn, and while i don't make a habit out of it i have mjy moments, i generally view interracial (gangbang lol) porn. but, that does not explain why male black adult actors are so popular. The truth is, alot of white women who watch porn, lo;ve to watch black actors **** white women. I've seen it with my own two eyes.

Society is accecptable of interracial dating, but very few white women in general get to live out their "fantasy" so to speak. Lots of women gto around wondering and are attracted to men of different colors but never get to play out that fantasy in real life. Maybe she was expected to marry that (white) accountant she met in school and start a family but depe down in side she wants some black **** lol.

that's why i laugh at black men and hell Mexican and Asian men who get scared of talking to white women or any other type of woman that is not the4ir race. dog you are fulfilling fantasies lol! More than one woman I"ve dated have told me "i have never dated a black guy before.. but i've always wanted t" or " i just have not had the opportunity to (a good looking black man with his **** in order).

people watch porn, not to just watch people have sex, but to fulfill fantasy's. hel if i wanted to get laid i can get laid.. but my fiancee isn't going to come home get naked and blow and **** me and my 5 black friends (at least i hope not lol that would suck). my accountant isn't going to lock the door and toss my salad lol.
 

backbreaker

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I'll throw something else in the pot

4 of the top 10 male actors are African American. I actually have a source on that but don't ask me beucase it's been a while since I saw it and I"m tired.

Anyway, There are two viable explanations for that.. actually three.

1. 4 out of 10 people who watch porn are African American, which would mean that basically black people are 4 times more likely to watch porn than white people or any other race, since there are only 12% African Americans in America.

2. white guys just get off on watching white women getting pile drived lol. Not as likely though you are never surprised

3. both white women and black men like interracial sex. when i watch porn, and while i don't make a habit out of it i have my moments, i generally view interracial (gangbang lol) porn. but, that does not explain why male black adult actors are so popular. The truth is, alot of white women who watch porn, lo;ve to watch black actors **** white women. I've seen it with my own two eyes.

Society is acceptable of interracial dating, but very few white women in general get to live out their "fantasy" so to speak. Lots of women gto around wondering and are attracted to men of different colors but never get to play out that fantasy in real life. Maybe she was expected to marry that (white) accountant she met in school and start a family but deep down in side she wants some black **** lol.

that's why i laugh at black men and hell Mexican and Asian men who get scared of talking to white women or any other type of woman that is not the4ir race. dog you are fulfilling fantasies lol! More than one woman I"ve dated have told me "i have never dated a black guy before.. but i've always wanted t" or " i just have not had the opportunity to (a good looking black man with his **** in order).

people watch porn, not to just watch people have sex, but to fulfill fantasy's. hell if i wanted to get laid i can get laid.. but my fiancee isn't going to come home get naked and blow and **** me and my 5 black friends (at least i hope not lol that would suck). my accountant isn't going to lock the door and toss my salad lol.
 

Kerpal

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Bible_Belt said:
Your negative, self-hating attitudes are what is keeping you guys from getting laid. It's not your looks, and it's not your porn. It's all in your head.
I don't know what it is, but anything above a 6 just isn't attracted to me. Fat chicks LOVE me for some reason. I'm not the only one who notices this. It's actually become a joke among my group of friends.
 

Veridin

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backbreaker said:
3. both white women and black men like interracial sex. when i watch porn, and while i don't make a habit out of it i have mjy moments, i generally view interracial (gangbang lol) porn. but, that does not explain why male black adult actors are so popular. The truth is, alot of white women who watch porn, lo;ve to watch black actors **** white women. I've seen it with my own two eyes.
Who needs anything resembling statistics when you have anecdotal evidence. Now, I guess you have slept with some white woman (wouldn't be surprised if it was one of the typical fatties) and she tells you she likes to watch interracial porn with black men. Let me see, could that be why she slept with you? And that's a good indicator of the general population? Interracial porn with black men and white women is produced because black men buy it in spades, not because white women buy it, other than possibly a small niche.
 

Kerpal

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Another big reason so many black guys are in porn is that black men are generally of lower socioeconomic status. They don't have a lot of other options and don't have to worry about how appearing in porn will affect their careers.
 
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squirrels

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People...men and women...are "wired" to f**k.

As few as 5-10 years ago it was our god-given right to enjoy sexual contact for its own sake.

Now you have to do it THEIR way...marriage, or one of these garbage faux-marriages that people call "relationships", where a guy and girl move in together and play House. Anyone who doesn't is "dirty".

Unfortunately, the burden of doing things THEIR way is often more than most people want to put up with. People want to be free to choose how to live their lives.

But they still are wired to f**k.

So they turn to porn.

Porn is another consequence of people wanting to live their own lives, but still accepting at some level the social stigma that "sex is unclean" and that they haven't done enough for society to "be worthy" of what is really a fundamental human right...hell, a fundamental ANIMAL right.

It used to be just men who were subject to this...that's why this website was created, because you, as a man, were made to believe that you didn't DESERVE to get laid until you did so much to please society.

This is the garbage that THEY feed you until you start to believe it:

http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showpost.php?p=1797947&postcount=9

nismo-4 said:
Women have a huge advantage. They choose most of the time. Case and point; Women want these famous M's.

1. Mansion
2. Mercedes/ Maybach/ Maserati (No Mazda or Mitsubishi) :crackup:
3. Master's
4. Money
5. Muscles
6. Marijuana
7. Madness
8. Maybe Much Much More!

Having these M's gives you comparable choosing power.
See that? You need a mansion, a Mercedes, etc, etc before you have the RIGHT to get laid.

THEY don't want to see you fail. THEY want to see you succeed...but only enough that you can buy sh*t to impress women in the vain hope of getting laid. Meanwhile THEY profit by dangling sex as a carrot in front of you.

THEY know that THEY can't control your desire to f**k. But THEY can control when and where you do it by selling you on the idea that you NEED to do X or own Y before you have the RIGHT to have sex.

Like a Puritanical cult that insists that ONLY married couples can have sex, and then ONLY in missionary, through a hole in the sheets, for the purpose of having children. Only now the religion isn't some deity, it's the state, and it's advertising, and it's corporate bullsh!t. THEY are setting the standard on when and where and how and why you CAN and CAN'T have sex. And people accept it without question. THEY want you to have sex only when it benefits THEM. The Puritans wanted you to f**k and produce kids to tend the crops. Modern society wants you to f**k only after you've proved your worth to THEM by buying enough crap and giving enough time and money to THEM.

The aims are different...the brainwashing is the same.

Women used to be immune to this because they didn't know any better...they were largely ignored. Feminism changed ALL of that...suddenly women were thinking for themselves, working for themselves, and yes, even F**KING for themselves. Women used to be kept in check by a social convention of inferiority. When they suddenly discovered their sexual power and started exercising their animal right to f**k, it gave the men an outlet, a way to get sex besides marriage and economic servitude.

THEY can't have that, it undermines everything THEY have built this sham of a world upon. But THEY can't control women any more. So THEY have to resort to the same tactics with women as they did with men...brainwash them to think that women don't DESERVE sex unless they EARN it, by slaving at jobs to buy sh!t. Buy the nice house, the family car, the furniture...then maybe, MAYBE you've earned the right to f**K so you can put a baby in it, who can grow up to be another goddam consumer of crap that society continues to generate artificial demand for.

Women HATE these demands on them as much as men do. But they still have to f**k. So what do they do? They turn to PORN.

PORN doesn't judge anyone. It's still everyone's right to jack/jill off, and you don't have to marry or shack up with someone and commit the greater part of your life to achieve that simple pleasure.
 

squirrels

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I'll go one step further and say that this site has lost its way.

When I first got here, it was about RESTORING men's god-given animal right to f**k.

Most men came here with the idea in their head that, "I'm not good enough, I don't deserve a woman". Most say, "I can't get a woman no matter what I do", but as Bible-Belt pointed out above, it's a self-image problem. They have been sold on the idea that sex is somehow "dirty" and that to earn the privilege to do something so "dirty", you have to somehow EARN the right from society.

Bible_Belt said:
Your negative, self-hating attitudes are what is keeping you guys from getting laid. It's not your looks, and it's not your porn. It's all in your head.
Men brainwashed in this way are the ones who supplicate to women, who kiss their arses and buy them stuff and listen to their problems. Those men couldn't figure out why women kept passing them over for guys who were, by all social accounts, "trash". "Bad boys". Social rejects.

What this forum USED to tell people is, "You ARE good enough to f**k". That was the biggest revelation that changed my success-rate with women. Not some acquisition of a new skill or "technique" or some kind of mental-masturbatory "self-improvement" quest, but just being introduced to a single thought...the thought that maybe, just maybe, *I* was "good enough" to deserve to f**k. Or even that I was "good enough" to just SAY HELLO to a woman, as long as I did it in a natural, confident way.

I didn't have to go out and get any "M"s. All I had to do was show, "yes, this is who I am, I'm cool with that, and I want to f**k".

Then somewhere along the line, this forum got filled with enough half-Juans and chumps that THEIR way of thinking started infecting it. The "self-improvement" crowd came out and started telling people:

- You don't deserve chicks yet. Go out and start a business.
- You don't deserve chicks yet. Read and expand your mind.
- You don't deserve chicks yet. Go work out.
- You don't deserve chicks yet. Go work on yourself.

The above ideas turn Maslow's ol' hierarchy on its head. They expect you to SELF-ACTUALIZE FIRST and then go seek what you want out of life. How bass-ackwards is that??

Society sends two signals to you at the same time to keep you confused. One tells you how much you WANT something, the other tells you how LITTLE you deserve it. It keeps you constantly in want of things, so you keep spinning your little hamster wheel in hopes that one day you'll EARN the right to go up and talk to that cutie at the grocery store.

Meanwhile, the real "Don Juan" strolls up, says "hello" with a smile, and BAM, he's in. And you're left thinking, "man, I must not have deserved it enough! I have to work harder! Damn him for not working as hard as me!! Life isn't fair!"

This forum is like Cosmo for men. It sells us on a negative self-image so it can sell us on other stuff we "need" to correct that image, keeping us in a vicious cycle.

When you TRULY BELIEVE that you DESERVE to be fit, you will get fit.

When you TRULY BELIEVE that you DESERVE to be rich, you will get rich.

When you TRULY BELIEVE that you DESERVE to get laid, you will get laid.

You won't be able to help it...you'll put the work in, because not doing so would seem like a waste to you.

What's holding you back is the self-image, the hesitation, the FEAR of failure and the corresponding FEAR of ridicule for not believing in the unworthiness sold to you by...THEM.

You FEAR this because you don't BELIEVE in yourself. You think that maybe if you do this, or buy that, or impress this person, that THEN you will be able to believe in yourself...but because you don't believe in your worthiness, you don't believe you can accomplish those things, or even have the balls to TRY.

F**K that noise. Set it aside.

You want to set aside your porn addiction? It's as simple as considering the possibility that MAYBE, JUST MAYBE...you DESERVE to have sex with beautiful women.

Don't try to sell yourself on it right away...because your mental conditioning is WAY too strong. But just consider it as an alternate possibility to what you've been told, to what you THINK you know. Just let it rattle around in your mind. Play with the idea. Maybe it IS as easy as saying "hello", as doing simple things like "kino" or maintaining eye contact. Maybe you DO have a lot more to offer than you thought, and you've just been holding yourself back because you felt "unworthy".

Maybe it IS possible for a woman to find value in who you are.

Maybe you SHOULD show yourself off more, get to the gym and show your athletic potential, go to school and exercise that mind of yours, do something to show your value to the world.

These thoughts and actions come from your belief in your own worthiness. NOT the other way around.

Five years ago, I wasn't as well-off, I wasn't as smart/well-read, I wasn't as fit, I hadn't participated in quite so many adventures.

But I DID believe more then that I DESERVED women in my life.

And I HAD a LOT more women in my life.
 

backbreaker

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squirrels said:
I'll go one step further and say that this site has lost its way.

When I first got here, it was about RESTORING men's god-given animal right to f**k.

Most men came here with the idea in their head that, "I'm not good enough, I don't deserve a woman". Most say, "I can't get a woman no matter what I do", but as Bible-Belt pointed out above, it's a self-image problem. They have been sold on the idea that sex is somehow "dirty" and that to earn the privilege to do something so "dirty", you have to somehow EARN the right from society.



Men brainwashed in this way are the ones who supplicate to women, who kiss their arses and buy them stuff and listen to their problems. Those men couldn't figure out why women kept passing them over for guys who were, by all social accounts, "trash". "Bad boys". Social rejects.

What this forum USED to tell people is, "You ARE good enough to f**k". That was the biggest revelation that changed my success-rate with women. Not some acquisition of a new skill or "technique" or some kind of mental-masturbatory "self-improvement" quest, but just being introduced to a single thought...the thought that maybe, just maybe, *I* was "good enough" to deserve to f**k. Or even that I was "good enough" to just SAY HELLO to a woman, as long as I did it in a natural, confident way.

I didn't have to go out and get any "M"s. All I had to do was show, "yes, this is who I am, I'm cool with that, and I want to f**k".

Then somewhere along the line, this forum got filled with enough half-Juans and chumps that THEIR way of thinking started infecting it. The "self-improvement" crowd came out and started telling people:

- You don't deserve chicks yet. Go out and start a business.
- You don't deserve chicks yet. Read and expand your mind.
- You don't deserve chicks yet. Go work out.
- You don't deserve chicks yet. Go work on yourself.

The above ideas turn Maslow's ol' hierarchy on its head. They expect you to SELF-ACTUALIZE FIRST and then go seek what you want out of life. How bass-ackwards is that??

Society sends two signals to you at the same time to keep you confused. One tells you how much you WANT something, the other tells you how LITTLE you deserve it. It keeps you constantly in want of things, so you keep spinning your little hamster wheel in hopes that one day you'll EARN the right to go up and talk to that cutie at the grocery store.

Meanwhile, the real "Don Juan" strolls up, says "hello" with a smile, and BAM, he's in. And you're left thinking, "man, I must not have deserved it enough! I have to work harder! Damn him for not working as hard as me!! Life isn't fair!"

This forum is like Cosmo for men. It sells us on a negative self-image so it can sell us on other stuff we "need" to correct that image, keeping us in a vicious cycle.

When you TRULY BELIEVE that you DESERVE to be fit, you will get fit.

When you TRULY BELIEVE that you DESERVE to be rich, you will get rich.

When you TRULY BELIEVE that you DESERVE to get laid, you will get laid.

You won't be able to help it...you'll put the work in, because not doing so would seem like a waste to you.

What's holding you back is the self-image, the hesitation, the FEAR of failure and the corresponding FEAR of ridicule for not believing in the unworthiness sold to you by...THEM.

You FEAR this because you don't BELIEVE in yourself. You think that maybe if you do this, or buy that, or impress this person, that THEN you will be able to believe in yourself...but because you don't believe in your worthiness, you don't believe you can accomplish those things, or even have the balls to TRY.

F**K that noise. Set it aside.

You want to set aside your porn addiction? It's as simple as considering the possibility that MAYBE, JUST MAYBE...you DESERVE to have sex with beautiful women.

Don't try to sell yourself on it right away...because your mental conditioning is WAY too strong. But just consider it as an alternate possibility to what you've been told, to what you THINK you know. Just let it rattle around in your mind. Play with the idea. Maybe it IS as easy as saying "hello", as doing simple things like "kino" or maintaining eye contact. Maybe you DO have a lot more to offer than you thought, and you've just been holding yourself back because you felt "unworthy".

Maybe it IS possible for a woman to find value in who you are.

Maybe you SHOULD show yourself off more, get to the gym and show your athletic potential, go to school and exercise that mind of yours, do something to show your value to the world.

These thoughts and actions come from your belief in your own worthiness. NOT the other way around.

Five years ago, I wasn't as well-off, I wasn't as smart/well-read, I wasn't as fit, I hadn't participated in quite so many adventures.

But I DID believe more then that I DESERVED women in my life.

And I HAD a LOT more women in my life.
This is a great post.. it's funny you and i signed up right at the same time. You are brilliant.

however I think there is a flaw in what you are stating. not a flaw but.. well hear me out.

Even the "self improvement" crowd, which is what I would put myself in, is not coming out and saying you can't have sex. No. I don't think I ever said that.

No, what I and others before me, including pook (http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=15803, http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=60002) have stated, is that you can have sex.. you deserve to have sex! but, to have sex with the women that you want to have sex with, well i can just speak for me.. the woman I wan to have sex with, I would have to become a better person.

There are leagues. However you can get called up to Triple A or the big leagues depending on how hard you work. I don't want to **** with A ball women. Yes you have the right to **** A ball women. Hell you have the right o **** major league women, but do not be surprised, when they don't want to **** you in return.

Secondly, this site is two fold. There is getting women and there is keeping women. I'm not a bad looking dude, I never was. I could even, at times, get women that I thought were out of my league, and frankly were out of my league. But I could not keep them, because it became quickly apparent to them and to me, that what ever trick I used to get them, would not work forever. Self improvement is a game enhancer. I can do things, get away with things, that i could not do 10 years ago because I am more of a catch. I know it, she knows it, whoever she is. Is it mandatory? no. Do you have to do this before you can get your **** wet? no. Does it make things a hell of alot easier? yes. Is it alot harder to become someone when you are chasing ***** 24 x 7? yes. those are basic facts.


When I came here, I had two clear, distinct problems.

1. the women I really wanted, I could not get. really, the woman. But in general, I like thoroughbreds. I like classy hot women and I don't settle. I wanted to not figure out how to get laid I wanted to figure out how to get laid by the women I wanted to get laid by.

2. even the times I would settle, I could not keep a woman. Despite what my mother told me, I knew enough to know that the common denominator between all my women and me, was myself.


I NEVER had a problem talking to a woman in general. I always could go up and talk to a cute girl if I thought she was attractive and get her number.. well, maybe not that brazen but let me just say, if i knew a woman was interested I knew what to do. I never once thought that I could not have sex period. The first thing I did when I got her, the first serious thing I did, was desensitize myself to hearing no. That allowed me to be able to approach the women I was attracted to in mast quantities and by sheer numbers, i started to have some success. But even then I was settling. I was settling for a higher standard but still settling. the few times I had someone on the hook that I thought was that quality, I reverted back to my AFC days. Simply because, I knew, that i was not of that quality yet. I knew it on a subconscious level.

AFCism is what we revert to when we know on a subconscious level aren't good enough. That or you are a jerk. they are both means to an end. So even though I was having some succesw ith the opposite sex, alot of it actually, I had not done what i had set out to accomplished. I just had a lot of clutter. I would much rather have 2 or 3 grade 1 level women in my stable then to have a stable full of claimers. That is where self improvement comes into play. I had tapped my potential out.

I could Kino, through all the NPL, gunwitch **** at my now finacee in the world, but sooner or later she would have seen that I was not confident in myself, I had no clear direction and my life revolved around women, and would have left. I could have called her a flake, or nexted her, or whatever, but the truth is the truth. she would have been right.

God if I ever leave, which I hope doesn't happen, the quality of women I am in is going to be rediclous.I remember when I would go to the gym and fap to the gym woman at the first desk (not one in particular but just in general, they are all hot) Hell a few months ago the (19 year old) gym worker (with a perfect ass) told me it was too bad I was taken. Smart as hell, very soft spoken, perfect, and I mean perfect body, going to school to be a nutritionist, isn't spoiled, beautiful, and here is the kicker, SHE'S A VIRGIN LOL, Chasity ring and all. we've talked about it (i asked her about it), not going to she is married. she's wife material, no questions asked. The type that will look better at 40 then most look at 27-28 because she lives in the gym. good wife material. would have given my left nutt to go on a date with her 10 years ago, now i am turning them down. Self. improvement.
 
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HariPoter13

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Bible_Belt said:
Your negative, self-hating attitudes are what is keeping you guys from getting laid. It's not your looks, and it's not your porn. It's all in your head.
FUCK! This has to be one of the best posts ive read here lately. Bible_Belt, youre my idol. What is your philosophy of life?

backbreaker said:
would have given my left nutt to go on a date with her 10 years ago, now i am turning them down. Self. improvement.
Also.. YES!
 

backbreaker

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HariPoter13 said:
FUCK! This has to be one of the best posts ive read here lately. Bible_Belt, youre my idol. What is your philosophy of life?
you could defiantly do worse. bb is a smart mofo
 

Bible_Belt

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Thank you.

My point was that hating yourself and hating women are simply coping mechanisms. It's cognitive dissonance, like the story of The Fox and the Grapes. If you can't reach the grapes, they must be sour, right? And if you find out that 1 in 6 women are secret porn addicts, well of course all of those women must be fat and ugly. Not that it matters anyway, because if you're on sosuave, then you must be physically hideous and no woman would ever want you...but hey, they're all shallow b!tches anyway, so that doesn't matter, either, right?

You can wrap yourself in these delusions, and they will make failure hurt less, but at the same time they will also guarantee continued failure, reinforcing themselves to be stronger each time, until eventually the delusions will self-fulfill. It's not easy to drop the coping mechanisms, because they make failure easier. If all women are b!tches and you think of yourself as unworthy, then it makes you feel better about striking out. Failure hurts, but you have to embrace it and deal with it maturely in order to be able to move on without carrying your negativity on to the next girl. Emotional baggage is what is really holding you back.
 

element0

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What this forum USED to tell people is, "You ARE good enough to f**k".
This is great stuff! I feel like I am constantly trying to improve because I don't find myself good enough, so I set a bunch of goals, some I reach some I don't. I loathe myself for not reaching all my goals, and forget about the ones I do reach. I know I have improved myself within the last 6 months in many ways (job, body, social circle), but I still always find myself "not good enough." Like my success with women is always dependent on the next goal on the horizon.

Maybe I was good enough to talk to the girl on the elevator this morning? Or say hi to my hot new neighbor across the street? I just have realize it and do it.
 

Strelok

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Bible_Belt said:
Thank you.

My point was that hating yourself and hating women are simply coping mechanisms. It's cognitive dissonance, like the story of The Fox and the Grapes. If you can't reach the grapes, they must be sour, right? And if you find out that 1 in 6 women are secret porn addicts, well of course all of those women must be fat and ugly. Not that it matters anyway, because if you're on sosuave, then you must be physically hideous and no woman would ever want you...but hey, they're all shallow b!tches anyway, so that doesn't matter, either, right?

You can wrap yourself in these delusions, and they will make failure hurt less, but at the same time they will also guarantee continued failure, reinforcing themselves to be stronger each time, until eventually the delusions will self-fulfill. It's not easy to drop the coping mechanisms, because they make failure easier. If all women are b!tches and you think of yourself as unworthy, then it makes you feel better about striking out. Failure hurts, but you have to embrace it and deal with it maturely in order to be able to move on without carrying your negativity on to the next girl. Emotional baggage is what is really holding you back.
Sincerly I fail to see the connection with what you say with the fact/theory that if a woman is a porn addict is probably because she cant do any better as much as a guy who can score only ugly girls chose porn over them.

What you say about self created barriers in man makes sense and it's true in many cases but not all,however if you are short,poor,ugly and shy and your league is kinda low would you be fine with girls your league or will u chose a hj while watching jenna jameson?
The short,ugly, fat guy doesnt get girls not cause he doesnt believe in himself,he doesnt get girls cause he sucks as much as the girls interested in him.

Nobody here at least not me is trying to put down those girls to feel better,my gf is not exactly a top model but I consider myself happy with her even if I dont spin 1000 plates as anyone suggests here so no hate from me at all.

The only mental problem I could see is the entitlemente mentality that many guys have,where even if average themselves they expect a top model as gf.

Long story short how does the fox and the grape connect with a guy saying that if a girl is a porn addict is because she is not attractive to men?
We're not talking about a rejected guy who say he didnt like the girl anyway.

Hope I make myself clear and let me know if I'm missing something.
 

Bible_Belt

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how does the fox and the grape connect with a guy saying that if a girl is a porn addict is because she is not attractive to men?

Because you have no way of knowing, just like the fox had no way of knowing that the grapes were sour. There are a thousand reasons that a woman could prefer porn over a real man, most of them to do with the shortcomings of men and overall society much more so than women.

Guys are fixated on the ease with which a woman can get easy sex, but they don't realize the problems that such an arrangement can create for a woman. The guy can turn into an AFC creepo stalker, a codependent clinger, embarrass her in front of her friends and family, or God forbid make her look bad on facebook. These things can ruin her reputation and social standing, which are much more important to a woman than getting laid.

If you could have a beautiful new woman every day, would you also accept a reputation as a man-wh0re? Of course you would; every guy would. But now reverse the genders. A woman wouldn't take that deal. She might be a even be a giant wh0re who would love the arrangement, but it would still not be worth it if she had a reputation as a wh0re, because reputation is a higher priority to women than sex.

I had a girlfriend in law school who had been slvtty in undergrad, but hated the reputation she got, so in grad school she simply became a masturbation and porn addict. She had named each of her vibrators :eek: And yet she was very attractive, in a hot librarian sort of way. She would have been one of those 1 in 6 women that you think must all be fat and ugly. Repressed sexuality among women is surprisingly common, and many of them are not at all unattractive.
 
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