Hello Friend,

If this is your first visit to SoSuave, I would advise you to START HERE.

It will be the most efficient use of your time.

And you will learn everything you need to know to become a huge success with women.

Thank you for visiting and have a great day!

I just don't give a s*** about women anymore.

Anargyros

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No, I'm not into guys. But after tremendous suffering because of (several) oneitis, a huge (almost suicidal) depression after my ex left me, and the whole fact that we're somehow supposed to "prove" ourselves to women and do all the work, while they have plenty of choices and having to say "yes" to whoever they want is sufficient, as a mathematical equation, women bring more suffering to our lives than joy. Even when they do give us LOTS of joy, you have to PAY for your involvement once she decides to pursue other d**ks. And suffer. And, well, if you want to enjoy a relationship, you gotta become involved. Then you are dependent. Yeah you can be in a relationship and not care at all, be the alpha guy that she is crazy about, but how does it make you happy if you don't care?. You won't really get full satisfaction out of a relationship unless you DO care. So I've decided to NOT CARE AT ALL about women in the first place and just leave them apart of my life.

I'm expecting someone to explain to me in rational terms why women are still worth it. Specially in this f**ked up society. I know I sound crazy, but at the same time it's just f**cking rational
 

Chamber36

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No, you make perfect sense. And in a way I can relate.

Women in general cannot be trusted. They "love" you for your money, etc.

But I would just focus on myself if I was you. Try and have a varied lifestyle. Make money, take good care of yourself, make nice acheivements career-wise, or education-wise.

You could give up on women in life for a few years, sure. But I don't think you're ready to make that decision right now, in such an angstful state of mind.

If you do all those things and make sure you look good, by staying fresh, hitting the gym hard and wearing nice clothes, there should obviously be chicks that like you.

Don't try to "prove" yourself to women. They are fvckin stup!d with their idea of men. To me, they don't seem to have gotten the update, that not every guy is out to "impress" a chick.

They have their egoes elevated onto a stick, it's so retarded. For example I was in a bar just chattin to some girl whose friend told me she already had a boyfriend. Then suddenly she mentions to me out of the blue that she had a boyfriend. I just kinda looked at her like she was crazy, but I was really at a loss for words because I already knew that, but what did she expect?
Me to qualify myself and explain to her that I just like "talking", and ask her if we can just "talk"? I'm not going to stoop so low. I'm also not enough of an ******* to go "Oh thx for the update, I'll just skip you then, bye!".

They all have their heads up their asses anyway. A few of them are cute. I'd say just focus on yourself, make your life easy, enjoy your life, make your house nice, fvck some prostitutes if you must, and maybe find a nice cute girl that's not a b*tch.
 

Tenacity

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Anargyros said:
No, I'm not into guys. But after tremendous suffering because of (several) oneitis, a huge (almost suicidal) depression after my ex left me, and the whole fact that we're somehow supposed to "prove" ourselves to women and do all the work, while they have plenty of choices and having to say "yes" to whoever they want is sufficient, as a mathematical equation, women bring more suffering to our lives than joy. Even when they do give us LOTS of joy, you have to PAY for your involvement once she decides to pursue other d**ks. And suffer. And, well, if you want to enjoy a relationship, you gotta become involved. Then you are dependent. Yeah you can be in a relationship and not care at all, be the alpha guy that she is crazy about, but how does it make you happy if you don't care?. You won't really get full satisfaction out of a relationship unless you DO care. So I've decided to NOT CARE AT ALL about women in the first place and just leave them apart of my life.

I'm expecting someone to explain to me in rational terms why women are still worth it. Specially in this f**ked up society. I know I sound crazy, but at the same time it's just f**cking rational
Women are not worth "IT"....what I mean is, they aren't worth a lot of time. The way you deal with this market of women is the following:

- Do not get married

- Don't make children with them

- Don't move them in

- Don't pay their bills

- Put them lower on your priority list

Of all of your list of priorities, let's say you have 10 priorities, women should be number 9 or 10. You want to still deal with women because you need the sex and companionship, but understanding that their value is VERY LOW, you just don't want to invest a lot of time or energy into them.

Also look into and get good at pulling chicks online. I'm very efficient at that. Back in the day I had to take time out to meet chicks because when you are doing it face to face, it takes longer. Online, send out the same inbox message to 50 chicks, get 15 responses, get 6 numbers, date/fvck 3 of them, go on about your life.
 

Tenacity

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Ruler said:
I think you don't understand the idea quite right...

What we teach on SS is making YOURSELF happy, and let the women come to you. Work on your social skills and become a super confident, fun loving, charismatic person. People will revolve around you and you'll have to put in zero work, although you should always strive to become better and better socially.

So become successful, get rich, and do fun stuff without worrying about women. They will come to YOU if you just do you. And it won't be superficial women who you seeked out, it will be women with high interest levels that will work to please you in the relationship. It won't happen over night, and you may become de-motivated, but just keep working and focusing on you. If you bump into a girl at a bar or something and she's interested, strike up a convo and see where it goes. Don't try too hard and relax. She'll know that you are successful and confident without you flashing anything by the way you carry yourself. It will attract her. You'll probably take her home.

And then you'll start spinning plates. Women will be even less important to you now, and you'll have your choice of mates.

So for now, do you and focus on you. Things will get better.

With all due respect Ruler, unless you are a SUPER good looking guy or a celebrity, chicks aren't coming UP to you my friend. You are still going to have to pursue them.
 

Atom Smasher

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I'm in agreement with Ruler, in fact +1 to him.

To add to his points, a man can do a lot to overcome mediocre looks by displaying a sense of style, being fit and carrying himself like a king. Women evaluate the whole picture, not just intrinsic looks (not discounting their value, just saying that mediocre looks can be compensated for).

I have found that women believe about you that which you believe about yourself. If you brainwash yourself into thinking you're a great-looking guy, you WILL become one by two mechanisms:
1) She believes what you believe.
2) If you believe it you will start taking tiny subconscious actions that will factually improve your looks (grooming, etc.).

Give me enough time and I can make any woman "know" that the sky is green with pink polka dots. They are extraordinarily malleable. The trick for us men is to compress the time factor.

Women may not directly pursue, but they "present" themselves. I can't tell you how many chicks I have walking past the doors to my offices, loitering around, and hoping for some attention. That is female pursuit.
 

Anargyros

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Ruler said:
I think you don't understand the idea quite right...

What we teach on SS is making YOURSELF happy, and let the women come to you. Work on your social skills and become a super confident, fun loving, charismatic person. People will revolve around you and you'll have to put in zero work, although you should always strive to become better and better socially.

So become successful, get rich, and do fun stuff without worrying about women. They will come to YOU if you just do you. And it won't be superficial women who you seeked out, it will be women with high interest levels that will work to please you in the relationship. It won't happen over night, and you may become de-motivated, but just keep working and focusing on you. If you bump into a girl at a bar or something and she's interested, strike up a convo and see where it goes. Don't try too hard and relax. She'll know that you are successful and confident without you flashing anything by the way you carry yourself. It will attract her. You'll probably take her home.

And then you'll start spinning plates. Women will be even less important to you now, and you'll have your choice of mates.

So for now, do you and focus on you. Things will get better.

Yes this represents a whole paradigm on SoSuave. Work for "yourself" and you'll get chicks. I even believed it myself
I respect it and it has the best intentions but I think it's utopian bulls***.
Why?
People ask "How do I get better with women". Many SoSuavers respond. "Work on yourself".
And then they go and workout, dress better, make more money, improve their social skills... for what? For themselves? What was the original motivation?. Yes, THEY END UP DOING ALL THOSE THINGS FOR WOMEN.
People come here and read this kind of advice, which again I respect, but they end up going and build some muscles in order to grab attention from their oneitis. Or they make more money in order to make that hot coworker fall for them... or they dress better for..... well you get the idea. I hope whoever is reading this and has fallen in this trap be honest and admit it.

In order to work and improve yourself, you really need to do it for yourself which I'm certain that is not the case for many SoSuavers. They do it for p**ssy. I'd rather have this advice "Do all those things to get women". Be honest, you do it to get someone else's approval. Not because you want to improve yourself.

In order to improve yourself, you gotta do what YOU want and makes you happy regardless what women think. That might mean working as a freelancer and make poor money but have freedom. Or drinking lots of beer because you want to and you don't care about that belly. Or being too lazy to workout. Or accepting the fact that you're an introvert guy and being happy with it. Why? Because you don't care about women. THEN you're working on yourself.

The point is that whenever you're truly living your own life without relying on others' approval, if you truly DON'T CARE about women, you'll just end up shifting your energy to things that won't necessarily get you any better with women. You might spend your time reading a book, or playing a videogame, or finding a new hobby you SUCK at, instead of hitting the gym or build social skills or doing things that makes you attractive.

SoSuave's "For yourself" means "For yourself in order to get chicks". It's just a lie to negate the fact that you live for women, while at the same time you think they're your #9 priority. Feels good. It's a lie.

The real "For yourself" is a whole different deal.
 

Chamber36

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If you were really done with women you wouldn't be so frustrated about it. You would just casually not care so much.

And so, you obviously care about women.

That's why I told you, that I agree women are sh*t 90% of the time. Either you simply lower your standards and decide you just need one that's attractive and submissive, or you live your life doing what you want and wait for a chick to just appear out of the blue like a pokemon.
 

Solomon

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Tenacity said:
Also look into and get good at pulling chicks online. I'm very efficient at that. Back in the day I had to take time out to meet chicks because when you are doing it face to face, it takes longer. Online, send out the same inbox message to 50 chicks, get 15 responses, get 6 numbers, date/fvck 3 of them, go on about your life.
heh at this...too bad online chicks are terrible if you live in small/midsize town

Best to hit to hit the field

Besides online chicks tend to be uglier than their profile pics anyway
 

Anargyros

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Chamber36 said:
If you were really done with women you wouldn't be so frustrated about it. You would just casually not care so much.

And so, you obviously care about women.

That's why I told you, that I agree women are sh*t 90% of the time. Either you simply lower your standards and decide you just need one that's attractive and submissive, or you live your life doing what you want and wait for a chick to just appear out of the blue like a pokemon.
My frustration is due to the fact that I wrote a post wondering whether women are worth it or not, and I got an explanation about how to get women as a reply. I appreciate it. However the whole point of my original post was just missed.

Isn't it funny?. I might be really done or not with women, but the fact is that everyone here is so obsessed about women that they didn't even notice that my post was something "Hey, right now I think women aren't worth it. Can you tell me, given these facts I'm pointing out, if they're worth it?".
And what is even funnier is that they say.. "shoo, ok, make yourself happy.. dress better........ and you'll get women!!". The implicit premise is that you need women to be happy, with a "do it for yourself" makeover. Do you see it?
 

Chamber36

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Hmmmm... I get your point.

But I think they're trying to convince you that you shouldn't try to "prove" yourself to women, but that you should make them want to prove themselves to you. And that can be a lot of work, depending on where you're starting out from.

I still have tons of work to do, even though I can attract nice hot babes the way it is, I just am not satisfied with my life right now tbh, that's why I'm not really attracting the babes, while I feel like these girls can fill up the void in my life right now - which they can't lol.

I've only ever been happy living in the caribbean, where I grew up. Even after I come back from a holiday, I attract 9's easily, because my game is just over 9000, but after a few weeks or months in this system which we call capitalism I get lethargic, lazy, etc. On the other hand though I like europe as there's so much going on. Problem is just that life is tough.

Maybe your problem is something similar.
 

MountainSlide

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Anargyros said:
My frustration is due to the fact that I wrote a post wondering whether women are worth it or not, and I got an explanation about how to get women as a reply. I appreciate it. However the whole point of my original post was just missed.

Isn't it funny?. I might be really done or not with women, but the fact is that everyone here is so obsessed about women that they didn't even notice that my post was something "Hey, right now I think women aren't worth it. Can you tell me, given these facts I'm pointing out, if they're worth it?".
And what is even funnier is that they say.. "shoo, ok, make yourself happy.. dress better........ and you'll get women!!". The implicit premise is that you need women to be happy, with a "do it for yourself" makeover. Do you see it?
cost/benefit approach.

Costs of women:
-Headaches
-Having to listen to them
-Having to put up with dumb bishes not answering your messages or flaking on dates
-Maybe spending some extra dough on dates
-They use up your time
-Drama/not understanding what goes through their heads.

Benefits of women:
-You get laid
-Some chicks are pretty cool to chill with actually
-Maybe you will be more happy and less lonely
-The chase can be fun. I get a rush from working out these different women.
-Some of them will cook you food and clean your place.
-You don't have to jack off all the time.

There are probably more things we can tack into either category but the point is that having women around is better than not, even though they piss me off
 
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Cremasta

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Anargyros said:
I'm expecting someone to explain to me in rational terms why women are still worth it.
Yep, I see your problem is right here.
Women in general, may or may not be worth it. But finding the right woman IS definitely worth it.

For your own sanity, stop trying to make everything so rational. Women (and life in general) can't be boiled down to some boolean, logical equation where the solution is Anargyros=Happy. It just doesn't work that way.

Think of finding the right woman as playing a game of rugby (or whatever contact sport you think is manly). It can be hard work, and some days you'll come away with a black eye, but when all is said and done, you're in there because you're having fun and you like playing the game.

Don't let a few setbacks stop you from having fun playing the game.
 

Tenacity

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A couple of points here:

1.) I disagree with the indirect approaches to a direct goal.

If you are looking at acquiring a particular client, you go up to him and introduce yourself and your services. If you are looking to attract WOMEN, you have to continue to improve/maintain the fundamentals (your looks, money, style, car, place to stay, personality, etc) while also continuing to MEET women directly by gathering numbers, dates, etc. This entire concept of let's just go out and have "fun" and indirectly hope to meet a chick, is just sort of lame to me. If you wanted to go out and have fun then okay, but if that's not your TRUE intentions, all you are doing is lying to yourself. There's nothing wrong with going out for the sole purpose of meeting women, it's just how you do it and where you do it that matters. Plus, if I'm going out to have fun, I'm not really focused on meeting chicks at all lol. If me and my boys are going to a damn UFC fight, I'm not looking at sarging on women during halftime, I'm looking at getting another drink and discussing who is going to win the next match lol. Fun time is FUN time, sarging time is SARGING time.


2.) I disagree with the "As You Think, You Shall Become" mantra

This is the Law of Attraction at its finest, and I don't believe in it. I am 31, 5'9, and can't play basketball to save my life. No amount of positive thinking is going to get me to the NBA lol.

There's more to what a guy has to do in order to build a good amount of plates, then JUST working on himself. It's funny because it's as if the women are "working" on themselves that hard, and apparently they don't require guys to work on themselves that much or you wouldn't see so many women with kids from broke, dusty, dudes.

Instead, the approach should be to present a good product (this is the work on yourself part) but you have to also GO OUT and sell the product. That is, you have to go out and every single week meet new women. That's the only way you really truly develop confidence and learn how to deal with women anyway, you are continually meeting new women, seeing different personalities of women, different characters of women, etc, etc. Eventually you will develop your own "style" and that's the style you would use to bring your plates in.

But that takes more than just "believing you are something special," you have to go out and do the work. Go out, get rejected, try again, tweek this, tweek that, add this, add that, get laid, get laid again, get laid again, and then develop your own theory on how YOU get laid consistently.

Women are NOT going to come up to you because you are standing against the wall looking like a GQ model unless you are a celebrity of some sort. Also the woman "walking by you multiple times" can be that she wants you or it could be that the restroom is by your seat and she's having some personal problems. If you want the woman, YOU approach her.


3.) It's About Time Management

Solomon, everything happens online in 2015. You bank online, you do business online, you complete degrees online, you network online, I don't know why you guys are stuck in 1999 and believe that online "dating" is something that isn't applicable lol. So the world is doing everything else online with good or better quality, but meeting chicks online is just a horrible method?

Every single chick, you would meet at the local club, is online. I guarantee you. She has either a Facebook account or a Twitter, and/or has been on one of the major free dating sites at least ONE time in her life (Match, OKC, POF, etc).

So going back to my "putting women as a low priority" example, say I have 18 hours a day that I'm awake, the other 6 hours I'm sleeping. 10 hours of that day I should be doing some type of work related activity which might be directly for work or perhaps studying something or completing a college degree program. 1 hour of that day I'm working out, 1 hour of that day I'm eating meals, 1 hour of the day I'm washing myself or my car, and I spend about 2 hours of that day driving back and forth to places. That's 15 hours, leaving me with 3 hours left. Now, let's say I'm going to use that 3 hours to meet women.

- Option 1: Go down to the local club or bar or (insert any place where chicks my age hangs out). I have to get ready to go there and I have to drive there, so that leaves me a solid 2 hours left. Within that 2 hours, I manage to speak with about 3 chicks and get 1 number.

- Option 2: I have my POF and OKC free accounts. I pull up 100 chicks within 40 miles of driving distance that look relatively good. I send a note to all 100 chicks, I'm done with that in about 90 minutes. From those notes, I get 25 - 30 responses, which turn into 10 - 15 numbers, which turn into 7 - 8 meet-ups, which turn into 3 - 5 fvcks.

Which option is the better choice based on time management and performance?
 

JohnyTheArrow

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You sound drama-quenish, I have a challegene for you : try to live alone. And trust me, being alone, alone just by yourself , for long time,you make you so crushed and akward, you will take any woman under your roof to feel the human touch again.

Our brain is wired for social interaction, being alone will hurt you more than any drama caused by a woman.Why you think most harsh penalty in prison is isolation ? Why you think there are books about how hard and mad is life on desert island ?

Dont be drama queen like this MGTOW guys.Get your shvt together ,boy.
 

_sideways_

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Anargyros said:
No, I'm not into guys. But after tremendous suffering because of (several) oneitis, a huge (almost suicidal) depression after my ex left me, and the whole fact that we're somehow supposed to "prove" ourselves to women and do all the work, while they have plenty of choices and having to say "yes" to whoever they want is sufficient, as a mathematical equation, women bring more suffering to our lives than joy. Even when they do give us LOTS of joy, you have to PAY for your involvement once she decides to pursue other d**ks. And suffer. And, well, if you want to enjoy a relationship, you gotta become involved. Then you are dependent. Yeah you can be in a relationship and not care at all, be the alpha guy that she is crazy about, but how does it make you happy if you don't care?. You won't really get full satisfaction out of a relationship unless you DO care. So I've decided to NOT CARE AT ALL about women in the first place and just leave them apart of my life.

I'm expecting someone to explain to me in rational terms why women are still worth it. Specially in this f**ked up society. I know I sound crazy, but at the same time it's just f**cking rational

Ur beta or not fun at all. We all r ugly but we all laugh. Ur not laughing at the moment. But stop being fat.
 

nismo-4

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I never bought into the whole work on yourself trope.

It's good to do so, but unless you are very attractive in looks or finance, you can't expect to work on yourself and have a Victoria's Secret angel fall into your lap a week later.
 

SteR

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nismo-4 said:
I never bought into the whole work on yourself trope.

It's good to do so, but unless you are very attractive in looks or finance, you can't expect to work on yourself and have a Victoria's Secret angel fall into your lap a week later.
Nobody's ever said that models will start falling into your lap, but what's the alternative? Not work on yourself and stay at the bottom of the pile?
 

jurry

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It isnt about being some insensitive a-hole who doesnt care about women or that you wont do things to be more attractive to them, it is about reading her, understanding her, and calibrating your own interest and attention based off what you are seeing.

Based off of your past it sounds like you are doing horrible at this and that having her or not having her is completely determining your satisfaction in life. It isnt this absolute scenario where you just dont give a fvck and never be attached or on the other end that you go completely overboard obsessing with a girl. You need to be satisfied with just you and just your life, you dont need women but you want them because, well youve got a dîck and theyve got a vag so why not? But your success or failure with them isnt (or shouldnt be) all that important to you.
 

zekko

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Ruer said:
I meant going out with a group of friends to go to a swimming hole and meeting women through friends. You didn't actively seek them out, but met them via you going out and focusing on having FUN.
This makes for a good example. You can improve yourself until hell freezes over, but unless you have set up a lifestyle and an environment where you are able to meet new women, it isn't going to do you any good. If you happen to enjoy getting out and swimming with some friends, you are way ahead of the game, because chances are you going to be in natural situations to meet women.

A lot of guys don't put themselves into these situations where they will meet a lot of women. A lot of guys don't really have to try (I'm guessing Ruler falls in this category), it just occurs naturally for them. When I was younger, I tried to put myself into every social situation I could find, because I was determined to improve my social skills. Unfortunately, now that I'm older, people just get on my nerves a lot of the time.
 
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