Hello Friend,

If this is your first visit to SoSuave, I would advise you to START HERE.

It will be the most efficient use of your time.

And you will learn everything you need to know to become a huge success with women.

Thank you for visiting and have a great day!

4 months into the breakup, I managed to re-establish contact with my ex and got her to agree to sit in a "therapy" session with me

mrgoodstuff

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Tiger Woods cheated on his wife repeatedly. Is he a low value man? He's just one example of many...

The reality is men want the best of both worlds - A stable female anchor at home + new, strange, adventure sex on the side.
"anchor" as in anchor leg on the 4x400M relay, a consisitent ACE partner that's going to get it DONE. Not "anchor" as in a boat anchor, to restrict and eliminate motion.

We need high quality relationship partners that amplify our effect on the worlds, not ones that shrink and diminish us.

My story is the archetypal story of Man.

Chasing your ex is not low value if you've made mistakes and want to make amends and reconcile. It's low value if you made no mistakes in the relationship and she simply lost attraction and money-branched (that's beside the point anyway because I've made enough effort and I've given up the ghost now).
With the EX situation will and many of us have been in this position. It's best if it's HER idea to get you back. Chasing her will lower your position from where you currently stand.

How it's done is you get your life good, and have a great dating and romance life. It has to be HER idea to see the good in you and become re-attracted.
 

mrgoodstuff

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Plenty of "sex addicts" like myself find themselves in relationships in a subdued period and are monogamous for a time, before the craving for sex with different women comes back. That's normal.

Men cheating on their partners is one of the most common things in the world, particularly for men who find it easy to seduce and have sex with different women.
WTF is a sex addict? To some of these stiff ultra conservative types it may be a man or woman who prefers to have sex with their spouse MOST nights. They want everyone to hate physical contact and to endure sex like themselves.

Do you really think every sexual person needs to swap out the vaginas and c0cks all the time? Some appreciate what they have and can LOVE it for many years on end.
 

Spaz

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The more you chase, the more you lower ur value in her eyes.

It's the opposite for women.

As for the cheating, it's not really the issue although it may seem so to both of you.

She has subconsciously lost attraction/love towards you for some time now and would use female logic to somehow turn it around, this is natural for women.

A women's love is bound by 2 things only, 1st admiration and 2nd respect.

You didn't conjure up enough admirable qualities as a man thus she has lost respect towards you and that's always the killing blow in any male/female dynamic.

If a man has both admirable qualities and also commands respect, women in general will provide "excuses" on his wandering ways and would stick with him, because he's one hella of a man.
 

Lookatu

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The more you chase, the more you lower ur value in her eyes.

It's the opposite for women.

As for the cheating, it's not really the issue although it may seem so to both of you.

She has subconsciously lost attraction/love towards you for some time now and would use female logic to somehow turn it around, this is natural for women.

A women's love is bound by 2 things only, 1st admiration and 2nd respect.

You didn't conjure up enough admirable qualities as a man thus she has lost respect towards you and that's always the killing blow in any male/female dynamic.

If a man has both admirable qualities and also commands respect, women in general will provide "excuses" on his wandering ways and would stick with him, because he's one hella of a man.
A couple years ago, I would've thought you were full of $hit with this line of thinking but I have verified from several horse's mouth that this is true. But I will say that it's not very common, especially the more friend's she has that she relies on advice from. If you meet an independent thinker type or one with no friends or only a couple, this can be possible.
 

Spaz

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A couple years ago, I would've thought you were full of $hit with this line of thinking but I have verified from several horse's mouth that this is true. But I will say that it's not very common, especially the more friend's she has that she relies on advice from. If you meet an independent thinker type or one with no friends or only a couple, this can be possible.
It is common because I am a living example.

Everything I've ever said on Sosuave is a direct reflection of me, what I've gone through, am going through.

I've been caught multiple times and my answer has always been the same "may the best woman win".

They'll huff, they'll puff and they'll blow everything...all the dramas you could think of, I've seen and experienced it all.

But in the end, they all come back, maybe pouting, angry, mad, sad, etc at 1st but it just disappears in a day or 2 and is replaced by a more loving woman, well maybe the right word would be more possessive.

That's why I can spin plates for multiple years.
 

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Suave88

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*Caveat - this is a long post about stalking and repeated attempts to get my ex back. I ask for no judgements because what I have done here may be extremely ill-advised from a legal standpoint.

I initially joined SoSuave because of a breakup with the hottest girl I've ever been with. This is the first time I've ever experienced any pain or Oneitis associated with a girl. I have lots of experience with women and this is truly my first "fall" as a man. My ego took an extreme hit from this experience and has led me to engage in risky behaviour that I never would have imagined myself capable of.

Here's the story;

The relationship with my Oneitis went for 2.5 years. I was struggling with sex addiction throughout the relationship and got caught cheating several times over the course of the first year we were together. The cheating was bad. The final time I was caught, she found videos of me having sex with another woman on my phone (first person camera view, doggy style on our bed). Long story short, this basically traumatised her and led to a series of very short-term break-ups. Crucial to getting her back was we remained in contact and I was able to attract her back. The relationship continued for another year.

The final break-up came when I basically preempted that she was planning to leave me. She was emotionally distancing, spending more time with her friends, becoming more dismissive towards me - I don't think she ever forgave me for cheating + I became somewhat beta in the final year by not really "leading" the relationship anymore and acting more aloof and letting her do whatever she wanted. I wasn't the confident alpha anymore that she had met at the beginning of our relationship. I acted more emotional and needy in this final year, smoked loads of weed, and emotionally checked myself out of the relationship in the final months I was with her. The sex stopped about 2 weeks before we broke up the final time, and this was largely because I wouldn't initiate and I'd become sulky and dejected.

I orchestrated the break-up, but messed it up by getting violently angry by how easily she agreed to end it at first. The outcome I was hoping for was she would beg me back, and this was misguided. I had given her ammunition. After she left, she became upset and chased me for a few days after the break-up. I ghosted her while I sorted my head out. 3 days later I tried to contact her and found out that I was blocked everywhere.

After I was blocked, I went No Contact for about a week to see if this was temporary. After a week I made significant efforts to re-establish dialogue. I was blocked from all avenues (facebook, whatsapp, alternate phone number etc.) I then made the cardinal mistake of going to her place and talking to her through the intercom (she wouldn't come out to meet me because she "didn't feel safe"). This conversation through the intercom did give me some useful information though - She had begun seeing a therapist and I realised I was up against a professional who had deemed our relationship "toxic" and my ex had undergone the lightswitch effect (flicked a switch in her mind and completely re-written our history). She was cold and completely uninterested in reconciliation. I ended the conversation and went into 2 months of No Contact. During this time I sought therapy from different professionals, got lots of different perspectives, and underwent a transformation. I learned a lot about myself and came to the conclusion that I had lost a good woman, maybe the best woman I'd ever find. I understand that this is scarcity mindset, but I couldn't shake the feeling that I'd truly lost a special girl and, as time went on, these feelings persisted. I also truly regret the mistakes I made in the relationship, and feel I could build a stronger and healthier relationship with her if I ever had the chance again.

Eventually, I felt strong enough to try and re-engage with my ex and felt I was strongly placed to re-attract her. After 2 months of No Contact, I expected her to be a bit more receptive to talking. This turned out to be misguided. I reached out to her on the one avenue where I knew I wasn't blocked - LinkedIn. The message was casual, non-needy and giving brief and light-hearted updates about my life, and also expressing regret for what had happened. I was blocked on LinkedIn about a week later. At this point I realised I was facing a very difficult situation, and I spiralled into depression as my plans for reconciliation appeared to be decimated.

A month went by and I wasn't feeling any better. I was holding onto hope that at some point she may reach out, but I realised I had no control over this and that it may never happen. I dated and banged other women in this time, but none compared to her.

After a month, by chance, I saw my ex walking down the street as I was drove past her. Me and my ex live a few hundred metres apart so it was bound to happen. She looked awful, like she had aged 10 years. I put this down to either heavy drinking or medication she may have been taking. This put the idea in my head that, due her appearing unhappy, that maybe I should try to reconnect again. I went about it badly (of course) as I had no other way of reaching her other than an alternate number or going to her place. I tried calling her and going to her place several times and was ignored. I began to seriously worry that I may end up with a stalking charge and that I shouldn't make any more attempts. I let it lie for a week. I received no contact from the police and I noticed she hadn't blocked the alternate number I'd tried to call her from. My imagination took hold - "Was she enjoying these attempts I was making? Does she want to see me chase?" This was dangerous thinking, but it led me to make one final attempt.

I went to her place today. A tenant let me into the building and I went to her front door in her apartment complex. I heard her talking on the phone through the door. She sounded like she was talking to someone official, maybe the police or her therapist, because she said "I think he's actually at my door now. Can you wait on the line please?"

She then called out my name. I spoke to her through the door and met resistance in the form of "I don't want you calling me or coming here. It's scary." I disarmed her by saying that I was just checking she was okay because she'd vanished without a word and had threatened suicide in the past. I told her I wasn't chasing a relationship and that I'd been seeing a therapist who had opened my eyes to mistakes I'd made in the relationship and that I'd been on a journey. I asked her to join me in a therapy session for support. She immediately agreed, but asked me to get my therapist to get in contact with her. I told her my therapist will be in touch. She pulled back a bit by saying that she "couldn't promise anything."

I'm waiting now for my therapist to confirm an appointment with her. I realise that if my ex is able to sit with me in a room for an hour then my chances of re-attracting her are quite good. I assume that if she was completely over me then she would have rejected the therapy session outright.

That's where I'm up to. Thanks for reading. I thought I'd share my crazy, semi-illegal, getting-my-ex-back story with this forum. I'd appreciate any perspectives on my situation.
Go to the therapy and meet your ex. If it does not work, it doesn't, but try your best. From the therapy to the doggy and 69 style. The threat is just a bridge to connect both of you and maybe she even created it.
 

HyenaPrince

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Like Elon Musk fooling with Johnny Depp abusive and unstable wife Amber Heard.
Elon obviously has a strong inclination towards getting what he wants. I've read somewhere that he chased her for years. She's a horrible creature anyway.

Do you think Tiger was acting far out of the norm relative to his peers?
I don't know. Infidelity is not limited to high profile celebrities. Most people (with options) do it. So you see, it's a matter of options. Your, let's say, loyalty or will power is inversely correlated with your options. Tiger Woods clearly was in the upper percentile of the "options" spectrum.

So it's safe to say his will power was more often than not tested, and eventually broken. People are loyal until they aren't. It's not a static state of being.
 

mrgoodstuff

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Elon obviously has a strong inclination towards getting what he wants. I've read somewhere that he chased her for years. She's a horrible creature anyway.
He was a fool to want her if he could look at the info on how she did her husband.



I don't know. Infidelity is not limited to high profile celebrities. Most people (with options) do it. So you see, it's a matter of options. Your, let's say, loyalty or will power is inversely correlated with your options. Tiger Woods clearly was in the upper percentile of the "options" spectrum.

So it's safe to say his will power was more often than not tested, and eventually broken. People are loyal until they aren't. It's not a static state of being.
 

mrgoodstuff

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Elon obviously has a strong inclination towards getting what he wants. I've read somewhere that he chased her for years. She's a horrible creature anyway.


I don't know. Infidelity is not limited to high profile celebrities. Most people (with options) do it. So you see, it's a matter of options. Your, let's say, loyalty or will power is inversely correlated with your options. Tiger Woods clearly was in the upper percentile of the "options" spectrum.

So it's safe to say his will power was more often than not tested, and eventually broken. People are loyal until they aren't. It's not a static state of being.
I'm sure over 50% of Tigers peers were participating in the same activities. "They" usually "cheat" more than the general population. So to put him up on a cross for it, seemed kind of hypocritical.
 

Pan87

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It's quite hard to conceptualise how destructive cheating is to a relationship until you actually go through it.

I'd agree with @Spaz that the real reason my relationship failed was a loss of attraction/love on her part. I lost frame after I cheated and became a different, less-confident man to the man she fell in love with in the beginning. It was my eventual loss of frame that spelled doom for this relationship. Women do forgive cheating if the man holds frame - but if the man whimpers, acts weird and goes into Beta atonement mode then that's when the relationship gets into real trouble (speaking from experience).
 

Spaz

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It's quite hard to conceptualise how destructive cheating is to a relationship until you actually go through it.

I'd agree with @Spaz that the real reason my relationship failed was a loss of attraction/love on her part. I lost frame after I cheated and became a different, less-confident man to the man she fell in love with in the beginning. It was my eventual loss of frame that spelled doom for this relationship. Women do forgive cheating if the man holds frame - but if the man whimpers, acts weird and goes into Beta atonement mode then that's when the relationship gets into real trouble (speaking from experience).
Move on and learn, not learn how to be better with women, that's a fallacy that many here don't understand and would keep on trying new techniques to no avail, how good u r with women or with anybody is all incumbent with who you actually are - that is ur frame, the sum total of ur being.

Frame = ur inherent personality and ur childhood upbringing - - - >(influences) + how you currently think - - - - >(influences) + how you do things.

Ur inherent personality and ur upbringing can't be changed.

But the way you think can.

Focus on knowledge and as you get better at doing things, ur frame will also change in tandem with the results.
 

Pan87

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Here's an update from my experience:

I'm posting this as a different perspective for any guy who wants to get their ex back

I have realised that the No Contact rule is a false move if your goal is to "get your ex back."

The penny dropped for me when I discovered that the mainstream Therapist's method for permanently breaking up a couple is No Contact. Why would therapists advise this if they thought it would lead to reconciliation?

Women move on in No Contact, unless they were alpha widowed and the guy ended the relationship. That's not the case for most of us here. In most cases the women ends the relationship because of either a drop in attraction, she sees no future with you, or the relationship was unbearably toxic (mine was the latter).

The reality is that a woman's negative perception of the man will become cemented in No Contact. She will move on. Women are creatures of "the moment" and you are only as good as your last "moment" with her, according Briffault's Law and the Light Switch Effect.

The only way to interfere with this process is you must re-engage her and show her a new image that will mess with her final image of you, as a man.

I spoke with my ex on the phone for 1.5 hours yesterday. It was the best progress I've seen since we broke up.

I've gone against all established wisdom and I chased her, from a strong frame. I never "begged" or pleaded with her. I never asked to recommence our relationship. My goal was to re-establish dialogue and focus on having a positive and masculine interaction with her.

There were things she said on the phone call that altered my view about No Contact being an attractive play for the man. She said "you're very persistent" - her voice dripping in sex. She also recounted how I'd strangled her and had violent sex with her as punishment throughout the relationship - again, her voice dripping in sex. She sees me as dangerous and this is how she's framed me (it's also false - I only strangled her once, and I used to have rough sex with her, but never violent. This shows how women re-write history to reflect their final moment with you).

Apparently women don't like being pursued. I think this is wrong (if mistakes were made in the relationship). I think women actually enjoy being pursued from a female ego point-of-view. The goal of this is to lure her back into your orbit, even if it's under the guise of "friendship." Once communication has been re-establish, then there's an opportunity to turn the tables and re-attract her. Once she's re-attracted then your pursuit of her should stop and you should settle into the healthy masculine/feminine frame of her pursuing you.

The established wisdom of "No Contact" and "avoid the friendzone at all costs" is propaganda designed to protect women from falling back into relationships.
 

lamath

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Here's an update from my experience:

I'm posting this as a different perspective for any guy who wants to get their ex back

I have realised that the No Contact rule is a false move if your goal is to "get your ex back."

The penny dropped for me when I discovered that the mainstream Therapist's method for permanently breaking up a couple is No Contact. Why would therapists advise this if they thought it would lead to reconciliation?

Women move on in No Contact, unless they were alpha widowed and the guy ended the relationship. That's not the case for most of us here. In most cases the women ends the relationship because of either a drop in attraction, she sees no future with you, or the relationship was unbearably toxic (mine was the latter).

The reality is that a woman's negative perception of the man will become cemented in No Contact. She will move on. Women are creatures of "the moment" and you are only as good as your last "moment" with her, according Briffault's Law and the Light Switch Effect.

The only way to interfere with this process is you must re-engage her and show her a new image that will mess with her final image of you, as a man.

I spoke with my ex on the phone for 1.5 hours yesterday. It was the best progress I've seen since we broke up.

I've gone against all established wisdom and I chased her, from a strong frame. I never "begged" or pleaded with her. I never asked to recommence our relationship. My goal was to re-establish dialogue and focus on having a positive and masculine interaction with her.

There were things she said on the phone call that altered my view about No Contact being an attractive play for the man. She said "you're very persistent" - her voice dripping in sex. She also recounted how I'd strangled her and had violent sex with her as punishment throughout the relationship - again, her voice dripping in sex. She sees me as dangerous and this is how she's framed me (it's also false - I only strangled her once, and I used to have rough sex with her, but never violent. This shows how women re-write history to reflect their final moment with you).

Apparently women don't like being pursued. I think this is wrong (if mistakes were made in the relationship). I think women actually enjoy being pursued from a female ego point-of-view. The goal of this is to lure her back into your orbit, even if it's under the guise of "friendship." Once communication has been re-establish, then there's an opportunity to turn the tables and re-attract her. Once she's re-attracted then your pursuit of her should stop and you should settle into the healthy masculine/feminine frame of her pursuing you.

The established wisdom of "No Contact" and "avoid the friendzone at all costs" is propaganda designed to protect women from falling back into relationships.
No contact is not for getting women back its for moving on its good for both parties.
Its for accepting that a break up is final. Not accepting that a break up might be final is when you get into neediness territory.
Once some type of outcome indifference is reach maybe you can
 

Pan87

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No contact is not for getting women back its for moving on its good for both parties.
Its for accepting that a break up is final. Not accepting that a break up might be final is when you get into neediness territory.
Once some type of outcome indifference is reach maybe you can
No Contact is for moving on, as you say. But if your goal is to get her back then it's a disaster. Women are emotionally-wired differently to men and they are able to move on quickly - see Rollo's "War Brides."

Apparently it is weak and needy to try and get an ex back.....but it doesn't have to be. When you pursue your ex to re-establish dialogue, don't be weak and needy about it. Be cool and calculated. It's like a game of chess.

Losing a good woman, feeling regret, and attempting to get her back is not weak. It's ballsy. It takes a man to admit mistakes to himself and try and re-establish a relationship with someone precious from a "strong frame." Most men just can't bear the emotional anguish of pursuit and recede into a beta hole of No Contact, taking years to heal.

Maybe a woman can never regain respect for a man she has lost attraction for, but this doesn't make sense to me. If women are creatures "of the moment" and are experts at re-writing history, then doesn't it stand to reason that you can reset a woman's attraction and perception of you? (like a goldfish circling a bowl).
 

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daproest1

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I hate you guys lol lost my ex almost 2 years ago. It’ll be a year in August since we last spoke. And I’ve been slowly but surely squashing The idea of even the slightest possibility of ever getting her back. Although that’s the woman I’d Happily spend my life with. I just can’t tolerate any weakness in myself anymore. Now reading all this sh*t my stupid brain goes “oh, no contact is stupid, there’s hope”
 

mrgoodstuff

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No Contact is for moving on, as you say. But if your goal is to get her back then it's a disaster. Women are emotionally-wired differently to men and they are able to move on quickly - see Rollo's "War Brides."

Apparently it is weak and needy to try and get an ex back.....but it doesn't have to be. When you pursue your ex to re-establish dialogue, don't be weak and needy about it. Be cool and calculated. It's like a game of chess.

Losing a good woman, feeling regret, and attempting to get her back is not weak. It's ballsy. It takes a man to admit mistakes to himself and try and re-establish a relationship with someone precious from a "strong frame." Most men just can't bear the emotional anguish of pursuit and recede into a beta hole of No Contact, taking years to heal.

Maybe a woman can never regain respect for a man she has lost attraction for, but this doesn't make sense to me. If women are creatures "of the moment" and are experts at re-writing history, then doesn't it stand to reason that you can reset a woman's attraction and perception of you? (like a goldfish circling a bowl).
No contact is for the man to reclaim control in his life. Trying to get an ex back is a futile disempowering deal. How life works is your done with her. Get back to living. Later on some years later she may notice you with your Stuff going good.
I hate you guys lol lost my ex almost 2 years ago. It’ll be a year in August since we last spoke. And I’ve been slowly but surely squashing The idea of even the slightest possibility of ever getting her back. Although that’s the woman I’d Happily spend my life with. I just can’t tolerate any weakness in myself anymore. Now reading all this sh*t my stupid brain goes “oh, no contact is stupid, there’s hope”
Its weakness. If she wants you back she'll search you out. Onto better things.
 

mrgoodstuff

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I hate you guys lol lost my ex almost 2 years ago. It’ll be a year in August since we last spoke. And I’ve been slowly but surely squashing The idea of even the slightest possibility of ever getting her back. Although that’s the woman I’d Happily spend my life with. I just can’t tolerate any weakness in myself anymore. Now reading all this sh*t my stupid brain goes “oh, no contact is stupid, there’s hope”
How has your growth and improvement been with her gone? Probably making better decisions?
 

mrgoodstuff

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Tiger Woods cheated on his wife repeatedly. Is he a low value man? He's just one example of many...

The reality is men want the best of both worlds - A stable female anchor at home + new, strange, adventure sex on the side.

My story is the archetypal story of Man.

Chasing your ex is not low value if you've made mistakes and want to make amends and reconcile. It's low value if you made no mistakes in the relationship and she simply lost attraction and money-branched (that's beside the point anyway because I've made enough effort and I've given up the ghost now).
Chasing if will bleed down any gains and strength that you built while away from her. Ask the guys. You'll become less attractive if you keep chasing her too. It has to be her idea.
 

bcude

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No Contact is for moving on, as you say. But if your goal is to get her back then it's a disaster. Women are emotionally-wired differently to men and they are able to move on quickly - see Rollo's "War Brides."
No it's not a disaster. You failed to mention something called "the fading effect bias", which means the more time passes, the more the human brain tends to fill up with GOOD memories of something and downplay the bad stuff. No Contact is for the dumpée to move on, as a side effect it balances out the immediate power imbalance somewhat as time goes by.
They surely move on quicker than men but it's still highly individual how fast she will move on. Everything is about her perception of you, the relationship you had, her current situation, needs etc. too many factors to make it this black and white. No contact works in the dumpées favor in many many ways to where it's the by far the best option for the majority.

Apparently it is weak and needy to try and get an ex back.....but it doesn't have to be. When you pursue your ex to re-establish dialogue, don't be weak and needy about it. Be cool and calculated. It's like a game of chess.
Well yes, but that's the problem and why No Contact is a thing in the first place. Being cool and calculated about it sounds easy in theory but the majority of guys, myself included can't think straight (even though i know the theory) immediately after a breakup with a woman who played a huge part of my life. Your emotions are stronger than logic and you can't hide from them. That's why time and space is needed - to think clearly again. When you reach that stage again, then you can do whatever but that's missing the point that we shouldn't pursue broken things. It's a futile endeavour. Experience has taught us that you might re-establish some sort of relationship for a brief period of time, until the same things make it break again. You can't negotiate true desire and when she's re-establishing contact then that dynamic is atleast somewhat established and you might have a better shot.

Losing a good woman, feeling regret, and attempting to get her back is not weak. It's ballsy. It takes a man to admit mistakes to himself and try and re-establish a relationship with someone precious from a "strong frame." Most men just can't bear the emotional anguish of pursuit and recede into a beta hole of No Contact, taking years to heal.
Many tried, and most failed. Being the dumpée you will never walk away having a strong frame. If a relationship becomes so broken/bad/toxic/not sustainable that she needs to be the one to end it before you do (because the signs are always obvious and there, cheating excluded), she'll lose even more respect for you and never see you as 'strong', no matter how strong you think you were during your time together. Women despise having to be the dumper since it's not a pleasant thing to do and they expect the man to show the balls and put them straight or to end it. It still takes two persons to make it work and the person getting dumped naturally tends to blame himself quite alot after the fact. You can still ask yourself why do you want to be with someone that doesn't want to be with you?
Yeah, you got 'weak' and messed up and know better now, but do you want to be with someone that left you that easily and now views you as a suboptimal mating partner on a fundamental level. Emotions may be fleeting but having shown weakness in the past sits DEEP within women, they just don't forget weakness.

Maybe a woman can never regain respect for a man she has lost attraction for, but this doesn't make sense to me. If women are creatures "of the moment" and are experts at re-writing history, then doesn't it stand to reason that you can reset a woman's attraction and perception of you? (like a goldfish circling a bowl).
I believe it's possible to regain respect but it's just not a good investment of your time since it's an uphill battle the whole time, instead of starting fresh with no obstacles with someone who might see you as their superhero.
Also bear in mind that this is a forum of self-improvement and it makes sense not to encourage people to make bad investments of their time and going after an ex that doesn't want to be with you is.

It's good to have the common views challenged.
Keep us updated, might be informative.
 
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