GUIDE TO CUTTING UP

[Ricky]

Couldn't have said it better myself Diesel.

Atkins is not a diet for athletes or people working out.

In fact everyone I know who did it was a lazy ass who didn't work out!

 

[Smooth as Anything]

Woah, hey now dude.

I wasn't calling you out at all! I don't know ANYTHING you know. I fu!king worship you? You took that the wrong way.

I was just trying to get an idea whats BS on the web man.

Sorry I guess...

 

[oatmealandtuna]

8. Suggested macro nutrient ratios:

Carbs: 1-1.2g / # body weight
Protein: 2g./ # body weight
Fat : as little as possible, take one tablespoon of flaxseed oil with protein and no carbs before bed.

most of your daily carbs should come in the three hour window following your weight workout. (see GUIDE TO BULKING for more info)

I have a slight beef with your point here about fat intake. You're proposing to people here to only take in about 14 grams of fat not counting the misc fat found in other foods. But since you're saying that they should be minimizing fats it is likely that anyone reading this will only eating lean meats etc. Maybe you already corrected yourself on this point but I when I skimmed this post I didn't see anything like that.

You should clarify your point and make it clear that anyone who is serious about becoming healthier should eat a moderate amount of fat, not just a tablespoon of flax oil...which is an inadequate amount of fat for almost everyone. Especially if they want to maintain their Testosterone levels while dieting which is essential for preserving as much muscle mass as possible. I'm sure you didn't mean to say just have flax oil as your fat source but it sure sounds like that.

In any case, I agree with Diesel in that you should consume flax oil but don't forget to eat other healthy or "good" fats like raw nuts (almonds) or fat rich meats like salmon etc.

 

[DIESEL]

Originally posted by oatmealandtuna
I have a slight beef with your point here about fat intake. You're proposing to people here to only take in about 14 grams of fat not counting the misc fat found in other foods. But since you're saying that they should be minimizing fats it is likely that anyone reading this will only eating lean meats etc. Maybe you already corrected yourself on this point but I when I skimmed this post I didn't see anything like that.

The miscellaneous fats in other foods will end up totalling about 30-40 grams of fat depending on what you eat. That's plenty for a cutting diet.

You should clarify your point and make it clear that anyone who is serious about becoming healthier should eat a moderate amount of fat, not just a tablespoon of flax oil...which is an inadequate amount of fat for almost everyone. Especially if they want to maintain their Testosterone levels while dieting which is essential for preserving as much muscle mass as possible. I'm sure you didn't mean to say just have flax oil as your fat source but it sure sounds like that.

The preservation of testosterone levels is kept more from the heavy lifting than from fat intake, even though the amount in the diet is enough for the purposes of muscle retention. Due to the lack of calories, your T-levels are going to drop regardless, doesn't matter what you do. This diet and training routine is the best form of natural "damage" control short of jumping on the juice while cutting.

If you are that concerned you can jump on 1-AD or Mag-10.. good insurance against catabolism while on a cutting diet.

D

 

[oatmealandtuna]

The miscellaneous fats in other foods will end up totalling about 30-40 grams of fat depending on what you eat. That's plenty for a cutting diet.

Fair enough, assuming that's how they're going to be eating. But that still means (since you made no mention about eating any other forms of "good" fat besides flax) that they'll only be getting 14 g of good fat out of a total of 50 or so. Anyone trying to eat better should try to supplement their fat intake with fish oil, olive oil, and whole nuts in addition to flax. Functionally, I don't think those misc fats found in other foods you're referring to will provide as much health benefits as what I mentioned above.

 

[DIESEL]

Originally posted by oatmealandtuna
Fair enough, assuming that's how they're going to be eating. But that still means (since you made no mention about eating any other forms of "good" fat besides flax) that they'll only be getting 14 g of good fat out of a total of 50 or so. Anyone trying to eat better should try to supplement their fat intake with fish oil, olive oil, and whole nuts in addition to flax. Functionally, I don't think those misc fats found in other foods you're referring to will provide as much health benefits as what I mentioned above.

Like I said, this program is only a template and the individual can tweak it to fit his/her comfort level. However, I don't think the amount of fats should exceed 60-70g for a cutting diet, then you start to sacrifice valuable carbs and proteins in order to stay at a calorie deficit to maintain steady fat loss.

 

[Ricky]

Who the hell cares if it is a sticky or not, it is always being responded too.

Now to add to the thread, are some dietary meals that always seemed to help me when I was doing good on my diet. Like last summer when I got ripped.

Get a bag of frozen vegetables and a chicken breast. Get some PAM non fat spray. Coat your skillet with this and start cooking it up.

Make a regular meal of this type of food. Learn to stir fry a variety of lean protein sources with vegetable. Get some good sauces to add, like hot sauce and sometimes soy sauce (but it is way heavy on sodium, so take it easy on it)

Other food ideas are welcome.

How about nonfat plain yogurt (no sugar) and different fruit everyday added in for breakfast.

And another the Mexican breakfast burrito. Eggs, salsa wrapped in a whole wheat tortilla. Sure beats cereal for breakfast

 

[Deathfyre]

Baseline?

Originally posted by DIESEL
Start at your baseline, then progressive cut 200 calories each week til you hit somewhere close to 1600. Once in that 1600 range you start to add cardio.

What is my baseline? How do I figure it out?

Thanks

 

[DJ Girevik]

How quick does this cutting diet work? I have a solid base of muscle already (lifting since I was 15, currently 18) but about 17-20% body-fat, I think (my coach doesn't have calipers, and before I started lifting I was at around 24%, at slightly lower or higher weight than I am now (6'1, 230 now)). I want to get down to 10% or below by August, because I signed up for Comic-Con's "masquerade", and I will be "masquerading" as Goku from Dragon Ball Z.

 

[DIESEL]

Originally posted by DJ Girevik
How quick does this cutting diet work? I have a solid base of muscle already (lifting since I was 15, currently 18) but about 17-20% body-fat, I think (my coach doesn't have calipers, and before I started lifting I was at around 24%, at slightly lower or higher weight than I am now (6'1, 230 now)). I want to get down to 10% or below by August, because I signed up for Comic-Con's "masquerade", and I will be "masquerading" as Goku from Dragon Ball Z.

August should be plenty of time..

hell, you can do a full cutting cycle - then a bulking cycle - followed by another finishing cutting mini-cycle. all before August - if you're disciplined with your diet and training - you'll be jakked by then.

D

 

[DJ Girevik]

Cool, thanks for the info. Also, you mentioned the high intensity cardio, but between the cold weather and it being my first time on it, I couldn't keep up HIIT running for even 5 minutes! I still feel it now, too. Should I do more days to compensate, or just rest and work up to 15 minutes gradually?

BTW, it's actually mid-July this time. It was in August last year.

 

[mage]

Originally posted by DIESEL
155 x .85 = 131.75 lbs. of lean body mass

131.75 x 1.1 (assuming you want 10%bf and you don't put on any muscle..) = 145 lbs.

which means you have to lose 10 lbs. of pure body fat to get to 10% b.f.

figuring out your baseline

155 x 1. 2 = 186 grams of carbs = 744 cals

155 x 2 = 310 grams of protein = 1240 cals

30 grams of fat per day = 270 cals

744+1240+270 = 2254

start at 2254 cals then start cutting 150 calories each week

cut 75 cals (about 19 grams from carbs) and 75 cals (about 19 grams from protein) a week till you hit the 1600 mark, and you'll still be hitting 30g fats, 220 grams protein, and 110 grams carbs AT 1600 CALORIES.. CAN YOU SAY NUTRIENT DENSE... then level off doing intense cardio till you hit the 12 week plateau and your'e not a 10% b.f.

this applies for any weight/ body fat .. this was done as an example..


Isn't this a little extreme. This diet calls for 310 grams of protein, and that is just for an average size person.

I wouldn't be to quick to get on it, because excess protein consumption has been linked to many health problems like kidney, liver malfunction and accelerated aging. The reccommended intake or minimum to live by is 25 gms for an average person, and the rda is more like 55-65 grams so where do you get off by dramatically increasing he dosage? It has been proven in lab tests that mice given excess protein die more rapidly, and show signs of old age earlier then those on a restricted protein diet.

If I were anyone here I would not go all out on this diet, One would have to consume over 50 eggs to get that much protein. A lot of proein will put tons of tear and wear on the internal organs, making them wear out like tires. THink of it like driving a long distance, the more protein the more the tires will wear out, the more the mileage will increase, and in general something will more likely go wrong.

There is much evidence on this. One book you should all read about it is "Dr. Mollen's Anti Aging Diet", where Dr. Mollen states that he could run a marathon after restricting protein to 50-60 gms, he felt refreshed and light, had more stamina and endurance, as opposed to feeling bogged down with his usual diet. So there is an example of efficiency. Do you want a body that gets clogged and overworks, or one that runs smoothly on just enough fuel.


bye

mage
D

 

[Shiftkey]

The extra protein repairs your muscles after working them.

The reccommended intake or minimum to live by is 25 gms for an average person, and the rda is more like 55-65 grams

The average person doesn't do hard work outs 4 days a week or have a low body fat percentage. Infact the average American is overweight (over 60% now) and sits on their lazy ass watching too much TV.

 

[semag]

Ok, mage. I doubt you'll ever read this, considering it looks like you don't frequent much.... but here's an explanation I think.

The diet being talked about is not permanent. It's a 8-12 week diet that is specifically engineered to (in this case) burn fat and promote muscle growth. So, I'm sure after that time period is up, one would go to a more "normal diet."

However, as Shiftkey said, the people doing this are not "normal" or "average" people according to the USA. The "normal" US person is not a bodybuilder, so therefore even a reduced diet for someone who has done this program will likely have an increased amount of protein compared to the RDA amount...

 

[K-Daddy]

There's a lot of holes in this diet, although it is a good starting point, and it does serve its purpose, which is to give newbie dieters a starting point.

Protein probably doesn't need to be twice your bodyweight, and fat most DEFINITELY does not need to be as low as 30g a day. On lower days I get 80-100g of fat a day, and that's when dieting. Those are from GOOD fats though. Healthy fats like flax, etc. are some of the most anabolic and fat-burning things you can eat.

Keeping protein high is great...especially much higher than the FDA's recommendation. In fact, the whole food pyramid, 2000 cal, low fat FDA diet is a bunch of crap. I'd vouch for around 1x to 1.5x bodyweight in grams of protein a day, but if 2x works better for you, then 2x just works better for you.

I know these topics have probably already been discussed throughout this, so delete it if you may. They haven't been addressed recently and should be, though. Fat doesn't make you fat.

 

[InLawsHateMe]

Ok... I'm trying to understand all this, it ain't easy, since my diets in the past consisted of just eating less, no deserts, and lifting weights. Right now, I'd like to lose 20 pounds.

I'm 5'11, my weight is about 210. I've got muscles all over my damn body, but I've got fat too. So for retards like me, what should I do? What should I eat? I mean, isn't there a diet I can stick to that with lifting, can burn fat, and drop my weight? Like eating an apple in the morning, drink a sh*t load of water, and eat a piece of bread at night or something?

 

[Ricky]

Calorieking.com is excellent for those keeping track of calorie intake. Check it out!

 

[Oscar Wilde]

Originally posted by InLawsHateMe
Ok... I'm trying to understand all this, it ain't easy, since my diets in the past consisted of just eating less, no deserts, and lifting weights. Right now, I'd like to lose 20 pounds.

I'm 5'11, my weight is about 210. I've got muscles all over my damn body, but I've got fat too. So for retards like me, what should I do? What should I eat? I mean, isn't there a diet I can stick to that with lifting, can burn fat, and drop my weight? Like eating an apple in the morning, drink a sh*t load of water, and eat a piece of bread at night or something?

A friend of mine lost about 30lbs in 7 weeks on CKD ( http://www.c-k-d.com/ ) . Going to try it myself. Do a google for CKD for more info and read some of the site.

I'm 5'7 and 210lbs, but I'm a rugby player and a lot of that is muscle which is nice. Need to cut some of the extra fat off though (it's hard not to drink alcohol here), so that's what I'm at..

PM me if you're interested in something as serious as the CKD, be nice to have someone start it at the same time.

Osc.

 

[es_mer8]

I'm 5'11" and 250 pounds. I didn't get my body fat checked but my friend who looked slightly more fit than I who was 5'10" and 235 pounds got 26% bf, which makes me worried. I want to get down to around 10-15% bf by the time I go to college which is August 21st. Is there still time for me to achieve that? I'll have to start tomorrow as I already ruined it today. Assuming I have 28% bf, it'd be:

250 x .72 = 180 lbs. of lean body mass

180 x 1.1 (assuming you want 10 %bf and you don't put on any muscle..) = 198 lbs.

which means you have to lose 52 lbs. of pure body fat to get to 10% b.f.

figuring out your baseline

250 x 1. 2 = 300 grams of carbs = 1200 cals

250 x 2 = 500 grams of protein = 2000 cals

30 grams of fat per day = 270 cals

744+1200+2000 = 3954

So should I cut down by 250 each week or what/

 

[semag]

hey esmer.... Sounds like you got it right... but zounds, that's going to be a big change. Going from 4000 calories a day? What the heck do you eat in a day, that's pretty insane.

In addition, I'll tell you DIESEL's plan is good, but make sure you don't stretch it too long. He tells you to only do it for 12 weeks at max, because you don't want to strain your body too much. So I think your goal of 10-15% may be a little unrealistic by august, but I'm not completely sure about that. However, the start you will be getting will make a tremendous impact on your life, and is a great change.

One of the things I really noticed about myself (Don't know if it would work for you.) When you start cutting, if you don't invest any personal investment in it, you will not have the motivation to keep it up. What do I mean??? Well... for me it was a financial investment.

I went out and bought all those suppliments DIESEL recommended, prolly came out to 60-70 bucks or so... With that much of my hard earned money in pills sitting on my table... it finally got me thinking "Man, I have to keep this up or else I'm wasting my money!"

So, make an investment in your program, and you will be more motivated to keep it up.