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Interesting Study...ugly guys who get hot women do so because they don't think they are ugly...

stringpuller

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How does one know they're attractive?
Its not a thought. You were born attractive in the circle of life. Men have more value then women.
Always assume every girl you talk to wants you. Its a good default to live by.
 

IKO69

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How does one know they're attractive?
By the amount of attention you are getting and the quality of the girl. If you've had some nice looking girls interested in you then you can assume you are attractive. Note : let's say a fattie or two have liked you also, this doesn't suggest anything about being lower tier or something. I have heard men grumble about this before.

If not there you need to raise your profile and you'll get there. Earlier when I was getting lunch I saw one fella with a cute girlfriend, they were holding hands. This was a run of the mill guy with a pudgy belly who was definitely not a "Chad".
 

DonJuanjr

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Always assume every girl you talk to wants you.
Unless the guys is narcissistic, this just isn't realistic. What is realistic is seeing that one was attractive to an attractive person, and knowing there's no reason others wouldn't think so.
 

Kotaix

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Again this goes to show that confidence is assumed and projected, not earned. If you believe in yourself you can accomplish things that everyone tells you you can't accomplish. This goes beyond women into many other aspects of life including work.

Maybe the ugly guys in the article are just narcissistic. It's a little hard to have that kind of confidence, if it wasn't reinforced by the opposite sex throughout life.
If you listen to haters or always measure yourself against others then you can always find a reason to not be good enough, and you never will be. They key is to not care and not take it personally if a woman doesn't think you're hot. It's only Narcissism when you're solipsistic or think that you're somehow better than everyone else.
 

Kotaix

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Unless the guys is narcissistic, this just isn't realistic. What is realistic is seeing that one was attractive to an attractive person, and knowing there's no reason others wouldn't think so.
Why isn't this realistic? It's just an assumption that effects your state of mind when you approach a woman.
 

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DonJuanjr

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They key is to not care and not take it personally if a woman doesn't think you're hot.
I agree not caring is the key. Not having an unsubstantiated belief that you are when there is no proof. Believing in one's abilities is not the same as being validated of external judgements. It's probably a better mindset for a guy to think "I'm not trying to fvck me, so I don't care what I look like".

Why isn't this realistic? It's just an assumption that effects your state of mind when you approach a woman.
Because if it were, the guys struggling with it wouldn't be in their position.
 

IKO69

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I'm really surprised to see there is an actual debate about whether success breeds confidence....of course it does. Confidence is not something like eye color that you inherit at birth; you aren't born with say a level 7 out of 10 confidence and it follows you through life. In every area of our lives we started with low self confidence. When we began to crawl, walk, learn to ride a bike, game girls etc everyone single one of us have very low self belief. You were afraid you would stumble, fall, scrape your knee, get your feelings hurt (and this likely did happen many times)....but you picked yourself up and tried again. You repeated it over and over until you slowly got the hang of it and then it was automatic. The repeated successes reinforced your belief that you could do that thing and that is where you drew your strength from (in the future). This is the process of mastery for anything in this world.

I cannot see how it is possible to have a healthy self esteem if you do not have previous success to draw from, at least for most people. There are those, religious people for instance, who turn to the scriptures and they will read a psalm or something and that gives inspiration and comfort, but that is not indicative of strong self belief - just a belief in something external.

The ugly men in the study might've simply had previous success (You may say how? Think of the ugly ass jocks in highschool and college) and so were bolder when opportunities arose and due to the law of averages: they succeeded once in a while. Much better looking men who didn't have as much success were more sheepish, didn't act on opportunities (I would've been rejected anyway)
 

DonBig

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This is really interesting...guys who were rated lower by females in the looks department that rated themselves higher tend to be the "ugly guys with the hot chicks" you see walking around...

And the good looking guys who rate themselves lower tend to not do as well...

Basically the ugly dudes are overconfident and even c0cky about how they look while some of the better looking guys are not so confident about their looks...

I guess confidence really CAN be king when it comes to women.

Bottom line..if you believe you are hot and act like you are hot, women will believe you are hot.

I see it everytime they mostly don’t have confidence. Once the gf is gone after a date or whatever they are insecure mode. Or when they are with a female friend. I’m very observant so i notice those things with ease.

The point is when boys interact with women, their testosterone increases, once they are gone they are insecure.

The girls give them confidence and they think sometimes that the girl is into them, but they are just friendly because that’s how they treat friends. They are already friendzoned in their mind and those who passed the friendzone or don’t want to be in it become players. Another point is that they get comfortable in the friendzone and then start to treat each other without pedestalizing, lots of investment, which is huge advantage if you have a good social circle with women.

Friendzone game is how you get women with ease. But it takes time. That’s why I can only shake my head how some women don’t have big standards for friendships. Just attention and validation and maybe a value that they can exploit from you, ridiculous
 

BadBoy89

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What about the increasing popularity of hip hop music, where guys explain in detail how they chase women? Countless examples how to do it, it just depends what a man feeds to his own brain.
I hate to admit it but there is actually a decent point with the one above.
 

SW15

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Where is a young man, where everything he sees and touches tells him young sexy woman are Gods, supposed to get confidence and game? 7-11 from 5 -8 pm on weekdays?
I have never done approaches at a convenience store but I have heard from women about getting approached there. I've only done more traditional grocery stores.
 

BadBoy89

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I have never done approaches at a convenience store but I have heard from women about getting approached there. I've only done more traditional grocery stores.
Lol. Didn’t mean actual convenience stores.

Everyone keeps saying “game, game, game, game.” Well, where does one learn game? Is there a class in high school? University? Library? Mall? Travel?

When people say “men need to learn game” it’s a scapegoat. Because if the guy does anything, anything wrong with the hot girl that does not lead to sex, it can’t specified what he did wrong so he easily ends being a loser.

People can’t say “men need to learn full head of hair”, “men need to learn height”, “men need to learn rich”, those can be quantified. Because if a guy gets those things and still can’t get the girl, the blame falls on the person who said it. But game…oooh, that’s difficult quantify, so the blame falls on the man when he doesn't get the girl, and the person who said it is blameless.

But it’s still good.
 

SW15

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Everyone keeps saying “game, game, game, game.” Well, where does one learn game? Is there a class in high school? University? Library? Mall? Travel?
Attraction and seduction are taught on YouTube channels and in books. A lotr of men are flailing because there's not a clear path in which men are taught to seduce and have sexual success with women.

When people say “men need to learn game” it’s a scapegoat. Because if the guy does anything, anything wrong with the hot girl that does not lead to sex, it can’t specified what he did wrong so he easily ends being a loser.

People can’t say “men need to learn full head of hair”, “men need to learn height”, “men need to learn rich”, those can be quantified. Because if a guy gets those things and still can’t get the girl, the blame falls on the person who said it. But game…oooh, that’s difficult quantify, so the blame falls on the man when he doesn't get the girl, and the person who said it is blameless.
You can adjust who you approach/seduce based on height. If I, at 5'10", decide to focus on 5'11"+ volleyball players, I'm likely wasting a lot of time. If I, at 5'10", focus on 5'3"-5'7" women, I'm likely not wasting my time.

Chasing money can get a guy women. It's not automatic.

Hair helps a lot.

A lot of men are continually guessing on what went wrong in certain interactions. Most men won't get any feedback when an interaction sours.
 

Gamisch

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Lol. Didn’t mean actual convenience stores.

Everyone keeps saying “game, game, game, game.” Well, where does one learn game? Is there a class in high school? University? Library? Mall? Travel?

When people say “men need to learn game” it’s a scapegoat. Because if the guy does anything, anything wrong with the hot girl that does not lead to sex, it can’t specified what he did wrong so he easily ends being a loser.

People can’t say “men need to learn full head of hair”, “men need to learn height”, “men need to learn rich”, those can be quantified. Because if a guy gets those things and still can’t get the girl, the blame falls on the person who said it. But game…oooh, that’s difficult quantify, so the blame falls on the man when he doesn't get the girl, and the person who said it is blameless.

But it’s still good.
Imo the biggest strength of the English language is that one word can become a complete definition. The term " game " is some kinda slang, a jargon.

When a man meets a woman both know its " game time". Like when a man squares off with another man. Sleeves getting rolled up , and both know what's about to happen. Game on.

That's having game imo. You recognize the moment and act accordingly. And no, this can't be taught without real life experiences. Through the trenches. If a man never take risks he'll never grasp the feeling what game means. It's about closing the deal. Making the goal, slam dunking the ball.

Women will translate game (or lack off) as confidence, swag, being smooth, witty, charismatic.

It's vague terminology, but if you got it you just know what it is.
 

stringpuller

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Unless the guys is narcissistic, this just isn't realistic. What is realistic is seeing that one was attractive to an attractive person, and knowing there's no reason others wouldn't think so.
Its very realistic
 

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Mike32ct

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It's not like the woman even knows... All she knows is "I just don't feel it".
I think that, plenty of times, they are consciously aware of WHY they aren’t attracted to a certain guy. But they aren’t going to tell the guy.

They will most certainly tell their gfs the real reasons(s) why they rejected or friendzoned some guy though.
 
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DonJuanjr

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Its very realistic
You're right... I can't believe guys that are struggling with confidence don't just think to themselves "I'm attractive enough". It's so obvious....So easy.... Yet... Here they are struggling with confidence.....
 

stringpuller

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You're right... I can't believe guys that are struggling with confidence don't just think to themselves "I'm attractive enough". It's so obvious....So easy.... Yet... Here they are struggling with confidence.....
Not every scorn becomes a tree. Nor does it whine its way into being a tree.
Maybe just do some work?
What is it that you need to hear from yourself that someone else cant tell you?
Do a deep dive into why you are seeking validation. Justification or anything outside of yourself.
 

DonJuanjr

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I'm not talking about myself.... I'm just aware that there's guys out there that struggle with confidence, and I'm sure they've already told themselves the obvious "I'm attractive enough". Yet it doesn't work. For me, I stated that I don't have confidence problems about my attractiveness, because I was already validated by an HB 8.5. So I KNOW there's others out there that would find me attractive also. It's just a matter of stumbling across them, and not taking the rejections along the way personally...

Not every scorn becomes a tree. Nor does it whine its way into being a tree.
Maybe just do some work?
What is it that you need to hear from yourself that someone else cant tell you?
Do a deep dive into why you are seeking validation. Justification or anything outside of yourself.
 
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