The Guide To The First Date.

Discussion in 'Don Juan Tips' started by Grey Fox, Jun 25, 2003.

  1. Grey Fox

    Grey Fox Master Don Juan

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    Not to long ago, a young pip-squeak from high school came into the store where I work. I sell clothing at my summer job and he was in my section of the store, and had overheard my talking about the different types of women you meet at a club and why women go to clubs, so wanted my advice because "You sound you know what your talking about."(I like to think I do.) Needless to say he wanted my advice on what kind of clothing to wear, he would have gone with something that looked like he had just come off a construction site, but I steered him towards something nice and cost effective. As I showed him my wares he asked all sorts of questions, he seemed to be an AFC but his heart was in the right place, so I obliged his questions. By the time we were finished I felt that I could put together a book on this one subject after fielding his questions, but then I thought "Better yet I'll make a guide for it so my fellow DJs and DJs in training can have something to get advice from instead of flooding the board every week asking the same question: What do I do on a first date?"

    So I proudly present to you, my guide to the first date that will hopefully lead to a second date if she's worth it.

    THE APPROACH:

    First off, no first date will ever happen unless you ask. I usually find that after building up some rapport with a woman that using the following combination of words seems to get the point across and will lead to a date: "Hey, I just had a great thought, give me your phone number and we can hang out some time." If she says no, eh I don't care anymore what they say, life is to short and I've noticed that there is always another pretty to catch my attention. If she says yes, well then I guess I will have to call her then; because I only ask for numbers if I am really going to call. Woman ask for numbers to keep as trophies, but those women are Wh0res, and your not one of those are you? Of course not so the next thing we should tackle is that first phone call to set up the date.

    THE CALL:

    Believe it or not, you can put yourself in a hole here that you can't climb out of, or you can seriously improve your chances by how you carry yourself. There are 5 keys to having a sucessful phone conversation for setting up the first date.

    1. Wait four to five days before making the first call. It gives you time to figure some stuff out like where to go and what to do. Also you it sets you apart from those desperate AFCs who call the day after they get a number, nobody likes a boot-licker so why act like one by calling her and acting like an attention starved puppy?

    2. Be confident. No girl likes to hear "Um gee <her name,> I was thinking, uh, since you gave me this number and all. That well we might, um, go out on, um...a date(said in a meek tone that gives the girl the impression your already curling up in a fetal position to take the blow of rejection which you believe you'll get.) Look you already got her number right? Well son, you just won half the battle right there. The other half is dating and sex, and thats the fun part. So you have every right to be confident, knowing that your training as a DJ has paid off. What a girl likes to hear will sound something like this: (Your asking her if she wants to go out with you in a confident tone, one which conveys your power and pride as a DJ.)

    3. Get to the point. No need to build up a rapport, she already knows why your calling. Save all that stuff you would say to build up to asking the question for the date. That way you have something to talk about on your date.

    4. Know what you want to do. You call up not knowing what you want to do, and she'll not know why she bothered to give you her number in the first place. Be able to give her the time and place of where the date it is. If you sound like you know what your doing, she'll respect that. Be sure its geared towards something fun, that way you'll have fun no matter what.

    5. Keep it short. Whats the point of talking to her after you've got your date all set up? Seriously you got what you want, why d1ck around on the phone longer than you have to? The longer you yap the faster her legs will snap shut on you. Keep the conversation no longer than 15 minutes and thats only if she is squaking her head off. If its a normal conversation it should take about 8 minutes factoring in the questions she'll ask about the date or the obligatory "Oh, we're going to have some much fun." Speeches she is legally obligated to throw out.

    Keep these things in mind and you won't go wrong. But, before you can make the call, you have to know what you want to do.

    ACTIVITES FOR THE DATE:

    A good date is like valuable real estate. Its all about location, location, location. No girl wants to sit around doing nothing, and unless she's a cool gal she may not be enthralled with the idea of just having a quiet dinner at her's or your place. Unlike the movies, doing that quiet dinner in thing is not as entertaining for a woman as you might think. Hence why "going out on a date" means "going out," your changing the scenery because it keeps things interesting. Also she wants to see how you handle yourself in the real world, and you can't do that sitting in either one of your homes. So I will suggest some places to take your date.

    1. The Coffee House: Most people drink coffee, the date can be quick and you can chat briefly. This is good for laying out the common ground between you, and will help you set up future dates that tailor to both your interests. You find out she likes the movies, you like th movies, here's a crazy idea go to the movies for your next date. Also the coffee house date can be quick so you can cut out if things take a dive.

    2. Dinner: What woman doesn't like a delicious meal and stimulating conversation? By stimulating I mean you her all about her little life while you throw in some of your stories.(Don't give away to much.) If your not a strong conversationalist you maybe out of your depth here.

    3. Movies: You spend time together, and yet your engaged by another activity, when your done you can talk about how interesting the movie is going to be. And when its over you can talk about it further. The beauty behind the movie date is that it gives you a common subject to talk about on your way to and from the movie.

    4. Mini golf, and bowling, pool hall: Action dates, excellent chance your kino as you rub up against her body as you instruct her how to play better.(And play the right way for that matter.)

    5. Bars and Clubs: I'd steer away from this one as bars and clubs may be a bit to noisy to have a "meaningful" conversation in. But the alcohol and the atmosphere of the establishment will deflate some of your anxiety. Also dancing, needless to say, give you great oppurtunity for kino and shows her how good in bed you can be.(Women believe that you dance like you make love.)

    Whether you choose an "action date" or the cliche "dinner and a movie" it doesn't matter to much, because she is on the date to see and know you. In the end your going to have to show her that in any situation your impressive. Whatever you choose to do, pick something you'll have fun at, if she doesn't enjoy herself then there might be something wrong with her attitude.(But honestly if you set your date up as going to a comic book convention expect to return to the fortess of solitude, alone again Poindexter.) Of course going out in public means you have to have clothes and looked well groomed, otherwise people will wonder what desert island you were stranded on.

    CLOTHES AND GROOMING:

    First you should always groom yourself before the clothes go on. You don't want to drip toothpaste, mousse, gel, shaving cream or shampoo on what your going to wear.(If you dripping shampoo on your clothes you may want to take your clothes off, before you take a shower.) Wheither or not you have a beard, goatee, moustache, soul patch whatever, looked clean shaving. If a guy can get past the hair between a girls legs to service her, I think a woman can deal with a little facial hair. Brush, floss, apply deoderant and colonge. A note on colonge, colonge shouldn't be applied so that you leave a vapor trail where ever you go. It should be faint, and only really detectable when she gets real close to you, that way if she likes the smell she has to stay real close otherwise she can't enjoy the olfactory sensation you give her.(Translation: you smell good so she sticks close to smell that wonderful odor, just don't fart.)

    IF THERE IS ONE THING YOU TAKE AWAY FROM THIS ARTICLE LET IT BE THIS: Clothes DON'T make the man. The man makes the clothes look GOOD. The clothing you wear is only a phyisicall manifestation of how you feel about yourself. Wear something nice, crisp and sharp and you saying your a confident guy with all his sh1t together. Wear wrinkled, tasteless, and ragged clothing your saying that mom hasn't gotten around to doing your laundry yet. I prefer clothing that is soft to the touch like silk, microfiber, cotton and linen blends that have been softened. Why you ask? It gives woman a reason to touch you. And when they find that touching you and clothing feels good, the associate that touching you feels good. The more touch and for that matter the heavier the touching the more pleasurable it will be for them. Okay so your dressed, you made your plans and called and she wants to go, know you wander what you should do on your date? Well thats going to be answered on the next post.

    -Grey Fox
     
  2. Grey Fox

    Grey Fox Master Don Juan

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    The Guide To The First Date Part II.

    GENERAL DOES AND DON'TS THE FIRST DATE:

    1. Don't call an hour before your date, it seems clingy.
    2. Flowers aren't needed at this point, I find that flowers are best kept for the second date, its a nice subtle way of saying "Hey good work you got my attention, and I'm interested in you." When you do buy flowers buy 5, 12 is to many and only buying one looks like you haven't bought flowers since prom night.
    3. Hold the door for her, help her in and out the car, and pull out her chair. This gentlemen bit isn't done to often these days, it kinda signals to her your a cut above the rest. This doesn't mean act like a nice guy, just show her you can make her feel special by doing the small things.
    4. Avoid being a slobbering idiot, she may have the body and face that can launch a thousands ships and burn Troy to the ground. But, if act like a dumb struck buffon, she'll pull anchor on you and get away. Women want a man who can treat them like anyone else at first, once you get into a LTR then you can show them how special they are.
    5. Keep it light. They don't want to hear about your problems, and its bad enough when they talk about theirs so stay away from negative stuff.
    6. Pay for it. You asked her out so you gotta pay, cause being broke looks weak, and going dutch treat makes you look cheap.
    7. Let her do most of the talking, and when you talk, maintain the mystery of being you. Don't tell her your life's story, otherwise if she knows your whole deal, whats there to come back for?
    8. In an intellectual conversation, don't be afraid to disagree. Having your own opinion shows off your individuality as well as engages her to make the converstation go deeper.(But this doesn't mean you should start a fight, or take a I'm right and your wrong approach, allow for a little debate.)
    9. Don't worry about if she likes you. Its her job to worry wheither or not she is worthy of you.
    10. Holding hands can be weird. But walking arm and arm is suprisingly nice, you can say "its a lovely european custom"(which it is) and it give her a chance to feel the strenght in your arms.
    11. Kissing. No need to kiss on the first date, unless you make some serious headway. If she tries to kiss you, turn your head and let her kiss your check.(This is if you want to play a little game to up her interest level. This work great on HB's who will be left wondering why you didn't let her kiss you when every other guy would be jumping at the chance. They start to question their femine prowess, and the next time you kiss them for real they will feel its something special that your gracing them with.)
    12. Just because its a date doesn't mean you have to like her or try to create feelings for her, thats her job to convince you she's worth it. If she turns out to be a pyscho-ho beast that would make Martha Stewart seem companionable, then NEXT!
    13. Never set up a date on a date.
    14. Remember you are the man. Tell yourself that, know what a great catch you are, and she will know it to, and she'll come back for more.
    15. When in doubt trust your "inner voice" or instinct, not the one driven by the possibility of getting some or the one driven by fear. I'm talking about the voice that truely knows if the girl is worth it and if things are legit. That voice should be your heart, you can hear it if you pay attention.
    16. I don't think its been said enough around here so here it goes again: Always protect your heart.

    Well there's my guide its taken from the stuff I found useful that worked here, plus the stuff I learned over the years. Like any advice you can you all, some or none of this stuff. But what you do use, I promise you has been tested, and tried by fire if you will. REMEMBER, A FIRST DATE WILL ONLY HAPPEN IF YOU GET THAT NUMBER! So what's holding you back?

    -Grey Fox
     
  3. FlyGuy

    FlyGuy Master Don Juan

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    Good post, just wanna add my own perspective:

    True. This is why I prefer the "coffee date" for a first meeting. Its cheap, its not too serious, it doesn't setup the "courtship" frame of mind for her like going to dinner, it gives you a chance to talk and flirt, and if things are going bad you can call it quits fairly quickly. And if you don't hit it off with her you didn't waste $30 on dinner and another $20 on a movie.

    For second dates I think action is the way to go. Its another fairly cheap date, its fun, and you have more chance for conversation than going to see a movie. Seeing a movie is something I think is better for later on, its kind of a cop-out, cliche' date. To me it shows lack of imagination.

    I think its a good rule of thumb to NEVER invest too much in a girl until you know it will pay off. Some guys have a lot of extra money and don't mind paying $50 for a date with a girl whose interest level in you is questionable. I'm not one of those guys. Besides, if you start the trend of buying her things early on you set the stage for the REST of the relationship. To me it seems that a girl will be more likely to place you in the category of "provider" if you are always buying her things, especially early on. What makes this really bad is that when a girl sees you as a provider, often times she will hold back on the sex. If she sees you as more of a lover, you won't have that problem.

    Bottom line: you don't need to pay a lot of money to have fun.
     
  4. drixsa

    drixsa Master Don Juan

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    way to go FOX, the post is money, id say this one deserves a sticky
     
  5. Elimidate

    Elimidate Senior Don Juan

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    The longer you yap the faster her legs will snap shut on you


    Bwhahaha...so fVcking true!

    Talking on the phone give you nothing to talk about while you're with her and people wonder why when they meet up it's boring.

    How much Kino can you give on the phone?

    Well.. Maybe to yourself if its a 1-900 # but thats about it son! :p


    Elimidate
     
  6. Evil-Rom

    Evil-Rom Master Don Juan

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    Nice post!

    5-stars.
     
  7. Boono11

    Boono11 Senior Don Juan

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    about the call
    What would you think if it's been like ten days that you've had the number and didn't call? I misplaced the number and just recently found it. What are your thoughts?
     
  8. FlyGuy

    FlyGuy Master Don Juan

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    Call anyway, what have you got to lose? Don't tell her you lost her number though, if she asks then apolgize and explain that you were really busy (you could even use some humor here to diffuse the problem)
     
  9. drixsa

    drixsa Master Don Juan

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    how long to wait to call for the 2nd date?

    i usually wait another 3-4 days to set up plans
     
  10. Grey Fox

    Grey Fox Master Don Juan

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    Replies to your questions.

    Aight about the lost phone number call anyways if your interested. Think of it as test of her interest level that happened by accident, tell her you been real busy but you would like the pleasure of her company again.

    Calling about the second date. 3-7 days is fine depending, if your still deciding if she's worth it or not then take the 7 days. If you like her go for somewhere around 3 to 4.

    Second dates are just as important as the first. They can literally seal the deal with a woman and bud into an LTR. So whats the best way to figure her IL out without giving off the fact your real interested? Simple at the end of your second date, give her your phone number and say "Okay its your turn to call me. Till then bye." Say it with a ****y, confident smile. It puts the ball in her court and how many women have been told this? Its like saying "Okay I've shown some interest in you. But if you want me you gotta come after me just a little." This can excite and tease a woman in the worst way. Do it right and build up the anticipation and a third date "sex close" is not unheard of. Speaking of second dates maybe I ought to do another date guide for the second date since it is rather important. Thats if you guys want it though. Let me Know.

    -Grey Fox
     

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  11. Anson

    Anson Master Don Juan

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    Re: The Guide To The First Date Part II.

    I like your post, but this is the part that I disagree with. Well, not completely, if the date isn't going too well there isn't necessarily a need for you to kiss. But if it is going well, it is likely that she will let you kiss her - and if you kiss her ath the end of a well-going date (by giving just a small kiss on the lips), it will propably raise her interrest level even more. It kinda tells her that you are bold enough to kiss a woman you hardly even know ;)
     
  12. -HPNOTQ-

    -HPNOTQ- Don Juan

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    good stuff you sly fox

    nice to see how other fellas handle the first date senerio..i also never set the next date while i am on the current date..sounds kinda clingy, like you KNOW you have nothing else to do that next weekend.

    a second date guidebook?? absolutely bro..i like the way the grey fox thinks.

    -HQ
     
  13. Grey Fox

    Grey Fox Master Don Juan

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    Second Date Guide

    Yeah I tossed the Second Date Guide up as its own entity. Otherwise that should do it for the first date guide unless someone comes up with some outa left field question that will involve everyone in the collective answering process.

    -Grey Fox
     
  14. Nicholas Hill

    Nicholas Hill Master Don Juan

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    Ive read the basis of this thread but not the responses.

    I like this.

    Added to the Don Juan eBook (for when it comes out), but not to the bible.

    Nick
     
  15. Pimp-sicle

    Pimp-sicle Master Don Juan

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    Fox:

    Good post and I agree with everything you have said except for 2 things.


    waiting for 4-5 days after you # close: Calling the day off is ridiculous, but sometimes calling the next day is a surprise to a HB. I usually call 2-3 days after I get the number. I think girls have a window period where they say to themselves "If he doesn't call by XX day then I'm over it."


    Pay for it: HELL NO!!!!! When you first have a get-together with a girl she's nothing more than a friend to you at that time. Why should you pay for her sh1t?? Once the girl has proved that her IL is high enough then MAYBE I'd pay, otherwise I wouldn't. Girls have sh-it tests all the time when it comes to paying. That's my 2 cents on it.


    Great post though.
     
  16. Grey Fox

    Grey Fox Master Don Juan

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    About paying....

    When I say paying we are assuming a few things:

    1. You have already talked from time to time.
    2. You may have "gone for coffee" already just to feel out her IL, and this is the first Real Date.
    3. Its not a huge loss if you only spend 40 bucks on a date, if you worry about her IL then just give her your number and say "Give me a call sometime if you want to go out again." This puts the ball in her court and is probably the best way to gauge interest.
    4. You have some privelleged info from her friends that "She really likes you, a lot."
    5. You and her have made it clear to each other that the date is in fact not a friendly date. You can do this by simply saying "Do you want to go out on a date?" Or "You wanna go out with me on such and such a night."

    -Grey Fox
     
  17. dionysius_d

    dionysius_d Senior Don Juan

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    Paying

    Yeah the ONLY part i could find fault with was about paying..

    many an AFC has gone home not only empty handed but empty in the pocket!!

    But you qualified it above OK.

    Buying a coffee or spending a few dollars here and there isn't gonna make or break..

    But her getting used to the guy always forking out money.. or if she is gold digger inclined, or wants looking after, then paying is a mistake..

    Going dutch might look cheap to some, but on the other hand, it can also mean you're equal.. she doesn't have to think about any guilt trip cr@p such as (hmm now i owe him something), and you don't have to take some BS father-type role of being "providor"..
     
  18. xblitz44x

    xblitz44x Master Don Juan

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    This is a good post and a good overall guide for beginners but there are a couple thinks I'd like to say:

    " 1. Wait four to five days before making the first call. It gives you time to figure some stuff out like where to go and what to do. Also you it sets you apart from those desperate AFCs who call the day after they get a number, nobody likes a boot-licker so why act like one by calling her and acting like an attention starved puppy?"

    This is pretty much the biggest problem I have. If a girl likes you, then she won't care when you call. She WANTS you to call. If you wait 5-6 days (like EVERY guy is doing right now) THEN you look like the AFC that is letting some silly rule dictate when your going to call. Call when you want. Call the next day, 2 days later...whatever. THAT seems stronger because you are interested in her, you like her, you are comfortable with yourself and don't need rules to make her interested - she already IS interested.

    " 1. Don't call an hour before your date, it seems clingy."

    Again, I call when I want. I don't know why we all jumped on this, "don't call" banwagon. I know pleanty of guys who get laid pleanty of times that don't have these rules.

    " 7. Let her do most of the talking, and when you talk, maintain the mystery of being you. Don't tell her your life's story, otherwise if she knows your whole deal, whats there to come back for?"

    If she talks, ideally let her go with it. She's expressing herself. However, there is a VERY good chance that she's going to be nervous and shy to open up to you. You CAN'T force her to open up and feel comfortable through questions. You need to open up yourself first. So yes, talk about you early. Maybe volunteer some information and try to find something that she can connect herself to. When she volunteers then praise her by being attentive. Then from there talk about you more...soon the convo. will be 50/50. Eventually, when she totally opens up it'll be a 30/70 deal. Don't be afraid to talk. People say that she'll lose interest if she knows too much about you. So what does that say about you? That when a girl knows the real you, she bails? Women are not there to collect as much facts as she can then leave. They are there because they LIKE you, they liked you before you opened up and they will like you after. Think about it....if you were on a date with Jenna Jamison and she talks about herself and you know "everything" about her, are you not going to want to fvck her anymore because you know too much about her? It's not logical. Talk until she's open. When she opens up don't fight for the floor, let her have it.

    "11. Kissing. No need to kiss on the first date, unless you make some serious headway."

    It's a good point that you don't NEED to kiss on a first date. A lot of guys force it when a girl isn't attracted to him, or when the time just isn't right. However, I think there was only one date ever that I didn't try to kiss. I do it because I like her. That's it. I want to kiss her. So I kiss her. This isn't rocket science.

    Overall it was a really good guide, I just wanted to add my edits in there.

    -Blitz
     
  19. KeepitKINO

    KeepitKINO Don Juan

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    The reason we do this is to raise intrest level. Like everything here though, this is only advise. If you think you have a unique case then by all means you might need to bend, or break rules.

    We don't look AFCish because the calling "rule" isn't a normal dating rule. AFC's call on the first day, it makes it look like they have been thinking about the girl all day.
     
  20. xblitz44x

    xblitz44x Master Don Juan

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    "The reason we do this is to raise intrest level.

    Contrary to popular DJ belief, waiting to call somebody does NOT raise interest level. Think about a girl who you KNOW you wouldn't have sex with. If she waited 2 days to call you, or 4, or 10, are you going to feel anymore inclined to have sex with her? Now think about a girl that you WOULD have sex with, would you NOT have sex with her if she called on the first day? It just doesn't make sense. This rule came about as a means of screening FOR high interest - not to create or increase it. The theory is that if a girl is into you, it won't matter how soon or late you call.

    "We don't look AFCish because the calling "rule" isn't a normal dating rule."

    Oh but it is. A lot of people know and play by that rule. It's on a bunch of movies. Girls that I know say "Are you actually going to call or are you going to do that gay 3-day rule?". It's everywhere and it makes you look weak if you stumble upon a girl that knows that. It's not worth it. If she likes you it's because of you, not because of the amount of time you took to call.

    -Blitz
     

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