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She demands a 5th date out to dinner prior to banging

manfrombelow

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OP, now I have read everything here and in the other thread of yours.

I don't know about the other DJs on here, but from my own experience, 3 (three) dates are maximum time for sex to happen. If, for whatever reasons, I can't fvck her at the 3rd date, then 99,999% I never will because her Interest Level in me would drop close to zero by then.

The fact you prolonged the entire courtship to the 5th date means you need to learn a lot more about the art of escalation, OP.

Remember: Whenever you fail to fvck a girl, she'll find another guy to do it for her.
 

EyeBRollin

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OP, now I have read everything here and in the other thread of yours.

I don't know about the other DJs on here, but from my own experience, 3 (three) dates are maximum time for sex to happen. If, for whatever reasons, I can't fvck her at the 3rd date, then 99,999% I never will because her Interest Level in me would drop close to zero by then.

The fact you prolonged the entire courtship to the 5th date means you need to learn a lot more about the art of escalation, OP.

Remember: Whenever you fail to fvck a girl, she'll find another guy to do it for her.
This is a flawed sentiment by many men all over this forum. While you should be able to bang most women within three dates, it isn’t guaranteed. More importantly, it is not correlated to interest level. Some of the most consistent plates and all three of my long term girlfriends since becoming red pilled have waited a bit longer for sex. Usually a few more dates.

What guys need to understand is that patience is the key to women. It is a marathon not a sprint. Most guys operating on SMV get laid by luck because they are only able to keep a woman around for a couple weeks. When you operate in a more measured fashion and truly understand game, they stick around longer. Years and months as opposed to days and weeks. “Frame” is actually having the power to do the dumping.
 

manfrombelow

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This is a flawed sentiment by many men all over this forum. While you should be able to bang most women within three dates, it isn’t guaranteed. More importantly, it is not correlated to interest level. Some of the most consistent plates and all three of my long term girlfriends since becoming red pilled have waited a bit longer for sex. Usually a few more dates.

What guys need to understand is that patience is the key to women. It is a marathon not a sprint. Most guys operating on SMV get laid by luck because they are only able to keep a woman around for a couple weeks. When you operate in a more measured fashion and truly understand game, they stick around longer. Years and months as opposed to days and weeks. “Frame” is actually having the power to do the dumping.
Next time, a simple "I don't agree with this, because my opinion is different" is enough.
 

Lookatu

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This is a flawed sentiment by many men all over this forum.
I don't necessarily consider it a flaw. It depends on what they want. If wanting a potential GF, then yes. But if they are just after sex and don't want to exert the investment, then there are plenty of others that will give it up more easily and time spent on trying to woo or manipulate someone into sex is lost opportunity that you could've used the time to try to get with other girls. Sex should come easy if that's all you want.

With that said, I've played the long game more than on one occasion but it was justified and I didn't sense any kind of game playing on the other's part. The moment you sense any silly games, is when you eject. If you feel forward progress and no games, you proceed if you have the patience and are wiling to invest the time.

In this case, 22yo's generally have very little to no ASD so if she was really into him, it would've already happened IMO. Older gals would naturally put up more resistance.

Based on OP's history of just getting out of marriage and not wanting anything serious, I assumed he was just looking for fun and sex. And if that's the case, 5 dates is way too long IMO.
 

EyeBRollin

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Next time, a simple "I don't agree with this, because my opinion is different" is enough.
The comment is addressing reoccurring theme in threads posted on this forum. Guy doesn’t get sex quick enough, makes a thread on it, ejects the girl, then makes a follow up thread about how bad women are. That is the usual sequence.
 

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Lookatu

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The comment is addressing reoccurring theme in threads posted on this forum. Guy doesn’t get sex quick enough, makes a thread on it, ejects the girl, then makes a follow up thread about how bad women are. That is the usual sequence.
This is probably the most damaging part and gives a false sense to some of the new comers here.

Simply, if they are not on your same track, just move onto someone that is. No need to bash them for not giving it up in the time frame that you wanted.
 

TheNewStyle123

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This is a flawed sentiment by many men all over this forum. While you should be able to bang most women within three dates, it isn’t guaranteed. More importantly, it is not correlated to interest level. Some of the most consistent plates and all three of my long term girlfriends since becoming red pilled have waited a bit longer for sex. Usually a few more dates.

What guys need to understand is that patience is the key to women. It is a marathon not a sprint. Most guys operating on SMV get laid by luck because they are only able to keep a woman around for a couple weeks. When you operate in a more measured fashion and truly understand game, they stick around longer. Years and months as opposed to days and weeks. “Frame” is actually having the power to do the dumping.
This is a really great point.
 

TheNewStyle123

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I don't necessarily consider it a flaw. It depends on what they want. If wanting a potential GF, then yes. But if they are just after sex and don't want to exert the investment, then there are plenty of others that will give it up more easily and time spent on trying to woo or manipulate someone into sex is lost opportunity that you could've used the time to try to get with other girls. Sex should come easy if that's all you want.

With that said, I've played the long game more than on one occasion but it was justified and I didn't sense any kind of game playing on the other's part. The moment you sense any silly games, is when you eject. If you feel forward progress and no games, you proceed if you have the patience and are wiling to invest the time.

In this case, 22yo's generally have very little to no ASD so if she was really into him, it would've already happened IMO. Older gals would naturally put up more resistance.

Based on OP's history of just getting out of marriage and not wanting anything serious, I assumed he was just looking for fun and sex. And if that's the case, 5 dates is way too long IMO.
You are correct. I do not want a LTR and I am simply looking to just hook up. I think at this point though I can make it happen by this date. If not, then I am certainly not going for a 6th date.
 

Lookatu

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You are correct. I do not want a LTR and I am simply looking to just hook up. I think at this point though I can make it happen by this date. If not, then I am certainly not going for a 6th date.
Do yourself a favor and don't give away your time and lost opportunity with others if all you're looking to do is hook up next time. Hook ups shouldn't take that long.
But I'm hoping you can get the flag on the 6th attempt. Live and learn either way. :up:
 

TheNewStyle123

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Do yourself a favor and don't give away your time and lost opportunity with others if all you're looking to do is hook up next time. Hook ups shouldn't take that long.
But I'm hoping you can get the flag on the 6th attempt. Live and learn either way. :up:
Exactly man, if I don't it sucks because that was time and money wasted, but it's all a learning experience! I'm willing to give it a 5th date and see.
 

PRW63

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What do you think guys? Am I being a little too stubborn? Should I just take this girl to dinner as it will potentially end in sex? At this point, for me, I feel like I would totally lose frame if I gave into her demand for me to take her out to dinner, and I could go through all of that and still not get laid.
I think she knows you only want to get laid and are not really concerned for her herself. She's probably caught between generally liking you, but not wanting to be used for a cheap lay. I think she wants someone willing to build a future with her (family, kids, etc).
 

mrgoodstuff

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Escalating to the dinner date is a lose. If she has not shown desire by now then she's not going to show it. You should've at least made out with her at this point, like made it to 2nd base...
 

BillyPilgrim

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I think she knows you only want to get laid and are not really concerned for her herself. She's probably caught between generally liking you, but not wanting to be used for a cheap lay. I think she wants someone willing to build a future with her (family, kids, etc).
That's why you want to project the image of having a potential future with the girl unless it's clear she's down to hook up
 

BillyPilgrim

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This is a flawed sentiment by many men all over this forum. While you should be able to bang most women within three dates, it isn’t guaranteed. More importantly, it is not correlated to interest level. Some of the most consistent plates and all three of my long term girlfriends since becoming red pilled have waited a bit longer for sex. Usually a few more dates.

What guys need to understand is that patience is the key to women. It is a marathon not a sprint. Most guys operating on SMV get laid by luck because they are only able to keep a woman around for a couple weeks. When you operate in a more measured fashion and truly understand game, they stick around longer. Years and months as opposed to days and weeks. “Frame” is actually having the power to do the dumping.
I've found that quality women do tend to want to wait longer, but if they want to wait too long of a time the risk of nothing ever happening is so great that it's not worth pursuing. I try to get a feel over text for this (what speed limit towards sex they will tolerate). All of my LTR's happened with sex within 3 dates. If sex didn't happen within 3 dates, it didn't happen at all.
 

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BillyPilgrim

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"Project the image" of having a potential future?
Or..
Actually have a potential future?

In other words,...lying to her to get laid?,...or actually have it be true?
Both. True to some extent and also exaggerated. The truth is, you never know for sure how things will end up.
 

TheNewStyle123

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I've found that quality women do tend to want to wait longer, but if they want to wait too long of a time the risk of nothing ever happening is so great that it's not worth pursuing. I try to get a feel over text for this (what speed limit towards sex they will tolerate). All of my LTR's happened with sex within 3 dates. If sex didn't happen within 3 dates, it didn't happen at all.
Think it's even worth trying for the 5th date then, or is it pretty much a no-go?
 

BillyPilgrim

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Think it's even worth trying for the 5th date then, or is it pretty much a no-go?
I say go with it since in this case you cancelled/rescheduled and she is showing renewed enthusiasm. Just be sure to escalate as smoothly as you can.
 
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