I believe us older guys should stop bullsh1tting the younger ones

[Who Dares Win]

You do realize that this forum is where Rollo came from right? You do realize that Rollo's teaching and popularity is what has kept this forum alive all these years, right? Otherwise it would have degraded into a poor Reddit imitation and died off.

Rollo Tomassi

www.sosuave.net

On YouTube there is Rollo,...and then there is everyone else. He is not preaching the same thing the rest are and spends 50% of his time fighting against all the BS that comes from the rest of them,...most of them grifters.

The rest of what you are saying is all anecdotal. "It happened to me this way, so that is the only way it can be, because I know everything and do everything right". That is the way that women debate,...all anecdotal. You are using society's current condition to judge what Tomassi teaches and saying he is wrong,..... rather than using what Tomassi teaches to demontrate how wrong society is.

You joined this forum in 2020 yet apparently read all of rollo's posts despite he left years before your arrival...

We will let him know about his biggest fan and hopefully you will get a follow back from him so you wont end up like stan.

Listen. We are all going to age. Best to do it gracefully. People who are attractive (good looking, fit and stylish) are going to have the most opportunity at any given age relative to their peers. The real outliers are going to have wide appeal (much greater than their peers) to many people.

I’m in my early 50s as many of you know. Men from early 30s to early 80s approach me all the time. @RangerMIke is correct. It takes greater discipline to remain fit in your 50s. Most people, men and women both, give up. Men are dealing with midlife & declining T levels, women are dealing with menopause. But discipline wins the day. My best advice to the younger guys here (the advice I give my own 19 year old son) is this:

On looks:
1. Eat healthy & do not over eat
2. Exercise and discipline your body, which helps to mature & discipline your mind
3. Dress with panache. My son loves to dress. He is good looking although only 5’8”, and he rocks brogues good jeans and a sport coat or smoking jacket or dress shirt. He outclasses many men much older than he is. He is stylish, cool and sophisticated in appearance. Chicks dig him.
4. Confidence wins the day.
5. Pick a chick who is into you. High interest all the way.
6. Avoid the sun. Nothing ages you faster.

On success:
1. The world doesn’t care about you. The world judges you on your results. Create good results and you create a good life. Your mom and your best mates will love you, maybe a wife if you choose well, but no one else cares. Understand that & get about results.
2. Do everything in your power to avoid mistakes you cannot recover from.
3. Have character. Character is doing the right thing when nobody is looking.
4. Have/develop work ethic. Winners never quit & Quitters never win. Perseverance rules the day.
5. Know when to change horses in life. Learn when.
6. Find a mentor & learn everything you can from them.

On Women:
1. We are ALL crazy. Pick a crazy you can live with.
2. You focus on being the best man you can. Require through your actions and your leadership for her to be her best self too.
3. Women freak out. Let them. They’ll get over it if you refuse to freak out with them.
4. Pick someone who is passionate about you & who you find physically and otherwise irresistible. Sexual chemistry is the glue.
5. Hold women to account. Your mom, your sister, your girlfriend or wife.
6. Be a gentleman and expect a lady.
7. Do not be afraid to dismiss.
8. Pick someone patient and loving and kind. Reward her for these traits.

I know 50 year old men who date women in their 20s and I know men who have let the beer belly & sloppiness ruin their prospects too. I hang out with others who, like me have made a lifestyle of good habits, fun & act togetherness. My fiancé is 45 and HOT. Desirable in every way but with his own set of quirks too. He worries about me because he sees the way men vy for my attention, which keeps him sharp.

He knows he’s lucky. But make no mistake. You make your own luck.

Cheers

Not to sound an ass but you wrote half a page with limited to no content regarding the focus of this thread.

I mean it's not about your biography, motivational stuff or random personal wisdom...

I'm saying "dont trust those who sell you an age for something that it's not while downplaying the previous one" and you make lists of tips cosmopolitan style.

 

[HaleyBaron]

That reminds me, I need to go visit my old school frat party once in a while to see how I can manage against the usual guys. I don't think I'll have much trouble. With age, you start realizing how easy all the young girls are. Maybe it's just me.

 

[BeExcellent]

You joined this forum in 2020 yet apparently read all of rollo's posts despite he left years before your arrival...

We will let him know about his biggest fan and hopefully you will get a follow back from him so you wont end up like stan.


Not to sound an ass but you wrote half a page with limited to no content regarding the focus of this thread.

I mean it's not about your biography, motivational stuff or random personal wisdom...

I'm saying "dont trust those who sell you an age for something that it's not while downplaying the previous one" and you make lists of tips cosmopolitan style.

Not at all. I’m giving some tips in a summarized way to realize success in life. You want to help the younger guys here? Encourage them. You don’t know what they have to work with. You only know what you have to work with. And you are a bit despondent, according to your content.

Yes you are correct. Age reduces us all in time. Time does not discriminate. So what?But if a man takes the gifts he is given and applies principles espoused not just by me but many others on this thread and elsewhere then you can extend your shelf life physically while gaining wisdom, patience, zen and panache that the young inexperienced men don’t have.

It is as individual as each man. All men do not improve with age. True. However some men really do and bloom late and come into their own later past the 20s. Still others start off desirable and remain that way throughout life. My father did for example. Women like confidence. Women like experience. Women like fun and good humor. Bitterness is a universal turn off and so too are jadedness and negativity.

I mean if I as a past 50 post wall woman can be thoroughly happy and enjoying life why can’t you be doing that? Nobody gave me anything other than some advice along the way…well an education. My father gave me an education and a good upbringing. I got fortunate genetics, yes. But there are plenty of more beautiful women who are ugly people (and some who are lovely people too)…but I capitalized on the opportunities that were offered to me. I stayed fit. I took care of myself and those close to me.

Here’s the difference. Truly attractive people are in love with life, are positive and encouraging. My friends who are older who are exceptional with women? They are without exception confident, charming, comfortable in their own skin and unconcerned with how others percieve them.

The right attitude will get you everywhere. Life is not an all or nothing black & white endeavor. Life is in the shades of gray, the nuance.

I’m supposed to be post wall, right? A cat lady. Well I’m not. And I don’t have a single cat. Be careful about assigning your (negative) perception to objective reality.

Each man here should strive to be an outlier. Never give up on yourself. And look. At 25 or 35 your perception is (like many people) that 50 is old. It isn’t. You’ll see, so long as you take care of your health & life until you get here. Always be like the beguiling cat. You know. The one who ate the canary

 

[SW15]

My experience has closely reflected the SMV chart that Rollo came up with. I have had far more success in my 30s than I did in my early 20s. A lot of that is just understanding game in general - which I would not say I had a firm grasp from 21-24.

I will disagree that cold approaching "isn't easy" for a guy in his 30s. Sure, you have to expect to not always (perhaps usually not) getting a number from cold approaching. But it is by no means hard to approach women. And no one said women are "clamoring to be your girlfriend" - it is on the man to make the efforts in making that initial approach with most women.

There is also no reason to be a "vagina beggar." If you are a good looking guy, have stayed in shape, and have some social pull you can definitely still pull women in mid-late 20s into your early 40s. I am doing it now at 35 and I have friends in early 40s who are doing as well.

It depends on the definition of difficult. I've spent hours on outdoor trails looking to make approaches but only gettting in 1-2 approaches in a 2 hour approach session outdoors on a weekend after. Pre-pandemic, I've lingered in grocery stores for up to an hour to find maybe 1 approach or sometimes 0. Approaching is not easy. Doing the approach itself is ok but most approach sessions involve a fair amount of lingering and waiting around to find an approach.

The typical guy in his 30s/40s is some guy on Bumble or Hinge looking to get his penis wet with some woman there. Competition is fierce. That's what turns these guys into vagina beggars. The apps are sausage fests but the typical guy has even more difficulty with approaching than I do. I have at least made the approaches. I've made the approaches during the day in non-bar venues while sober. Not a lot of men are able to do that.

Lol. What? I think you're confusing proximity with access. Ya, you won't have hot, young girls that you see everyday in class (proximity) but most college dudes don't have real access to those girls. They have no tangible skillset to convert those girls--tho they may get lucky from time to time.

And, no matter what your age is, there's nothing stopping you from hitting the college bar of your choice--where, ya, some small % of girls won't be into you because of your age, and, ya, the soros/frats will ****block you with some % of the top-shelf, but still possible to do extremely well in those environments. And, ya, smash some of those girls often enough and most of them will want to be your gf. And that's not to mention the 22/23 yo's who are just now settling into their boring ass corporate lifestyles and are in new cities where they don't have tight social circles and are tired of the lames they're meeting on bumble--easy pickings.

Good point on proximity vs. access. When I was in college, I attended a school that could be called "Hot Girl U" and it had a good party scene. I had good proximity. There were top shelf women in my classes. I could walk from class to class across campus and see plenty of hot women. As far as access goes, I knew few big time seducers. Most men on campus at "Hot Girl U" were vagina beggars. Typical beta males/AFCs with little to no access, especially if they weren't in fraternities. I got some poontang while in college despite not being in a fraternity and my notch count from that era was decent. I really had to battle for my notches though, which is how I started reading about game, seduction, and sexual technique. I've continued to put up the notches despite less proximity than I had at "Hot Girl U".

Most men post-college will have better fortune with the 22-25 year olds settling into boring ass corporate lifestyles and are in new cities where their social circles are weak. These are the types at the bars, in co-ed sports leagues, and on swipe apps.

Women absolutely have it tougher as they age. They lose their fertility much quicker than men. This has all sorts of devastating effects on their femininity. Plus, their skin is thinner and is more prone to wrinkles. That's why they tend to age much worse. I see zero reason why a high SMV man in his 40s couldnt easily lock down an attractive women in her late 20s or early 30s.

So what if women have it tougher? Doesn't mean shiit.

The Wall Is Softer Than We Think – Roosh Valizadeh

One popular maxim of the manosphere is the wall. It goes something like this: Once a girl is done riding the **** carousel, she will find herself at an age and lower attractiveness where she can no longer get the alpha male she wants. She will then have no choice but to load up on cats or find a lo

www.rooshv.com

These 30s/40s women have no shortage of men who are interested in them.

I think it's all dependent on context. For example, you have to acknowledge the fact that the "game" is getting harder in general, so what may have been easy 10 years ago won't be easy today, but not because of you, but the state of the game itself. Plus, there is a nostalgic bias. I certainly don't remember 90% - 95% of my rejections.

All that said, I'm only in my early 30s so maybe I just need to wait until I'm 40 before I can speak on this topic, but I have found that each passing year I attract more and more women with increasing age gaps both ways. So, key takeaway is that your YMMV.

Yes, game is getting more difficult. As I get closer to 40, I can remember what game was like when I was in college (2001-05). It was definitely easier to seduce in the 2001-2006 era than after 2010.

My age gaps haven't increased much as time has gone on, but that could be specific to me.

 

[BadBoy89]

It's because you're depressed, mate. Women don't want to be around it. "Girls just wanna have fun" as Madonna would say.

I don’t know about that bro. I had way more girls in my 20s too. I had no idea what game or anything was back then, and girls would stick their tongue down my throat no problem,

Now I look better, I’m richer, best car, best house, more experience, more game than you can imagine, but I’m not 6’1, and some times I can’t get divorced women to call back.

It’s not all about men not having game or not understanding women. When women lose their looks and sexuality, they lose their power and are absolutely ruthless. Brad Pitt couldn‘t handle Angelina, and layman like us are supposed to handle it.

Brutal.

 

[BeExcellent]

I don’t know about that bro. I had way more girls in my 20s too. I had no idea what game or anything was back then, and girls would stick their tongue down my throat no problem,

Now I look better, I’m richer, best car, best house, more experience, more game than you can imagine, but I’m not 6’1, and some times I can’t get divorced women to call back.

It’s not all about men not having game or not understanding women. When women lose their looks and sexuality, they lose their power and are absolutely ruthless. Brad Pitt couldn‘t handle Angelina, and layman like us are supposed to handle it.

Brutal.

Perhaps another factor is that the best women are now taken. As in happily married and stayed that way. In the 20s you have more marriageable people who are single. As they pair off and get married they depart the marketplace in many cases never to return.

For the truly top tier women? I’d say in most cases. They marry and are never back in the market.

And the ones who do show back up after being divorced or widowed return to a different landscape.

But men who are adroit with women and who appeal to women do not struggle. They just don’t.

So then the question becomes, what is there in the mirror that needs to adapt or evolve or change in order to create appeal or increase appeal?

 

[Pierce.Manhammer]

There are women looking for different things, those looking to wife up probably find a 35 yr old more attractive if he has a job, a car, a pad, and a plan - she wants to pump out some pups.

Likewise youth is king and 35 yr old male with his **** together in every way is more desireable
to a bigger swatch of women than just about any comparable male or any age given it’s no longer taboo for 50 year old to date him either, many won’t but many will.

it’s all varied but the 80/20% rule applies.

 

[BadBoy89]

Perhaps another factor is that the best women are now taken. As in happily married and stayed that way. In the 20s you have more marriageable people who are single. As they pair off and get married they depart the marketplace in many cases never to return.

For the truly top tier women? I’d say in most cases. They marry and are never back in the market.

And the ones who do show back up after being divorced or widowed return to a different landscape.

I'd say any woman, married or not, becomes more ruthless as they get older. Now if they have a child, then it's less, but God forbid they have never been pregnant while married, then it's game over.

But men who are adroit with women and who appeal to women do not struggle. They just don’t.

So then the question becomes, what is there in the mirror that needs to adapt or evolve or change in order to create appeal or increase appeal?

About 5 inches; vertically, not horizontally

 

[FlexpertHamilton]

So what if women have it tougher? Doesn't mean shiit.

The Wall Is Softer Than We Think – Roosh Valizadeh

One popular maxim of the manosphere is the wall. It goes something like this: Once a girl is done riding the **** carousel, she will find herself at an age and lower attractiveness where she can no longer get the alpha male she wants. She will then have no choice but to load up on cats or find a lo

www.rooshv.com

These 30s/40s women have no shortage of men who are interested in them.

They have no shortage of subpar men, yes. That's precisely why they settle for "safe betas". It's not because they're mature and actually have a good selection process, it's because they don't have the option for high SMV guys period.

Yes, game is getting more difficult. As I get closer to 40, I can remember what game was like when I was in college (2001-05). It was definitely easier to seduce in the 2001-2006 era than after 2010.

My age gaps haven't increased much as time has gone on, but that could be specific to me.

I'm convinced most men who have a harder time as they age is simply due "coasting" from their earlier days, and don't bother to continually learn and adapt and change their methods. This could also be a mentality issue, thinking "I'm too old, not good enough" or something along those lines, too. The conditioning men have undergone to make them think they lose their value after 30 is astonishing.

I don’t know about that bro. I had way more girls in my 20s too. I had no idea what game or anything was back then, and girls would stick their tongue down my throat no problem,

Now I look better, I’m richer, best car, best house, more experience, more game than you can imagine, but I’m not 6’1, and some times I can’t get divorced women to call back.

It’s not all about men not having game or not understanding women. When women lose their looks and sexuality, they lose their power and are absolutely ruthless. Brad Pitt couldn‘t handle Angelina, and layman like us are supposed to handle it.

Brutal.

Something there that isn't adding up. Not going to pontificate, but I do not understand why that could be the case, unless you're only going for broads in their 30s.

 

[samspade]

And, no matter what your age is, there's nothing stopping you from hitting the college bar of your choice--where, ya, some small % of girls won't be into you because of your age, and, ya, the soros/frats will ****block you with some % of the top-shelf, but still possible to do extremely well in those environments. And, ya, smash some of those girls often enough and most of them will want to be your gf. And that's not to mention the 22/23 yo's who are just now settling into their boring ass corporate lifestyles and are in new cities where they don't have tight social circles and are tired of the lames they're meeting on bumble--easy pickings.

This. I would say as a man 25-40 you have a major advantage (if you're game aware) over college guys. Their major advantage is building social group familiarity, and that they're more likely to be the last d!ck standing (party all night). But we all know and knew younger girls who at least had flings or ONS with "older" guys - and those are the incidents that the girl chose to volunteer info on, if you weren't the guy fukking her. Females are much better with discretion.

Like I said earlier, most college-aged guys act immature and rely on the party atmosphere to serve up lays...which again, works...but any 30 something guy with a job, a decent body, and decent clothes can outflank a frat boy. The majority of men (of all ages) are cowards, so if you're reading this and know how to approach and charm a chick, the world is your oyster. If you're IN college and learning game etc., you can really clean up.

 

[Striker_93]

Like I said earlier, most college-aged guys act immature and rely on the party atmosphere to serve up lays...which again, works...but any 30 something guy with a job, a decent body, and decent clothes can outflank a frat boy.

I don't know man.....

That's debatable

 

[samspade]

I don't know man.....

That's debatable

Sure, but why debate when you can just give it a try?

 

[Striker_93]

Sure, but why debate when you can just give it a try?

I'm not talking about myself......

I'm saying it's debatable to say a 30 something year old will out pull a frat/party guy in his prime.

I think the frat guy would win that one.

 

[samspade]

I'm not talking about myself......

I'm saying it's debatable to say a 30 something year old will out pull a frat/party guy in his prime.

I think the frat guy would win that one.

I hear you. I'm saying that debating it is a waste of time, that's all. If a 30 year old doesn't go out and try to pull because he thinks he can't, then he can't, and he won't.

Also I didn't mean to frame it that black and white. Plenty of young women out there. What I'm saying is most college dudes are doofuses. I didn't specify "frat boys," who have a little more swagger, attitude, and social proof.

 

[PRW63]

These 30s/40s women have no shortage of men who are interested in them.

I know some in their 60's with more guys chasing them than they can keep up with.

 

[FlexpertHamilton]

I'm not talking about myself......

I'm saying it's debatable to say a 30 something year old will out pull a frat/party guy in his prime.

I think the frat guy would win that one.

Most frat party guys are just drunk idiots with no game. They're a joke. The guy who is fun and confident (without needing to get drunk) will almost always do better.

 

[Bigpapa]

Most frat party guys are just drunk idiots with no game. They're a joke. The guy who is fun and confident (without needing to get drunk) will almost always do better.

this is what we like to think , and it is fair if in terms of smv more or less they are the same , otherwise none of them will get laid

 

[Snag87]

I know some in their 60's with more guys chasing them than they can keep up with.

How old are the guys?

BTW, if I ever get to the point where I have to pursue a 60+ year old, it's time to retire from women, regardless of my age. 55 is the oldest I'd go, even if I'm 80.

 

[fastlife]

I'm saying it's debatable to say a 30 something year old will out pull a frat/party guy in his prime.

I think the frat guy would win that one.

Most frat guys aren't getting laid at all--or maybe once or twice a yr with drunk freshmen. Go out to college bars and meet them. You can throw medium-busted girls at them and they'll try to be your friend for life. Middle to upper-tier frat guys almost always end up wifing up one of the hotter sorority girls--not a bad gig--a lot of them end up marrying those same girls once they graduate because they never built the skillset. Only a tiny fraction of frat guys clean up--and even that's probably on a more moderate scale than most people would assume.

Mostly they just have a lot of pull in blowing your sh1t up if they feel like it, ditto sorority sisters--esp bigs. Group theory's a must. And they host parties and private events that your (or my) ass aren't getting into--tough. Way easier in general to pull independents--but even then you need to manage the friends. Also, a lot of sorority girls get disillusioned by the scene and are on the market for guys outside of it by the time they're juniors or seniors. Not saying it's easy, logistics usually suck, but definitely doable with a little bit of legwork.

 

[zekko]

Obviously a 27 year old man, if he was identical to a 45 year old man in every way except looks, would do better with women. But that is purely hypothetical.

The fact of the matter is, the only thing that declines with men over time is their T levels and their looks. But both of those can be mitigated easily. There are plenty of men who are still good looking, masculine, and verile in their 40s.

Everything else improves. Not automatically, of course, but if the man in question is living his life in an optimal way.

I agree with this. I guess if you're a guy who peaks in high school or peaks in college, maybe you're not going to level up when you get older. But for me, I was a much more desirable man in my 30s than when I was in my 20s. In my 20s I was less secure with myself, and hadn't learned how to handle myself correctly yet. I was putting in a lot of work in my 20s though, and a lot of it started paying off in my 30s. Even the declining T levels can work to your advantage, because when I was younger the hormones were so strong girls would just frazzle my brain. In my 30s, the edge was off enough that things weren't so urgent for me, and that paid off in a number of ways.

Bottom line, I don't think it's a lie that you improve in your 30s , but you have to put the work into yourself when you're in your 20s. You have to stay in shape and not let yourself go.