I agree with most of this. In my experience you need to let her know that you are interested in her very early on. If she goes along with it great. If her response is one of disinterest you remove all attention from her and walk away.Disagree.....
Maybe pickup artists and dating coaches do use warning of the friendzone to motivate guys to take action,but they didn't create it for that purpose. The friendzone was around LONG BEFORE the PUA movement started.
The friendzone IS REAL. I know it is,because I fell in it one,two.....10,000 times before.....in my younger days before I "got" it.
I have a PHD in Friendzonology. NO ONE got friendzoned more than I did. It happened so much,I actually got to the point I could "sense" it starting to happen with a girl before it even came to pass....but I couldn't stop it from happening because I didn't know what I was doing that was causing it. I know NOW....but it was a NIGHTMARE back in my late teens to early 20s.
You DO. Letting a girl know you have interest as soon as possible gives you the BEST CHANCE of making something romantic/sexual happening. There's no NEUTRAL GROUND with a woman as far as HER EMOTIONS/FEELINGS are concerned.
She either sees you in a sexual light....or she don't. She either feels something towards you......or she don't.
Have you ever walked into a room at night? There's two ways you can have darkness in a room.
1: You can turn the light switch off.
Know what the other is? You can walk into a room that's already dark...and simply DO NOTHING.....as in don't flip the switch on.
With a woman,you can TURN HER OFF......either by your words or behavior. Or,you can do NOTHING......as in don't show interest....talk to her as just another person on the planet. If she's at a counter,you walk up,conduct your business,then go on. You didn't turn her off with some attraction-killing words or behavior,but you didn't flirt/compliment/show sexual interest either.
If you come in contact with her MULTIPLE TIMES,over a long period of time....NOT SHOWING INTEREST....she'll get used to you being that way. In essense,you'll get friendzoned by DEFAULT.
This is why when a guy does finally make a move on a chick he's had lots of contact with WITHOUT being sexual or showing some type of interest,you get the "I don't see you THAT WAY".....or "I don't like you LIKE THAT" type comments.
It's not the girl's fault.
You say the girl has to have feelings first before the action to work,that you have to get her emotions invested BEFORE being upfront can be effective. Ok......HOW? How do you do this?
I'm in a store....see some cute chick I've never seen before,would like to take her out. I say you have to be upfront about your interest.
You say I have to get her emotionally invested FIRST. How would you suggest this be done? I do KINDA agree with you.
Uhh......true......but......this is kinda OFF TOPIC. I'm going by THE TITLE of this thread. It's not about whether she reciprocates or not. Not about whether she rejects you or not. It's about whether the friendzone is a MYTH or not.....her saying yes or no to a date with you has NO BEARING on that.
And I'm saying being upfront WILL AUTOMATICALLY KILL ANY CHANCES of you getting friendzoned......whether she says yes or no.
If she says yes,you get a date.
If she says no,you move on to the next girl.
Where's the friendzone in that?
ok....uhhh.....kinda too much to unpack here. Maybe some guys do this: I don't know. I just know I DON'T.
MY purpose in being upfront is to IMMEDIATELY present myself as a possible sexual option. See this way,she CAN'T SAY "I don't see you that way" because I presented myself "that way" FROM THE VERY BEGINNING. She knows from the getgo I see her sexually....as a WOMAN. I inserted the idea of HER AND I into her mind. Whether she accepts it or rejects it...that's up to her......but IT'S THERE.
I agree. MY POINT....is that that emotional investment has to have A BEGINNING. It has to start from somewhere.
And while emotional investment TAKES TIME..........a SPARK DOES NOT. A spark can be generated in AN INSTANT........hence,MY PURPOSE in being upfront.
OK.......I think there's a slight distinction that needs to be understood here.....
You said if a woman in a 3 year relationship breaks it off and goes with a new guy,do we think the new guy won her over cause he "spilled his guts" right away to her.
I don't think showing interest in a woman...and "spilling your guts" is the same thing. If I see some random chick I want to talk to,showing my interest just means I find her attractive and want to take her out.........not that I "love" or have deep feelings for her. She knows she's not special,cause I could LITERALLY turn my head,see another girl,and be just as attracted to her or more. She KNOWS that.
"Spilling your guts" suggests FEELINGS. I can't have feelings/an emotional bond towards some chick I just saw for the first time ever. If you approach a girl giving out that type of vibe,you're right.....she'll run for the hills.
Well I disagree with you on this one. I have enough friendzone experiences TO KNOW the sh1t IS REAL. I also know what causes it.......and I'm telling you......being upfront with your interest GREATLY DECREASES your chances of getting friendzoned.
I didn't say you'd automatically get the girl. Just that the hurdle of possibly getting friendzoned would be removed.
Men are in the friend zone because they allow themselves to be. Cut off the attention and walk away.