I am hearing that more men are single then ever and they are giving up on dating and women...

[Bigpapa]

The poverty level in a 1st tier US city for a family of 4 is $117,400.00 gross. Someone earning that does not have their own home unless its inherited or they bought in 1975. Sooo no tax breaks.
~118,000/.33=~39k.
118k-39k=79k
This means take home is about $5700/month
Avg rent 1st tier city 3br/2ba is 3,400.00
now $2300.00 left for food for 4, automobiles, gas, utilities, clothing, trash, 401k, medical, cable tv, internet, cell phones.

Yeah I'm reality based. If you move to a 3rd tier city your income drops 35%.

What is the poverty level for a 1st tier city for only 1 person?

If you have a family most likely you will not be depressed that women only date chads

 

[Bigpapa]

Has nothing to do with exaggerating or being "the biggest Chad out there". Its just facts. A woman WIlL wait for you IF you are the best option available to her. I've seen it plenty of times as i said in my previous post. We all have different experiences ofcourse...

Its similar to a smv5/6 or even 7 man getting strung along by a hb...7,5+ type of woman. The only difference is that a woman can pay with her p00sy ,while a man mostly will pay with money,time, non sexual attention, free rides ect.

Ill explain it some more: i used to be a sex addict. Prostitution is legally overhere, and on top of that in my (sick and twisted) mind i felt like I DESERVED to feck as much as possible( lets say every day )if given the chance. In that case fecking and getting suxked off by a sub hb7 woman was actually lucrative business, as it " saved " me (in my sick twisted mind) a 100 bucks at least.

Later I moved to a region where hookers asked 30/40 bucks a session...hb6,5 and up to be clear, between ages 18 and 40..it was like paradise at first, but later it kinda..destroyed my view on the value of women /p00sy. Havent been to a hooker in YEARS now.

I try to practice some form of sexual discipline , at least I am on nofap (so no p0rn), so I dont drive myself crazy with sexually charged images anymore.

What mostly means I am not entertaining women beneath my standards anymore..I can "easily " go MONTHS without sex, but more than 3 months actually never happens so..

Hopes this clarifies it a bit.

Dunno what going to h00kers has to do with what we were discussing, but whatever

 

[Gamisch]

Dunno what going to h00kers has to do with what we were discussing, but whatever

Damn that's unfortunate.

I've explained it in such a way that its difficult to explain it in a dumbed down version without repeating myself. Used different colors and font sizes ,yet you DON'T get it??


Let me try it this way: men want sex (hookers can offer this), while women want attention and money EVEN if they don't necessarily feck(sex) the guy.

so me (man) got "paid" by women who chased after me with their p00sy. Instead of hookers, i fecked ..yes!!!Them.

You basically confirm you are FAR from a Chad(lite) with saying you are FAR from a Chad(lite). A desirable man gets OFFERED free p00sy , basically women will ASK him to call them before he spends 100 + bucks on a hooker

It aint rocket science bruh.

 

[corrector]

Dunno what going to h00kers has to do with what we were discussing, but whatever

Hookers are women, therefore anything dealing with women is relevant to a discussion about women. They are a subcategory of women.

 

[AmsterdamAssassin]

But who wants to improve themselves to meet some hb6 plain jane with astronimcally high body-count?

You need to learn that improving yourself is not about becoming more desirable to women. You should improve for yourself.

 

[AmsterdamAssassin]

Hookers are women, therefore anything dealing with women is relevant to a discussion about women. They are a subcategory of women.

And you should understand that any woman who works in the service industry (whether she's a sex worker or a hotel receptionist) gets paid to be pleasant and agreeable.
Women in general can be disagreeable if they want, but not when they work in the service industry. So don't mistake a service industry woman's pleasantries for authentic kindness and care.

 

[NoBiscuits]

Perhaps people are realizing that chasing sex is not only not worth the extraordinary effort required for it if you're not a top 20% man in terms of looks, but they're also realizing that such a dopamine driven lifestyle isn't a society's way of living but instead a way of dying. I think the abundance of resources that's required for hedonism has finally been depleted.

The stats that back up why you can't "just go outside and have fun" come from how 18-24 year olds spend their time (mostly solitary and online). About 1/3 of teenagers in the US have considered suicide. About 1/3 of young men have been told by an authority figure that he needs to be medicated (usually a teacher, a 95% female career for elementary schools). The younger generation of men are depressed and neglected, and they now need to become a superstar just to get laid.

The stats that back up men giving up come from surveys of college students and millennials with the question of "how many partners have you had in the last year." The female response is usually 2x - 3x the number of the males'. This means more women share the top men. So you can't just blow off men who get left behind as fat neckbeards who play WoW all day and don't shower. This is a luxurious boomer-like way of avoiding big social problems.

It's the middle tier of men that are getting effected by this now. Two hundred years ago when marriage was priority, when people grew up in real communities, and when women were taught to be modest, the average man didn't have to spend his entire 20's bodybuilding and starting a wealthy business to get a woman. And it was taboo to divorce as well, so he didn't have to constantly worry about hypergamy and the consequences of it.

To make a point, the home ownership rate for millennials (ages 27-42) just broke above 50% last year in the US. The average age where men leave their parent's house is now 26-27 . The age where every man has a reasonable chance of getting a house, woman, and stable job are over. Of course men are giving up on these things and resigning to weed, video games, and getting fat. And boomers telling them that they suck as people for doing so has not actually solved the problem one bit.

 

[corrector]

And you should understand that any woman who works in the service industry (whether she's a sex worker or a hotel receptionist) gets paid to be pleasant and agreeable.
Women in general can be disagreeable if they want, but not when they work in the service industry. So don't mistake a service industry woman's pleasantries for authentic kindness and care.

I dont know, I have not visited an escort since 2014 so I do not have extensive personal experience compared to other posters such as @GoodMan32. However, as a member of the public, I do have to deal with cashiers very frequently.

If you are an ethnic sub 5 and get a prejudiced clerk (those other insecure ethnics that kiss up to whites since I have no complaints at all with white women and have often choose dealing with a white woman over an ethnic due to poorer treatment from the ethnics, in the past) then women even on that level can be rude. If they are not rude then you may get this mechanical service where you feel you are just a number. That is why, in the past, I have used self serve options to avoid having to deal with cashiers because they are not even able to pretend to be nice with me. I remember even complaining to the manager of the store (ended up with free food) at one time. My complaints run up to before the Pandemic but have no issues (for grocery stores) since mid 2020.

Your argument of service women is invalid because you dont understand how its like to be an ethnic sub 5 looking guy, (at least before the Pandemic in my experience).

However, most non hired women are not real if you look at it. Someone attracted to your looks or 6 figures, 6 feet, 6 inches, etc.... is not very authentic either. They do not like you for you but what they can see and how it makes them feel.

 

[NoBiscuits]

Your argument of service women is invalid because you dont understand how its like to be an ethnic sub 5 looking guy, (at least before the Pandemic in my experience).

What do you mean "ethnic" sub 5? Everyone has an ethnicity. Do you mean non-white? Yes. There's data showing whites have advantages in attraction from women of all ethnicites.

But anyway, older generations just don't understand the concepts of limits and bottlenecks. I think that's why this thread is so heated.

eg. I want a house. There are 100 houses for sale within commuting distance.
45 cost 10x my gross yearly salary
25 of them were sold to multinational companies that paid 2x the market value, now they're rentals
10 are in dangerous neighborhoods
10 were sold to friends of the previous owner
8 were in terrible condition and needed lots of repairs
And the remaining 2, eh they just didn't feel like a good match

Boomers, gen x, and older millennials can't understand this. They will say "Just get a different job then. Houses are cheaper in rural areas. You screwed up. You go out and find all these houses that 'just don't feel like a good match' or that you're too poor. That's why you're just a renter."

Your friends and family being nearby, the fact that you've been climbing the ladder for a decade to get the job you have, the lack of your industry in rural areas, the houses being just as expensive in rural areas, the fact that you grew up there, the breakdown of why 98 / 100 were off the tablle, all of that doesn't enter their thinking and you can't teach it to them.

They only see 1. houses are for sale, 2. you're looking for one, 3. you don't have one, and 4. back in their day, they bought houses. Therefore, no problem with the housing market. It must be you and people just like you, obese softshells complaining all the time about gender pronouns and not feeling appreciated. That's why I own three houses and you can't even get one, because you're lazy.

 

[corrector]

What do you mean "ethnic" sub 5? Everyone has an ethnicity. Do you mean non-white? Yes. There's data showing whites have advantages in attraction from women of all ethnicites.

In all fairness to @AmsterdamAssassin, I dont know how it is like in Amsterdam. With a place with such a large scale red light district is really far out there. Maybe girls are nicer there.

Also my post also specified prior to the pandemic which means these could have been isolated one offs that are not happening frequently or recently enough to be more than a drop in the bucket. On the other token, cashiers who were nice with me tended to really appear attracted to me (maybe they were into ethnic guys). The point is hired guns act on their preferences. So it might be more like a ratio, 40% might be their job, 60% could personal (ie if she is attracted, problems at home, preconceptions about the other person).

 

[Bigpapa]

eg. I want a house. There are 100 houses for sale within commuting distance.
45 cost 10x my gross yearly salary
25 of them were sold to multinational companies that paid 2x the market value, now they're rentals
10 are in dangerous neighborhoods
10 were sold to friends of the previous owner
8 were in terrible condition and needed lots of repairs
And the remaining 2, eh they just didn't feel like a good match

Boomers, gen x, and older millennials can't understand this. They will say "Just get a different job then. Houses are cheaper in rural areas. You screwed up. You go out and find all these houses that 'just don't feel like a good match' or that you're too poor. That's why you're just a renter."

Your friends and family being nearby, the fact that you've been climbing the ladder for a decade to get the job you have, the lack of your industry in rural areas, the houses being just as expensive in rural areas, the fact that you grew up there, the breakdown of why 98 / 100 were off the tablle, all of that doesn't enter their thinking and you can't teach it to them.

They only see 1. houses are for sale, 2. you're looking for one, 3. you don't have one, and 4. back in their day, they bought houses. Therefore, no problem with the housing market. It must be you and people just like you, obese softshells complaining all the time about gender pronouns and not feeling appreciated. That's why I own three houses and you can't even get one, because you're lazy.

America compared to Europe in terms of difference between gross and net pay is heaven

In Europe most of the times you pay like 50% of your gross salaries in taxes, and guess what houses are still like 10 years worth of gross pay

Despite this, people can still afford to buy a place that they call home, and live a decent life despite having an average salary

Your arguments have no economic point

 

[corrector]

America compared to Europe in terms of difference between gross and net pay is heaven

In Europe most of the times you pay like 50% of your gross salaries in taxes, and guess what houses are still like 10 years worth of gross pay

Despite this, people can still afford to buy a place that they call home, and live a decent life despite having an average salary

Your arguments have no economic point

I did not write that.

 

[Bigpapa]

I did not write that.

Ywah, sorry. Quoted wrongly

Was a reply for @NoBiscuits

 

[All_Kindz_Of_Gainz]

You need to learn that improving yourself is not about becoming more desirable to women. You should improve for yourself.

Not really. Self improvement is masturbation. Yoe should have an end goal, improving for the sake of improving makes no sense, you wanna improve to what end?

After you've improved as much as you can, then what?

 

[NoBiscuits]

America compared to Europe in terms of difference between gross and net pay is heaven

In Europe most of the times you pay like 50% of your gross salaries in taxes, and guess what houses are still like 10 years worth of gross pay

Despite this, people can still afford to buy a place that they call home, and live a decent life despite having an average salary

Your arguments have no economic point

Europeans are complaining just as much when it comes to housing prices. People are still living with their parents into their mid to late 20's and the biggest drain of income is rent by a significant amount, just like the US.

Also, taxes in the US are not any better. I know half a dozen peers who moved all the way to California for high salary jobs and the chance of a better life. Here's what they encountered:

Gross $100k / yr in CA (most populated state)
Federal taxes: $39,180 (39%)
CA state tax: $6,047 (6%)
CA sales tax: 7.25%
That's 45% already on just taxes and 7.25% on everything you purchase after.

Don't want to live with mom? The median rent in CA according to Zillow is $2,900 / mo. So $34,800 / yr (35%).
You probably need a car to get to work. Car insurance itself is between $2,000 - $2,300 / yr depending (on the source) and mandatory. (2%).

So that's 82% already gone on just taxes, rent, and car insurance. Ok, so you have $18,000 on average for everything else and you'll have to pay an extra 7.25% of it each purchase (plus, likely a 2% charge from VISA or Mastercard that gets pushed to the customer for paying with card).

That's $1,500 / mo average for food, clothing, electricity, water bill, etc. Let's say you keep $900.

At some point you stop spending on necessaries and start saving for a house...which is $744,000 (median price according to Zillow).
It will take you 69 years to pay for a house if you somehow got a 0% interest loan. If I lived in CA, I would give up too. Especially with OLD and the way job applications are handled these days. A house, a woman, and stable work are the bare minimum things all men need, and each of those goals grinds them up, especially when alternative ways of doing things ("just go outside") start to disappear in favor of the new, more grindy way.

And that's on a six figure salary. Median household income is $84,000 (census.gov). But if you're a young man, you're not a household. You're a single person, so it's even less. Every person I know who moved to CA for that nice looking salary came back after 5 years burned out with not much to show for it. This is what people graduating college start out with, plus $40,000 - $60,000 in student debt. You don't get that debt in Europe, but the rest is basically the same.

I've written a post like this somewhere on the internet about 50-70 times over the years. I'm starting to think the concepts of limits and bottlenecks is a "but I did eat breakfast today" kind of thing for anyone over 35.

 

[Bigpapa]

Europeans are complaining just as much when it comes to housing prices. People are still living with their parents into their mid to late 20's and the biggest drain of income is rent by a significant amount, just like the US.

Also, taxes in the US are not any better. I know half a dozen peers who moved all the way to California for high salary jobs and the chance of a better life. Here's what they encountered:

Gross $100k / yr in CA (most populated state)
Federal taxes: $39,180 (39%)
CA state tax: $6,047 (6%)
CA sales tax: 7.25%
That's 45% already on just taxes and 7.25% on everything you purchase after.

Don't want to live with mom? The median rent in CA according to Zillow is $2,900 / mo. So $34,800 / yr (35%).
You probably need a car to get to work. Car insurance itself is between $2,000 - $2,300 / yr depending (on the source) and mandatory. (2%).

So that's 82% already gone on just taxes, rent, and car insurance. Ok, so you have $18,000 on average for everything else and you'll have to pay an extra 7.25% of it each purchase (plus, likely a 2% charge from VISA or Mastercard that gets pushed to the customer for paying with card).

That's $1,500 / mo average for food, clothing, electricity, water bill, etc. Let's say you keep $900.

At some point you stop spending on necessaries and start saving for a house...which is $744,000 (median price according to Zillow).
It will take you 69 years to pay for a house if you somehow got a 0% interest loan. If I lived in CA, I would give up too. Especially with OLD and the way job applications are handled these days. A house, a woman, and stable work are the bare minimum things all men need, and each of those goals grinds them up, especially when alternative ways of doing things ("just go outside") start to disappear in favor of the new, more grindy way.

And that's on a six figure salary. Median household income is $84,000 (census.gov). But if you're a young man, you're not a household. You're a single person, so it's even less. Every person I know who moved to CA for that nice looking salary came back after 5 years burned out with not much to show for it. This is what people graduating college start out with, plus $40,000 - $60,000 in student debt. You don't get that debt in Europe, but the rest is basically the same.

I've written a post like this somewhere on the internet about 50-70 times over the years. I'm starting to think the concepts of limits and bottlenecks is a "but I did eat breakfast today" kind of thing for anyone over 35.

If you make $100,000 a year living in the region of California, USA, you will be taxed $29,959. That means that your net pay will be $70,041 per year, or $5,837 per month. Your average tax rate is 30.0%

Have no idea how you reached to 45% instead of the 30% on your calculations

The sales tax In europe is minimum 19%, except for basic stuff like food, books, diapers, medicine. Where it ranges from 5 to 10% ( depending on the country )

Literally everyone that I know owns a home in Europe despite all that you have wrote and clearly the higher financial burden

If you can not afford a home in California ( more precisely the San Francisco area ), go to another state or city. If I remember correctly, San Francisco has the poverty line at 200k. Basically you are either a tech bro or you are not. If you are not you can go with your skills easily to another city in California or even better go to another state

Dude, stop whining. It is not the place that you live in, is you

 

[NoBiscuits]

If you make $100,000 a year living in the region of California, USA, you will be taxed $29,959. That means that your net pay will be $70,041 per year, or $5,837 per month. Your average tax rate is 30.0%

Have no idea how you reached to 45% instead of the 30% on your calculations

I reached those calculations by doing tax calculations. The tax rate for someone making 100k is the same as the tax rate for someone making 100k. What is "average tax?"

Literally everyone that I know owns a home in Europe despite all that you have wrote and clearly the higher financial burden

How old are you? Above 35?
Also, half of Europeans don't buy houses. They buy flats, which is just a section of a house. Much cheaper.

If you can not afford a home in California ( more precisely the San Francisco area ), go to another state or city.

Boomers, gen x, and older millennials can't understand this. They will say "Just get a different job then. Houses are cheaper in rural areas. You screwed up. You go out and find all these houses that 'just don't feel like a good match' or that you're too poor. That's why you're just a renter."

Those above age 35 don't understand the concept of scarcity and it can't be taught to them. Let me ask you a question. How would you feel if you didn't eat breakfast this morning?

Idk. What's your point? That I suck at life? Why did you make this argument personal anyway? I'm pointing out the social problems which are causing young men to stay single and give up on dating. That's what this thread is about.

 

[The Duke]

Europeans are complaining just as much when it comes to housing prices. People are still living with their parents into their mid to late 20's and the biggest drain of income is rent by a significant amount, just like the US.

Also, taxes in the US are not any better. I know half a dozen peers who moved all the way to California for high salary jobs and the chance of a better life. Here's what they encountered:

Gross $100k / yr in CA (most populated state)
Federal taxes: $39,180 (39%)
CA state tax: $6,047 (6%)
CA sales tax: 7.25%
That's 45% already on just taxes and 7.25% on everything you purchase after.

Don't want to live with mom? The median rent in CA according to Zillow is $2,900 / mo. So $34,800 / yr (35%).
You probably need a car to get to work. Car insurance itself is between $2,000 - $2,300 / yr depending (on the source) and mandatory. (2%).

So that's 82% already gone on just taxes, rent, and car insurance. Ok, so you have $18,000 on average for everything else and you'll have to pay an extra 7.25% of it each purchase (plus, likely a 2% charge from VISA or Mastercard that gets pushed to the customer for paying with card).

That's $1,500 / mo average for food, clothing, electricity, water bill, etc. Let's say you keep $900.

At some point you stop spending on necessaries and start saving for a house...which is $744,000 (median price according to Zillow).
It will take you 69 years to pay for a house if you somehow got a 0% interest loan. If I lived in CA, I would give up too. Especially with OLD and the way job applications are handled these days. A house, a woman, and stable work are the bare minimum things all men need, and each of those goals grinds them up, especially when alternative ways of doing things ("just go outside") start to disappear in favor of the new, more grindy way.

And that's on a six figure salary. Median household income is $84,000 (census.gov). But if you're a young man, you're not a household. You're a single person, so it's even less. Every person I know who moved to CA for that nice looking salary came back after 5 years burned out with not much to show for it. This is what people graduating college start out with, plus $40,000 - $60,000 in student debt. You don't get that debt in Europe, but the rest is basically the same.

I've written a post like this somewhere on the internet about 50-70 times over the years. I'm starting to think the concepts of limits and bottlenecks is a "but I did eat breakfast today" kind of thing for anyone over 35.

It's well known in The US that California is not a smart place to be financially. There's a mass Exodus out of that state. Did your peers not know this?

 

[The Duke]

I reached those calculations by doing tax calculations. The tax rate for someone making 100k is the same as the tax rate for someone making 100k. What is "average tax?"



How old are you? Above 35?
Also, half of Europeans don't buy houses. They buy flats, which is just a section of a house. Much cheaper.





Those above age 35 don't understand the concept of scarcity and it can't be taught to them. Let me ask you a question. How would you feel if you didn't eat breakfast this morning?

Those below 35 don't understand hard work and you just don't get whatever you want.

 

[Bigpapa]

I reached those calculations by doing tax calculations. The tax rate for someone making 100k is the same as the tax rate for someone making 100k. What is "average tax?"



How old are you? Above 35?
Also, half of Europeans don't buy houses. They buy flats, which is just a section of a house. Much cheaper.





Those above age 35 don't understand the concept of scarcity and it can't be taught to them. Let me ask you a question. How would you feel if you didn't eat breakfast this morning?

Idk. What's your point? That I suck at life? Why did you make this argument personal anyway? I'm pointing out the social problems which are causing young men to stay single and give up on dating. That's what this thread is about.

Average tax is the actual tax that you pay, because it is a progressive income tax ( for each threshold that you reach you pay the adequate tax rate only for the income that is between the tax brackets )

I am 33 and yes most of them have apartments instead of houses ( especially in the big cities )

Why you do not buy an apartment instead of house? At the end of the day you need a place where to live, it does not matter if it has a fence or not


When you will have the money, you can buy a house if for you is in important thing having a fence. When you have a family ( assuming that this is why you want a house, because of the space ) it becomes very important to have good schools nearby ( and usually the best schools are in the city center ) and in Europe there are little to no houses in the city center. And if there are houses, they are over 1 million euros. It basically considered luxury