Hello Friend,

If this is your first visit to SoSuave, I would advise you to START HERE.

It will be the most efficient use of your time.

And you will learn everything you need to know to become a huge success with women.

Thank you for visiting and have a great day!

Save the world, Be a hero, Get married!

LiveFreeX

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I didn't want to derail this thread http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=200480

but I had such strong feelings about a discussion I've been having with a friend and the point that was brought up here about people becoming bored with their girlfriends.

I am really pro marriage lately, having been part of the nomarriage forums and a proponent of MGTOW. As some of you may know, my wife is Chinese and I live in the PRC. Many of my friends are also married and we spend a lot of time pursuing hobbies and what not together. While there are a few problems with China in general, the society largely supports marriage and promotes family structure. Men buy houses and cars prior to marriage and women tend to want to stay home and take care of the children. The Chinese are taking over economically and looking out my window I can see 5 apartment buildings currently going up beside mine and a couple more in the next neighborhood over. My city alone has 30 MILLION people.

Something the West has lost, is the ability for people to work together and trust each other. Feminism, largely to blame for this, has forced men to adapt by striking down marriage and mimicing criminal/alpha behaviors. The constant pursuit of animalistic sex and singledom is creating and perpetuating this 'family' and moral void. By becoming a DJ or PUA you are feeding the feminist trolls and creating a larger divide between the sexes and ultimately the family structure. Men cannot work together if we are always pursuing women and letting our animalistic ego takeover our lives. At some point we need to take some responsibility for our actions and use our self control to put our sexual energies into something more constructive. Consistently dating yields nothing for you in the way of longterm security and societal stability. PUA lifestyle reinforces nothing and is just a huge waste of time. Learning how to seduce women is valuable but give the gift of seducing the one you are with and creating a life with her.


When I met my wife, I knew instantly that she was the one I would want in a supporting role. She was the first girl I met here and is the one I've held on to the longest. She was very receptive to my advances, which felt like overkill and actually left me feeling quite dirty. She suggested within a week that she become my girlfriend. She currently cleans/cooks/knits/budgets and takes cooking and baby caring classes. She wears dresses, platform boots and pantyhose which is pretty standard for asian girls... and she is a high 8. I am a little bored with the sex after 2 years but she has so many other good qualities and is a best friend I would hate to lose. I don't want her to cheat and feel that I must hold myself to the same standard I have for her. I am willing to forego sex with multiple women to have this peace of mind and pass it on to my children. I will be having kids with her and I work hard and do my best to make more money for our family even though she calls me a workaholic... When I was out PUAing, my goal was not to work at all, my attitude has done a total 180 since meeting her. The strange thing is that I also want my friends to have this. I always setup guys I meet off the pickup forums with girls. If you come to asia, I guarantee you will not go without for more than 2 days. This is the thing, my wife is not a diamond in the rough, she is quite common place in Asian society. There are armies of women just like her. These kinds of women are good for society and help men work together. There is enough for everyone here, I don't worry about my friends preying on my wife because I know they are being well cared for at home. The guys here don't even think red pill/blue pill and don't need to, their women naturally produce all the healthy red pill behaviors. Import them or export yourself, its no longer a matter of the West vs the East, its now a matter of blood lines disappearing completely. Don't let this happen to you. Chinese love white guys, Japanese love black guys, I've seen girls with Indian guys and obviously Asians can get married here too, there is enough for everyone.



The West, very few will argue, is currently being reconstructed and systematically failing on every level. The 1st world countries were built by men working together for the common good. We built welfare systems, educational institutions, space exploration, infrastructure, wealth and in my case healthcare to take care of our future. I'm proud to say I belonged to people who took us to the moon. They managed to do this by sharing resources, in particular women. People were married, had families and their priorities were straight: Build a better society for our future. Invent and create and help each other. Somewhere in that mix, feminism was invented and morphed into what we have today. Now we are moving backwards in regards to nearly everything that we've striven to build. Greed is rampant, people are out of control and the economy is in the dump. Men can no longer function as contributing human beings in current western society and men's natural impulses are vilified. We are pitted against each other for competition over women. Infact I would argue that men AND women's natural impulses are being repressed. Instead we have new 'modern' families being promoted such as single mothers and gay parentage. How long will it be before we have full blown state parentage.

It is normal for men and women to feel repulsed when a man wears a dress and pantyhose and tries to act feminine just as we are revolted when a woman acts 'butch' and tries to mimic masculinity. Follow your instincts.

The current working nuclear families are muslim or asian. Almost all of the pure white families we know of are broke and disorderly and white men tend to have a 'peter pan' outlook towards things and a general disdain for young children. By the way we were once kids, its a sad day when white families everywhere are trying to commit self genocide. Our genetic line is important to the world, we have natural blondes, brown and gold hair colours and eye-shades. Also our genetic line carries with it strength against certain diseases that other races do not possess. It will be a sad day when white genes do not get passed on to the future generation, just as it would be a sad day if any of the other races simply disappeared off the face of the earth... (for me it would be asians). Black guys, Asian guys, Indians, colored of all races are fans of our women and can all benefit from white genes in their pool. If you guys want to see more healthy white looking women and eventually have a bit of white in your blood line, white men also have to prosper. We are not the enemy the government and feminist movement so badly wants you to believe.

Why is the current moral fabric of society so bad and the promotion of LGBT, single motherhood and singledom approved? Simple, there are no more families with strong family values to argue against it. We are so busy fighting ourselves and each other that they are taking over. How much time is spent in the gym 'getting fit' for women or 'improving yourself' for women. Feminists and anti-family constructs have made it so difficult to seek out mates that men are turning to foreign asylum. Come abroad, meet good women and have true male friendships.

Please guys get married and have kids, it doesn't have to be a western woman! I don't want to live in a world where we are all tied to the current system and there are little in the way of improvements being made. I have friends here from every race and I'd like to keep it that way. Go foreign, pick up women that only show feminine behaviors and want to embrace their femininity and support you in a male role.

We can send a clear message to the human race. You can wine and dine women that actually deserve it and we can out breed feminism and eventually work together. I don't have all the answers, just this one:

I look forward to a future where my children can play with yours. :up:
 

Maximummax

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So you are basically saying every one to follow your chinese tradition of dating and family maintenance? and you think by following that we all will be happy forever.
 

Scaramouche

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Dear Live free,
I am also a lover of Mainland Chinese Women....They are Gods gift to us Western Men...I love China too,but not their Government nor their contempt for the riches fast disappearing around them...The only God modern Chinese have is money...In general,they are trickier than a wagon load of one eyed monkeys...The contempt of,or ignorance more likely,for their own culture is evident in 95% of those you meet...But underneath it all is this perhaps Confuscian morality,overlaid on a philosophy far more ancient,that even Mao and his Red Guards could not suppress...The Chinese Cultural values relating to Family are difficult to criticise,but to attempt to transfer these values to the situation most of us Western Guys face is ridiculous...No East is East and West is West but never the twain will meet!
 

LiveFreeX

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Lol, I'm not sure where you guys picked up Chinese tradition. I'm a white western male. I'm simply saying there are traditional Chinese women here that want to have normal relationships without all the hassle. I don't know if you've looked around lately but that doesn't exist anymore in the West.
 

backbreaker

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i pretty much don't agree with anything yous stated, but i will say that was one of the more articulated posts i've seen in a while. good job at least having a take and not sucking about it
 

Colossus

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That's actually a really well-written post.

I agree with you on many points. I think you may be painting with a bit of a broad brush when you talk about the decline of traditional families in the US, but there is definitely a trend towards that.

Whether guys agree or disagree on specific points, I think we can all rally around the fact we need to start making better individual choices with women. I've been advocating this for a long time; we can rant and rave about feminism and modern women all we want, but at the end of the day the only thing YOU can do is choose feminine, non-competitive women who embrace and want traditional gender roles. Natural selection.

Pumping and dumping women only perpetuates the entitled sardonic attitude we all hate so much.
 

samspade

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What a well thought out post. Not sure I agree with everything, but overall you make some good points. It sounds at first blush like a veiled "Foreign women vs. American women" screed, or maybe it's not so veiled? I suppose the greater point is Feminine women vs. Masculine women, and choosing the ones who deserve our attention.

I too have experienced this. My wife is from Brazil and I can't help but be red pill around her. It's built into the culture there. She wants me to be the man, and she wants to be the woman, end of story.

In fact, we've thought about moving back there, since the economy, like China's, is doing quite well. In some ways Brazil has "progressed" toward American-style Feminism, but overall it's still more traditional. Women work, yes, but damn it they want to settle down and have kids like yesterday.

I will admit that I do not feel the pull of having/raising kids. It's just not a desire I have. However sometimes I think I don't want to regret not passing along my seed. But right now, I just don't want that.

Anyway, as Colossus said, you have to make the right choices. We can bytch and moan about entitled brats, but we feed them with attention even when we simply try to pump and dump. Not saying you can't take an easy lay when the opportunity presents itself. But think about the kind of women you are choosing. Game is all about flipping the script, but the biggest part of the female script is that women are the selectors. They have biological incentive to postpone sex until they know the guy is "right" in their mind/reptilian hindbrain. We men are the logical sex, we should be at least as discriminating.

It will be interesting to see how the next generation plays out.
 

wait_out

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LiveFreeX, I want to open up a question for you, if you don't mind:

How would you choose to live that philosophy, if I dropped you into a major Western city tommorrow?
 

glass half full

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LiveFreeX- While I do respect your outlook, I am also reminded of the reason I am here. While I admire that you are happy with your life status, and do hope it works for you, there are some of us who are of the age to have seen a big change in our society in the last 30 years. And our media seemed to want us to believe it was "the way to be". Basically it has proven to be a way for women to rule, and men to drool. I have been there, and I'm thoroughly sick of it. That's the purpose this forum serves for me. It is a place to study, consider, and learn so we don't get walked on any more, we sail our ships and the women take it or leave it, that's how it should be.
 

The Duke

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LiveFree- you make some valid points, however as China moves closer to being an economic super power, you will also see changes in your women.

Just give it a few years.

We used to have all of that here in the good ole USA. Guess what...in the last 50yrs this country grew very wealthy, women went to work, families grew smaller, women progressed in the workplace, women joined the military, and the cost of living continues to increase as this country sinks further and further into debt. Now we have an "everyone for him/herself" society.
 

Wilko

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Society's interests are best served when reproductive decisions are left wholly and solely up to the individuals concerned. It's basically (and I'm not specifically fingering you, LiveFree) another case of the so-called experts thinking that they can out-think the market. We have enormous family tax concessions and "baby bonuses" in this country (Oz) to boost our flagging birth rate. I'm sure it was all very well intentioned at some point, but you can bet that it hasn't done what it was designed to do. It just artificially distorts people's perception of the relative risks and benefits of having children in today's environment, i.e. subsidy > over-investment > unsustainable bubble > crash. Inescapable. Besides, no-one should be forced to subsidise anyone else's lifestyle choices, it's not for the state to decide whose lifestyle is preferable. And you can bet your a$$ that goes both ways.

Conversely, active destruction of the nuclear family by feminist/marxist/lesbian/alien/reptile people...I'm only half joking! Or a one child policy. Just different kinds of "experts" thinking they can engineer a better society. Bullsh!t, it's always bullsh!t. Besides the fact that it's completely immoral, the unintended consequences are always worse than the perceived "problem" they set out to fix. Populations will make fairly rational decisions about reproduction in response to their changing economic environment, if they're allowed to, and state coercion only serves to distort those decisions.

All that remains is for the state and other experts to get out of the way, and let individuals get on with the "business" of making families.
 

backbreaker

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I will say this.. that i do believe that America's biggest problem is the demise of the nuclear family. Kids that are raised by both parents grow up to be more stable, more mentally heaither, have higher self esteem, and generally grow up to be more productive members of society.

If you fixed this, i think a lot of issues would work off this.
 

Bible_Belt

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Birth rates decline when populations have a negative outlook on the future. If the world is going to be a better place in the years to come, then it makes sense to have children.

But most people agree that the world is getting worse, not better. With each passing year, we have more people competing for limited resources. Globalism and technology have eliminated most of the jobs that are worth having. The middle class is gone and never coming back. Public debt is skyrocketing and the world financial system is like a house of cards swaying in the breeze.

Although if my girlfriend got pregnant, we'd keep the baby, at the same time I am certainly not going out of my way to try and have kids. The best thing I could do for the children of the future is not to have any of my own.
 

Nutz

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Fix the problems described here http://dontmarry.wordpress.com and a lot of things will change. Right now women can divorce for cash & prizes which just gives them tons of incentive to divorce. Before no-fault divorce people were stuck with each other unless someone cheated, was abusive, etc. Divorce for frivolous reasons just wasn't possible by and large.
 

Buddha_Mind

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Bible_Belt said:
But most people agree that the world is getting worse, not better. With each passing year, we have more people competing for limited resources. Globalism and technology have eliminated most of the jobs that are worth having. The middle class is gone and never coming back. Public debt is skyrocketing and the world financial system is like a house of cards swaying in the breeze.
I feel these same things man. I am in no way financially prepared for a child, I am still struggling to build my own base, but what you've noted above is why I am so doubtful of having kids in my lifetime...It truly is a Fvcked up World and if we are at 7billion, how will it be at 10/12billion by 2050 or 2075..

It's going to be a nasty place here...

At the same time the future is going to need good people. There is also a lot of intrinsic reward in being human in having a child. AKA, spiritual nourishment whatever you want to call it from having a living thing that you grow and shape...

At the same time, the world they are being raised in definitely is Scary As Fck.

OP: I understand what you are saying--find a woman who values the nuclear family and being a 'good wife' and sees her self-identity in those ways...that China encourages that lifestyle, whereas in the West the nuclear family is degrading...

That being said, I do see a lot of people my age who are settling down and starting their families...there are still a lot of people who WANT that model (men and women)

I think it would be somewhat ignorant to say every western household will fail in their attempts to have family.
 

Buddha_Mind

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PS -- OP, I would never trust the chinese government's model of family...someday they're going to run the world and force all of us (including in the USA after our economy is sold out to them) to submit to the One Child Only Law.
 

Wilko

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Buddha_Mind said:
It truly is a Fvcked up World and if we are at 7billion, how will it be at 10/12billion by 2050 or 2075..

It's going to be a nasty place here...
Actually BM, check this out...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:World_population_growth_rate_1950–2050.svg

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:World-Population-1800-2100.svg

Don't be put off by the fact I'm sourcing Wikipedia, those graphs are straight from the U.N. (Whatever stock you put in that, lol)

Those "scary" high range estimates of 10-12 billion assume constant fertility, when in fact, we can see that the rate of growth is decelerating. The low-range estimate of 6.3 billion is actually a lot more likely.

Resource depletion is a misnomer, but I won't get into that here.

And by all objective measures, the average human's quality of life and safety is constantly improving.

http://www.hsrgroup.org/human-security-reports/20092010/graphs-and-tables.aspx

There's actually good reason to be optimistic about the state of the world, but that hardly makes for sensational news or good political capital, so it goes largely unnoticed.
 

backbreaker

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you know, i'm married. not only am I married, i'm quite content in being married.

the more I get to know me as the older I get, i realize that despite all the plates i spun, the women i dated, at the end of the day I'm quite traditional and old fashioned. I always liked the idea of being married even if I didn't want to admit it. Even when I didn't like the idea of marriage it never was marriage in itself it was that i never thought i would meet a woman worth it.


one of the running motif's on this forum is single guys asking marriage guys what's the point. And reading this thread, seeing what's going on in the news this week, helps me clarifgy the point of why I am married... Because at the end of the day I feel that being married makes me a more productive member of american soceity; my kid is rased in a better home, beucase both of us work from home, actually I work she doesn't, he gets all the attention and are he needs and will grow up and be a sharp little dude with every advantage we can give him. I am more efficent at work beucase im' not spending 2-3 nights a week spinning plates. Not only that she's my virtual assistant.

It has nothing to do with sex or how many women i can ****, and while i painstakingly made sure that the she was the one for me, in the back of my mind, i prayed she would pass every test that was there, beucase i wanted her to be my wife.

I mean, that' sjust me. I like sex. Don't' get it twisted backbreaker can be single tomorrow and would survive. But it's honestly not what i wanna do if it can help it.

I mean I look at our family and while me and my brother and my other brother are all quite smart, we are all quite ****ed up lol. I have my issues i know i have my issues, with the past drug use and i'm very introverted beucase i don't trust people, and my little brother will do anything possible to get approval from anyone beucdase no one was ever around to give it to him growing up.. smart as a whip, but he has very bad self esteem issues. and poor braylon (my 12 year old brother) must think my dad is a traveling guest at this house beucase he's in and out so much. then my little sister eats too much and has taken to being a tom boy basically.. there is no strong male figure in her life.

i can't shake this out of my head with all that is going on in the news, i keep coming back to families. yeah guns and mental health is important but our families values have gone to hell in a hand basket. \


I don't so much agree that feminism is ruining men.. at the end of the day women still want **** lol. it might be harder to get a good woman and you might have to go through a few, but the ace in the hole so tos peak si that women are going to still need ****, regardless of how feminist they are.

but I wholeheardly agree that feminism has killed the nuclear family. it's now taboo to say that women should be at homet aking care of the kids. my wife is a homemaker and even with me being home i don't nkow how most families manage with both parents at work she's SWAMPED everyday. and we just got 1 kid. i can only imagine the **** that gets neglected.
 

AW1983

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backbreaker said:
I will say this.. that i do believe that America's biggest problem is the demise of the nuclear family. Kids that are raised by both parents grow up to be more stable, more mentally heaither, have higher self esteem, and generally grow up to be more productive members of society.

If you fixed this, i think a lot of issues would work off this.
Damn I agree wholeheartedly man. I think 90% of the AFCism and BPD epidemic is directly attributable to lack of strong family life in these people's youth. They had no truly masculine (or feminine) role models growing up and their personality/self-esteem/identity really suffers for it.

It's actually a relief to me when some of the married dudes on here relay that they found a good woman who understands her role. From some of the ranting around here you'd think there are none to be found in the US, period. I mean, I don't want any of that now (marriage/family/kids/responsiblity) but I imagine I will someday.

I also have to admit that the idea of having kids in these times is intimidating at best, downright terrifying at worst. But then I remember the world probably always seemed at it's worst in every time period. A lot of our parents lived through the Cold War, Cuban Missile Crisis, Kennedy getting shot, Vietnam, Black Monday, etc, etc.

But I turned out alright haha.
 

Jitterbug

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Not everyone wants to live in China, LiveFreeX, where your marriage dream is enabled thanks to the culture and the laws.

However, I'd fear for the future when there are 100 millions more men than women in that country, and someone tells them the foreign bastards are stealing their women...
 
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