A Note To The Newbies On High Intensity Cardio

Discussion in 'Health and Fitness' started by DIESEL, Jan 10, 2003.

  1. DIESEL

    DIESEL Master Don Juan

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    You'll note that in my GUIDE TO CUTTING UP, I advocate the use of High Intensity Interval Training (HIIT) in lieu of the more traditional long, steady-state cardio work as a mean to achieve quicker and more efficient fat loss.

    However, I make this recommendation with one caveat. If you are some fat pud who has just started working out, or are generally sedentary then as you may have found out, HIIT IS GOING TO KICK YOUR ASS

    Therefore for you non-athlete newbies out there reading this, I have to say that before you even think about tackling a proper HIIT session (i.e. of more than 10 but less than 20 minutes - excluding warm up time) that you must first be able to complete 45 minutes of steady state cardio at 70% of the intensity you would use for interval training.

    For example, if you do HIIT on the stairmaster at level 10, then you won't be ready to tackle HIIT until you can do 45 minutes without getting your ass kicked at level 7. Simple enough, right?

    To recap, if you're a beginner then you have to start with the long steady state cardio training to build your "aerobic base" (heart, lungs, legs) before you can tackle the heavy duty work.

    peace,
    D
     
  2. Soshyopathe

    Soshyopathe Master Don Juan

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    Where you been, D?
     
  3. Pulsar

    Pulsar Senior Don Juan

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    ta for the extra clarification DIESEL :)
     
  4. Maurizio

    Maurizio Don Juan

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    ... I'm preparing myself for the criticism associated with dissagreeing with DIESEL...

    HIIT is good stuff, and I agree that for a sedetary person to jump right into it, he'd probably get his own a$$ handed to him on a platter.

    But HIIT for fat loss? High intensity to me implicates balls-out, anaerobic efforts. You're not burning existing fat, but your cells' glycogen stores when you are doing this. It is obviously true that with higher intensity outputs, you will burn more calories in less time, and will still have a calorie defecit in your diet if that is the goal -- and yes, a calorie defecit will cause your body to metabolize your own fat for energy in order to keep on functioning. But since you're on a calorie defecit diet, you also aren't replenishing your glycogen stores that well, and will leave yourself tired, and recovery from exercise will take much longer than normal.

    I would suggest keeping your HR at 65-75% MAX, a zone where you are nearly 100% aerobic, while doing cardio for cutting. In a lower aerobic state you are using your fat stores as your main source of fuel. This way, along with your calorie defecient diet that you are presumably eating, you won't have to endure the bad side effects of low glycogen stores (because you aren't depleting them in the first place), while still achieving fat loss.

    Cardio is my livlihood (I'm an endurance athlete) and I would NEVER do my super high intensity workouts while trying to lose weight or fat. Those goals have to be adressed separately. Just because I'm an endurance athlete doesn't mean I know nothing about lifting weights either -- I lift three times a week, have been doing so for a long time with the supervision of several coaches.

    I respect you very much DIESEL, but dissagree with this adivce. I figure that you are probably a very serious bodybuilder yourself, and are speaking and offering advice with regards to your own experiences with what you have done in the past. This method may have worked for you, but I feel that if this is the case, that you did it the harder route.

    I hope that my advice is not swept aside merely because I am a less established poster in these forums.

    - Maurizio
     
  5. DIESEL

    DIESEL Master Don Juan

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    hey maurizio,

    I don't take offense to anyone disagreeing with me. In fact, I welcome opposing points of view.. that's how we all learn. If I knew everything there was to know about training, I'd be a huge millionaire by now, right?

    Anyway, what I mean by HIIT is probably more akin to anaerobic threshold training. (AT) in the 80-90% HR Max range.. I recommend this because in my experience it is the best way to burn fat while retaining muscle mass at the same time.

    The cardio you speak of is of longer duration, and thus will burn a lot of muscle mass.. so for athletic purposes it's fine, for bodybuilding purposes it would imply sacrificing a lot of hard earned muscle mass.

    Also the point of cardio for bodybuilding purposes is to stimulate metabolism post-cardio and to thus insure a negative calorie balance at the end of the day. You'll note that I am all for supplementing with high-glycemic index carbs and protein in liquid form immediately after cardio to insure that one stays in an anabolic state. The higher intensity cardio produces elevated metabolic levels for up to six hours post-cardio, something lower intensity cardio cannot duplicate.

    The other benefit of AT training is that it taxes the body in such a way that it causes the release of GH and Test, something all bodybuilders want lots of in their body.

    For a good demonstration of my theory look at the differences in body styles between road cyclists (who train primarily with longer duration aerobic activity) and track cyclists (particularly match sprinters, who are primarily anaerobic.)

    So like I said before, if you are cutting fat for aesthetic purposes and are not a sport-specific athlete, then it's probably better to use a shorter, high intensity workout to insure that you will not only burn that unwanted bodyfat but keep as much muscle on you as possible.

    I have a background as a competitive rower so I've experimented with both kinds of cardio training. (longer steady-state, and hardcore AT and HR max training) In rowing you have to train in both to meet the specific demands of the sport.

    peace,
    -s
     
  6. Ricky

    Ricky Master Don Juan

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    Diesel,

    I appreciate reading your comments. I saw something on HIIT on Clarence Bass's site (I'll post the link later, it's saved on my laptop) and also EAS has several articles in their Muscle Media magazine. What you posted is absolutely correct, the post exercise metabolism boosting effect of HIIT is what matters.

    Diesel, are there any good bodybuilding resources that you read on a regular basis? I would like some that talk alot about research and studies. I sometimes read the Journal of Science in Sports and Exercise at the university, but I'm looking for some good online sources.

    I also read cyberpump.com, but now it's a pay site, so I don't have access to it.

    Any good online sources would be appreciated. Good to see you back, later.
     
  7. oatmealandtuna

    oatmealandtuna Don Juan

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    www.t-mag.com

    Is a good bodybuilding and nutritional resource. Be aware that the site is associated with a supplement company and their articles will usually recommend some of their brands. As long as you realize that they usually will recommend their own products you can get a whole lot of great information on that site.

    www.wannabebig.com

    Decent site here.

    www.thinkmuscle.com

    Another good site with great well known contributers.
     

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