Is $ 20 too cheap for a hooker

[AmsterdamAssassin]

I think drinks, dinners, excursions, gasoline and that sort of thing are also a kind of "payment" to have sex with an "ordinary" woman.

And why should the man pay for all of that? To show he can provide? Sorry, but I don't lead with my wallet.

Or in my case- having a wife. Unlimited sex vs. unlimited access to my wallet, insurance, etc.

I've been married. Your wife doesn't contribute financially at all?

Start dating a girl and refuse to pay for any of the dates and let me know how that goes. They are all prostitutes in some form.

I'm not saying not paying for dates at all, but most of my 'dates' are evening drinks and after that we mostly meet at my home. I enjoy cooking and so do most of my lovers, so no need for expensive dinner dates to impress them. I also dated some affluent women who enjoyed taking me to health spas, et cetera. The idea that the man has to pay for everything is so 1950s.

 

[AmsterdamAssassin]

Dating/Prospecting is a second job. Yes, you have those enjoyable first dates, but you also have a lot of crappy ones or ones that leave you blindsided.

How much do you have to date? You're not able to keep those women around after the first time? And why do you have so many crappy dates? Don't you preselect?

So you don't spend a literal dime on women?

Why does you think that you either spend a huge amount of money or not a dime. There's something in between, you know?

Every girl just goes to your place without a date and fvcks you?

Most women come home with me after one date, and that first date is evening drinks. And often, I meet women at exhibition openings at art galleries or other art events. So there's no 'date' necessary to have them come over to my house.

 

[EyeBRollin]

I've been married. Your wife doesn't contribute financially at all?

Weird framing. How did you glean that from the statement wives cost money?

 

[Gamisch]

Do you brother. $20 hookers. lol.

20 bucks introduction.

You know like a drugdealer gives a way samples.

I'll repeatverhere there are buildings with 4 stories, with 100,of women between ages 20 and 40 who sell the box for30/40 bucks.

Welcome to 2023

 

[AmsterdamAssassin]

Weird framing. How did you glean that from the statement wives cost money?

Or in my case- having a wife. Unlimited sex vs. unlimited access to my wallet, insurance, etc.

Sex costs money any way you slice it. Why are guys deluding them selves in saying otherwise?

That's how I glean it. You are the person who frames that having a wife is having unlimited sex with a woman who has unlimited access to your wallet. And how that sex costs money 'any way you slice it'.
That's your weird frame, not mine.

I've been married, I never looked at my wife like that.

 

[EyeBRollin]

That's how I glean it. You are the person who frames that having a wife is having unlimited sex with a woman who has unlimited access to your wallet.

Yes. And you somehow interpreted that as my wife contributes nothing financially. Again, that is weird and borderline incendiary framing.

Whether a woman makes $0 or $1 million, she still expects the husband to provide financial resources. We all should know this.

 

[AmsterdamAssassin]

Yes. And you somehow interpreted that as my wife contributes nothing financially. Again, that is weird and borderline incendiary framing.

No, you frame it as 'sex costs money, even if you're married'.

In my frame, a marriage is about sharing all the burdens that come with having a household (with kids, in my case) together. When you share everything, you don't b!tch about how sex costs money even when you're married.

 

[tightgrp]

Sex costs money.

True dat. Whether a hooker, gf or wife. They're all in it for money or resources somehow and sex is their currency. Some cost more than others. Some are a great value while others are way overpriced. Each has it's pros, cons and maintenance costs.

 

[AmsterdamAssassin]

Men who complain that sex costs money should get better at sex.
Men who give good sex don't have to compensate women financially.

 

[tightgrp]

No, you frame it as 'sex costs money, even if you're married'.

In my frame, a marriage is about sharing all the burdens that come with having a household (with kids, in my case) together. When you share everything, you don't b!tch about how sex costs money even when you're married.

Who's bitching?

 

[CornbreadFed]

How much do you have to date? You're not able to keep those women around after the first time? And why do you have so many crappy dates? Don't you preselect?

You have to be trolling lol. An average first date in my city ranges from 50-100 dollars. I also prospected off the apps so bad dates were pretty common due to the volume and low barriers to entry.

Why does you think that you either spend a huge amount of money or not a dime. There's something in between, you know?

Either way, it still costs money. You are spending money to maintain and keep her interest.

Most women come home with me after one date, and that first date is evening drinks. And often, I meet women at exhibition openings at art galleries or other art events. So there's no 'date' necessary to have them come over to my house.

So you aren’t just meeting women for the first time and saying nice shoes let’s fvck and bringing them back to your place. You are investing time, energy, and money.

 

[BackInTheGame78]

And why should the man pay for all of that? To show he can provide? Sorry, but I don't lead with my wallet.


I've been married. Your wife doesn't contribute financially at all?


I'm not saying not paying for dates at all, but most of my 'dates' are evening drinks and after that we mostly meet at my home. I enjoy cooking and so do most of my lovers, so no need for expensive dinner dates to impress them. I also dated some affluent women who enjoyed taking me to health spas, et cetera. The idea that the man has to pay for everything is so 1950s.

Fvck the expensive dinners but I definitely want to go do stuff out and about and not just sit around at home. That costs money...going to places, movies, shows, having fun like axe throwing or mini golf, etc...

I mean at the end of the day both parties are partaking...how much does the amount of time/effort a woman spend getting ready for you or getting her hair/nails done regularly to impress you cost?

 

[EyeBRollin]

No, you frame it as 'sex costs money, even if you're married'.

Correct. It is a factual statement.

In my frame, a marriage is about sharing all the burdens that come with having a household (with kids, in my case) together. When you share everything, you don't b!tch about how sex costs money even when you're married.

Sharing = costs money!

 

[SW15]

I also prospected off the apps so bad dates were pretty common due to the volume and low barriers to entry.

Apps are a great way to arrange low quality dates. It is quite common for men to experience the "one date, no sex, no second date" type interaction when arranging dates on apps.

It's better for a man to arrange his dates from some sort of in-person activity and have it be more likely to result in a second date or eventually result in sex. Even if a man arranges fewer dates from real world activity than swiping on apps or sending DMs on Instagram, he's better off from doing real world activity and having more meaningful first dates.

An average first date in my city ranges from 50-100 dollars.

Dates are getting pricier, like anything else. Thank you inflation.

Let's say there's a date that involves drinks in a bar. It starts around 7:30 PM on a weeknight and each person has 2 drinks. The man is piking up the tab for 4 drinks + a bartender tip. That's likely going to be around $40 or so. $40 might even be a floor for that sort of date in a top USA metropolitan at a bar with decent ambiance.

 

[AmsterdamAssassin]

Sharing = costs money!

Sharing saves money, one of the big reasons why people live together. In the end, the balance goes to less money spend per person. If sharing costs money you should've paid more attention in Economics.
PS. this is my last response to you, I rolled my eyes enough.

I mean at the end of the day both parties are partaking...how much does the amount of time/effort a woman spend getting ready for you or getting her hair/nails done regularly to impress you cost?

Most guys have no idea.

You have to be trolling lol. An average first date in my city ranges from 50-100 dollars. I also prospected off the apps so bad dates were pretty common due to the volume and low barriers to entry.

So you get low quality expensive bad dates from dating apps.
That's why I don't use dating apps. And when I take a woman out of drinks, I've done enough preselection to know that it's going to be a great night out, which I will enjoy regardless the outcome. If you only go out to find sex, you don't really enjoy going out.

Either way, it still costs money. You are spending money to maintain and keep her interest.

No, I don't need to spend money to maintain and keep her interest. You must be truly uninteresting company if you have to throw money at women to keep them around you.

So you aren’t just meeting women for the first time and saying nice shoes let’s fvck and bringing them back to your place.

I would never say, 'nice shoes'. I say, 'you make me curious how you'd look wrapped in my ropes'. And she says, 'But-but, I don't know you', which, of course, prompts me to get her to invite me for drinks where she can pump me.
For information, of course. Get your mind out of the gutter.

You are investing time, energy, and money.

It's only 'investing' if you are dependent on some particular outcome. Like sex.

I go dancing with women to dance with women.
I enjoy dancing with women, feeling them close to me, feeling them follow my lead.
My joy is not dependent on whether we have sex after dancing.
Just swaying across the floor with this gorgeous creature is my pleasure.
No time like the present.

You go to a nightclub. You stand in the queue, pay the entry, you shuffle stiffly around the dance floor to spot hotties that make the high entry prize worth the money. You schmooze up a woman you want to 'smash', she realises you're a walking wallet that can get her drinks for free, you ply her with drinks and try to impress her with your studied nonchalant display of affluence that shows her you're a high value man, someone she should follow, but that requires that you also have to pay for all the drinks and generously tip the bartender and the bouncer as you lead her to the taxi and when you arrive at her doorstep she feigns fatigue and sends you on your way with a chaste kiss on the cheek.
And your 'investment' didn't come to fruition, because you didn't get to fvck her. So you're bitter and angry about wasting an evening on a flake.

And you're pissed off that I don't have to jump through those hoops in order to get sex.

 

[EyeBRollin]

Sharing saves money, one of the big reasons why people live together. In the end, the balance goes to less money spend per person. If sharing costs money you should've paid more attention in Economics.

Saving money is admission that it costs money.

Affirmative: sex costs money, even for married men.

Your rebuttal: not if you share!

Men, help him out. He can’t admit that having sex with a woman costs money.

 

[CornbreadFed]

So you get low quality expensive bad dates from dating apps.
That's why I don't use dating apps. And when I take a woman out of drinks, I've done enough preselection to know that it's going to be a great night out, which I will enjoy regardless the outcome. If you only go out to find sex, you don't really enjoy going out.

There's pros and cons to each method of dating. You choose the specific niche dating style, which has pros and cons of its own. You have basically highlighted the pros, but the cons are you are limited to a certain type of woman, this dating method is not replicable to most men, and if you shvt the bed then everyone smells it type ordeal like in social circle games. The pros to dating apps are that it requires the less time investment & effort, a decent location gives you access to a lot of girls, and it is the most convenient.

No, I don't need to spend money to maintain and keep her interest. You must be truly uninteresting company if you have to throw money at women to keep them around you.

Again, you are trolling lol. Unless you are fvcking straight up hobos or girls in desperate situations that will come over for a cough syrup and a mcdonalds cheeseburgers, girls require investment from the guy to maintain their interest.

I would never say, 'nice shoes'. I say, 'you make me curious how you'd look wrapped in my ropes'. And she says, 'But-but, I don't know you', which, of course, prompts me to get her to invite me for drinks where she can pump me.
For information, of course. Get your mind out of the gutter.

It is a joke. Basically, you aren't going up to girls and having them have sex with you within 2 syllables.

It's only 'investing' if you are dependent on some particular outcome. Like sex.

I go dancing with women to dance with women.
I enjoy dancing with women, feeling them close to me, feeling them follow my lead.
My joy is not dependent on whether we have sex after dancing.
Just swaying across the floor with this gorgeous creature is my pleasure.
No time like the present.

Again, you are straight up trolling lol. If women stopped magically having sex with you, you would quit dancing and be more pessimistic about it. If this was not true, then why don't you do other things with women? The reason you dance and go to these art shows is because this nets you the highest ROI with women and your disdain for OLD & nightclubs stem from your low ROI values from those methods. Check fvcking mate!

You go to a nightclub. You stand in the queue, pay the entry, you shuffle stiffly around the dance floor to spot hotties that make the high entry prize worth the money. You schmooze up a woman you want to 'smash', she realises you're a walking wallet that can get her drinks for free, you ply her with drinks and try to impress her with your studied nonchalant display of affluence that shows her you're a high value man, someone she should follow, but that requires that you also have to pay for all the drinks and generously tip the bartender and the bouncer as you lead her to the taxi and when you arrive at her doorstep she feigns fatigue and sends you on your way with a chaste kiss on the cheek.
And your 'investment' didn't come to fruition, because you didn't get to fvck her. So you're bitter and angry about wasting an evening on a flake.

And you're pissed off that I don't have to jump through those hoops in order to get sex.

I do not go to night clubs, so I have zero correlation to this experience.

 

[AmsterdamAssassin]

Oh, I admit I've been trolling you a bit. I wouldn't mention rope bondage in the first conversation unless she brings up that topic.

this dating method is not replicable to most men

I don't have a 'dating method', which is why it's not replicable.
and shouldn't a man work on himself to improve his attraction by becoming 'unique'?
so someone cannot carbon copy me and my lifestyle and get the same results, that is why I mentioned in another topic that there are no shortcuts. If we're talking about investment: I invested in my personal growth; my time, money and energy went into becoming the best version of myself I could become, and I'm still working on myself and learning every day.
What I didn't invest my time, money and energy in is in chasing skirts.

If women stopped magically having sex with you, you would quit dancing and be more pessimistic about it. If this was not true, then why don't you do other things with women? The reason you dance and go to these art shows is because this nets you the highest ROI with women

Women do not 'magically' stop having sex with you. There's always a reason why they stop and if that is 'magical' to you then you just don't understand women.

Other things with women? I give one example, dancing, and you think that is all that I do with women? The reason I go dancing is because I enjoy dancing. I enjoy tango and milonga, which are paired dances. And yes, it's erotic, so there are instances that I hit it off with a dance partner in more than one way, but that is not the goal.
If I want to get laid, I don't have to tango my way into someone's bed.

And you think that I go to art shows to seduce women? Is that all you ever think about, chasing skirts? I'm an artist. Artists network and support each other, they go to each other's exhibition openings. I get invited to perform on art exhibitions. Art inspires me to make art. Blood of life. And yes, you can meet a lot of women there, but I don't need to get laid more. My kittens take good care of me, so I don't have to chase skirts.

Check fvcking mate!

Yes, just keep thinking this is a chess game where you have to put one over on me.
Meanwhile, all your protests and whining come from your scarcity mindset. If you had sex, you wouldn't be so single-mindedly obsessed with getting laid.

 

[CornbreadFed]

Yes, just keep thinking this is a chess game where you have to put one over on me.
Meanwhile, all your protests and whining come from your scarcity mindset. If you had sex, you wouldn't be so single-mindedly obsessed with getting laid.

Lol I don't want to continue arguing with you because it gets silly afterwhile. However, I have had sex with about 50-55 women to be truly serious. I don't obsess or bring up lay count because after #20 for me, I figured out the process of getting laid and it was just like riding a bike at that point. I think this is true to every male, they just need to figure out a system that works for them. Hell, it could be leading with their wallet lol. Last, I am partially asexual, so I don't even like having sex lol. I enjoy the other parts like the female body and experiences, but when it comes to sexual performance, I am mentally over it after the first 1 or 2 pumps lol.

 

[AmsterdamAssassin]

I don't obsess or bring up lay count because after #20 for me, I figured out the process of getting laid and it was just like riding a bike at that point. I think this is true to every male, they just need to figure out a system that works for them.

So you were congruency testing, like one of my bratty submissives.

Last, I am partially asexual, so I don't even like having sex lol. I enjoy the other parts like the female body and experiences, but when it comes to sexual performance, I am mentally over it after the first 1 or 2 pumps lol.

Thanks for sharing, but that also means you know exactly what I mean with the joy of dancing, i.e. being intimately close with a woman without being overtly sexual, seeing the arousal in her eyes as you lead her on the dance floor. Even if you don't dance, you understand that there is more to being intimate with a woman than intercourse.