Can BPD woman really change?

[betheman]

yes boundaries and being strong etc etc bla bla bla....been there done that.....the strongest guy will break after the 7th night in a row of no sleep as she screams and shouts for hours on end.

Nothing you can do or say will stop them or calm them down. they then start getting violent and breaking down doors as you try and move to another room to get some peace. (remember this is taken as you abandoning them)

they cannot be alone so they follow you everywhere you go all the while shouting having circular arguments about something that happened years ago that you thought was resolved.

You try and leave the house they hold onto your leg, you get into the car they jump on the bonnet. you cannot get away ever so you have to plan to secretly leave them while they are out otherwise you will end up as insane as they are.

so that's what I did. So I abandoned her. and the cycle continues.

its still the best strategy, doesnt mean it works all the time or is foolproof, one things BPD's do well is drive people away and smash up anything good and worthwhile. she oversteps the boundaries too often....you did what you needed to.

its worth adding, not all BPD's are women, it some men have the condition as well

 

[betheman]

betheman, I read about those tactics in all the expert books on how to deal with BP's - that you should set and clearly define boundaries. The problem is I never found this to work either. I would tell my ex what behavior was acceptable, and what was not, and she would simply disregard them and do whatever the hell she wanted anyway. Everything was always on her terms. And if I protested, I was accused of being controlling and of pushing her further away. The more boundaries I set, the more determined she was to break them.

To care about someone like that, and to ask for what I thought was so little and to give so much in return for so damn little, it was just the single most frustrating thing I've ever experienced in my entire life.

To all the newbies, it's just not worth it making a go out of it with one of these women. Recognize the early warning signs, and as soon as you've determined your gf has any kind of personality disorder or mental illness than get the fvck out or you will live to regret it.

it doesnt always work Bradd, only those who recognise they have a problem and have a degree of desire to improve will buy into it, unless they have this you are pi$$ing in the wind.
I dont blame any guy for giving up, it can be hellish demanding work. I see many men who are married to such types and who have hearts of lions...or maybe they get some kind of kick out of it, whatever...I couldnt put up with it, the end results really dont inspire confidence

 

[betheman]

And this was the most frustrating aspect of being with my BPD - she's the one who thought I was the borderline in the relationship! And I remember thinking, but wait a second here, you're the one who was sexually abused, abandoned by your parents when you were 4, cuts your arms, tried to commit suicide, sees a psychiatrist, and has a drawer full of anti-depressant and anti-psychotic medication!

But she was still firmly convinced that I was the one with the illness.

BP's just live in such a sad state of denial, which is how they were able to get through their tough times: they just denied what was happening to them and emotionally blocked it out. What a sad way to live. What p!sses me off most today looking back - and I know you all can relate to this - was how a good stable guy like me would have wasted an entire year being with such a selfish and mentally broken young woman.

such is the trap many men fall into!
unfortunately disney, love songs, the media all preach about the vulnerabilities of the female and the desire for a strong man as a desirable cure, this has unsuspecting males rushing to be protectors, fixers, sheilds bariers againts and sponges of pain and suffering...the wages of which are devastatingly poor at times, a sh1t investment at worse.

BPD's have a totally different reality to non BPD's, they have an appaling view of themsleves, however they project this on to others and especially those who dare to care for them, one you care, the stakes increase and in direct correlation to her own extremely negative view of herself.
frustrating doesnt do it justice, its a sink hole with little or no payoff.

 

[LiveFreeX]

And this was the most frustrating aspect of being with my BPD - she's the one who thought I was the borderline in the relationship! And I remember thinking, but wait a second here, you're the one who was sexually abused, abandoned by your parents when you were 4, cuts your arms, tried to commit suicide, sees a psychiatrist, and has a drawer full of anti-depressant and anti-psychotic medication!

This sounds exactly like my ex (are you in brazil dating a japanese girl)?
She threw my clothes and all my belongings out of a 7th storey window, ordered me to get out and then when I was on the street, called me 20 minutes later to apologize and said she ran up and down the streets looking for me. She went crazy because I made fun of the monkey speaking portuguese on Dora the Explorer.

 

[PeakIV]

But she was still firmly convinced that I was the one with the illness.

Yup, the denial game, projection........ I had aspergers according to her!

 

[SBW]

Just a theory, what exactly are trying to change our opinion about?

Are you trying to tell us that a relationship with a borderline is actually workable?

Are we maybe jumping to conclusions about JAT's other half here?

After all, he could be one of those guys who have demonstrated themselves able to sustain a LTR with a BPD - Controlling/Disorganised Narcissists, Avoidants, massive and undentable egos etc, or simply keeping his options open with other women - All traits which mean they don't put enough of themselves into a relationship or keep the BPD on their toes in ways that keep things shaken-up just enough to stop short of triggering the splitting behaviours.

In the case of my ex, her only successful LTRs had been with men who had significant issues themselves and the longest one was clearly a very controlling narcissist. And yes, I am also very aware of a BPD's ability to gloss over and deny all the bad things in a relationship and make it seem far more stable and rosy than it ever was in reality.

 

[PeakIV]

In the case of my ex, her only successful LTRs had been with men who had significant issues themselves and the longest one was clearly a very controlling narcissist. .

Mine lasted 8 yrs.

says a lot about me.....

 

[SBW]

Mine lasted 8 yrs.

says a lot about me.....

Mine lasted five and a half but with all the usual ups and downs so I can speak!

However its all about the extremes within that time and I have to say that the period before I bailed-out, where I'd recognised and finally accepted her BPD (with good help from here ) and that I could do nothing about it, so stopped pandering to her and started strengthening myself was the longest and most stable time in the relationship (incl the honeymoon period) - So I can understand how her nine and a half years with a non-available narcissist type was a far less traumatic time for the pair of them. She simply never got the opportunity to split him.

 

[Die Hard]

Mine lasted 8 yrs.

says a lot about me.....

lol, that DOES say a lot about you!

Were you just such a weak fool to tolerate her behavior for that long??

Or were you just that much of a brute that you could mostly control her for that time?

So I can understand how her nine and a half years with a non-available narcissist type was a far less traumatic time for the pair of them. She simply never got the opportunity to split him.

Exactly... which is a very intriguing idea. I wonder, if you are an extremely narcissist UBER-JERK, can you just enjoy the BPD without too much trouble?

Like with HB5's that you just use when you have nothing else to stick your d!ck in... They can't get to you emotionally, coz you just don't give a sh!t about them. And I guess if you are a TOTAL BASTARD, then even a BPD couldn't get to you emotionally, not even if she's very beautiful.

Or is that faulty thinking?

 

[Die Hard]

Double post...

 

[PeakIV]

lol, that DOES say a lot about you!

Were you just such a weak fool to tolerate her behavior for that long??

Or were you just that much of a brute that you could mostly control her for that time?

First 5 yrs never gave a toss, ( thats the brute bit) couldn't care less, took me 4-5 yrs to say the dreaded "i love you"
gave her probably half of what she gave me. Always knew something was not quite right diehard , was always waiting for the other shoe to drop so to speak. never asked her to marry me, wasn't interested.

then slipped when the feelings grew..... spent the next 3 years trying to climb the slippery slope. ( thats the weak fool bit) You can try and keep those boundries up only for so long, you expect things to settle down but with these women if you are not on top of your game all the time you will fail.

you will only succeed with these women when they know they don't quite have you.......as soon as they know you are hooked you spend your remaining time in a world of chaos and fog trying to figure how someone can do a complete 180 and trying to get back to how it was before, which as we all know you will never do.

once they paint you black there's no turning back.....

 

[SBW]

Or is that faulty thinking?

Rather!

Nope, for a substantial part of that time I weathered all the same extremes of idealisation and devaluation as guys here have reported with all the same bewilderment, stress and anguish, had times where we were split-up completely and was inevitably hoovered back - Then I finally took myself in hand and found out why this relationship was like no other I'd ever known of before - she was a textbook BPD, undiagnosed but something I learned late in the relationship makes me wonder if she might have been and that's why she dropped out of psych treatment at some point before me.

So after the last splitting/hoovering episode, I resolved that the next time she showed the slightest subtle signs of splitting me, I'd be off for good, pulled back emotionally, stopped investing/involving myself in the relationship and set strict personal boundaries on the relationship and waited for the inevitable.

And blow me, it didn't come! In fact we went from strength to strength for a good while. It took nearly two years for her BPD to raise its head again and I was off and have resisted every attempt to hoover me back or involve myself with her again since - and even those are finally dying down now. I don't think I was a particular jerk in that period but I certainly stood-up for myself against her and the boundaries helped - But I won't say I was controlling her, more I controlled myself - after all I had recognised that the end by her splitting me again would be inevitable.

But yes, I think her ex from her longest relationship could enjoy her without much bother - he had his life and dealings with the world ordered and compartmentalised to a disturbing degree and their relationship fitted exactly into the segment he wanted it to. She knew that there was nothing she could do to to break out of that box and nothing she could do to him that would change things. Her next longest standing LTR was with another obvious narcissist but of the completely disorganised type, who was utterly in love with himself/his image and just romped through life from one adventure/crisis to another, oblivious to anyone else in his life and yes, she mirrored them just as comprehensively as she mirrored me.

 

[TonyBaloney]

She went crazy because I made fun of the monkey speaking portuguese on Dora the Explorer.

My ex BPD went nuts on me for laughing about a guy throwing bacon at some muslims.....the muslims had held a placard saying that returning soldiers from afghanistan were all child murderers and deserved to die.... the guy throwing the bacon was insulting them like theyd insulted us....but the ex (a bleeding heart liberal) was all for the ethnics.....CVNT!!!! Still laugh at thinking of the bacon thrower though

 

[Boilermaker]

Hahaha bacon thrower

Your EX didn't have a sense of humor Tony.

 

[Down Low]

After the Depo Provera shot turned my ex psycho cluster b1tch into a raving lunatic, I did some trial and error about other ingestibles. Cutting out caffeine definitely helped reduce the frequency, duration, and severity of temper tantrums. I'm putting it in my toolkit for improving LTRs. Estrogen tablets made her more feminine, and had the delicious side effect of putting her through emotionally painful mood swings as serum levels rose and fell. All in all, it just replaced one sort of having to listen to b1tching with another sort. I tried several other supplements, but she was bad about missing several days in a row, so I can't report anything.

 

[Speculator E]

delete

 

[The_411]

Short answer is no. Long answer is hell no!.

The symptoms just manifest in different ways as they mature but even with years and years of therapy and psychotherapy (DBT and CBT) they're still unlikely to have a breakthrough. Better odds on winning the lottery jackpot IMHO.

 

[HariPoter13]

After the Depo Provera shot turned my ex psycho cluster b1tch into a raving lunatic, I did some trial and error about other ingestibles. Cutting out caffeine definitely helped reduce the frequency, duration, and severity of temper tantrums. I'm putting it in my toolkit for improving LTRs. Estrogen tablets made her more feminine, and had the delicious side effect of putting her through emotionally painful mood swings as serum levels rose and fell. All in all, it just replaced one sort of having to listen to b1tching with another sort. I tried several other supplements, but she was bad about missing several days in a row, so I can't report anything.

Hormones impact their behavior like crazy. My gf went off the bc and she went fvkcing nuts. Hopped back on bc, now she's like she used to be. Almost normal. But I'm not the same person anymore. The red flags were there from the very beggining. I'm glad that I've read about BPD on here a long time ago. Now I'm fvcking expert on it lol, spent the past week reading about it.

 

[HariPoter13]

http://gettinbetter.com/BPDlove.html

Imagine that you're sitting in a boat having baited a fishing lure, and you're waiting for your next dinner to swim along and chomp on it. That would be your normal expectation, wouldn't it? Well, the Borderline ignores that lure in the water, and hoists herself into your vessel! This is utterly fantastic for any guy who's insecure, and wants to avoid the possibility of rejection, if he makes the first move. It's also a sure thing you've got a train wreck ahead, with another BPD girl. The only cure for attraction to Borderlines, is growing genuine confidence and self-worth.

Usually damaged guys end up with borderline girls. I don't think it's a coincidence.

 

[expos]

Thanks to Expos for this:

Take 10 minutes and read it, you won't be sorry.

http://shrink4men.wordpress.com/200...friend-or-wife-be-different-with-the-new-guy/

Thanks man! The has been the best article I've read on the subject of damaged women.

It is SO HARD to leave these types of women. The are always beautiful and they think you are the best thing ever. They make you feel like the greatest guy on the planet. I was ****y as fvck when I was dating my BPD. She was always complimenting me (my body, my interests, my intelligence). Why would I consider any other woman when I was being treated that well? They can slay the some of the top Alphas as they are masters of emotional terrorism.

I actually ended up speaking with one of the ex-BF's of my ex BDP wife. The story of their break up was pretty similar to my situation. She split him black, dropped him cold, no explanation. From her account, he stalked her after the breakup. Talking with him, I knew he was a good dude right off the bat and that she was the one who was damaged. This guy had a great job, no baggage, solid guy.

Don't fall victim to these women. They do nothing but bring you down and are terrible in LTR's.