Getting into martial arts. Anyone with experience?

My goals in order of importance (obviously besides learning to fight) are:

1) Focus on improving reflexes to evade/move around attacks. I don't want to just learn how to beat somebody up, I want to train and improve my body just like I do in the gym
2) If possible take up an art that doesn't restrict itself too heavily, like only grappling, only ground fighting, only striking, only striking without knees and elbows and so on

I know that's quite broad, but anyway... what would you recommend?

Krav Maga is a great mix of striking, grappling and evasion. I would recommend looking into Krav.

The only problem is that there are a lot of fake Krav schools out there so you have to do your research.

You'll want to study a grappling art and a striking art. BJJ and wrestling are the two most popular grappling arts. For striking, boxing and kickboxing are the most popular.

Krav is krap.

Do boxing/wrestling or muay thai/judo. Those combos flow well.

Also, at 22, your street fighting days should be over in the next couple years in my opinion.

FairShake said:

Krav is krap.

Do boxing/wrestling or muay thai/judo. Those combos flow well.

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Why is Krav crap? is it because of so many fake schools?

Also about street fighting, I've never been in one and don't plan to be.

AttackFormation said:

Why is Krav crap? is it because of so many fake schools?

Also about street fighting, I've never been in one and don't plan to be.

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It's crap because it doesn't practice on truly resisting opponents and it's supposed best moves are never realized since they could cause damage to the eyes or testicles. They are just done in the air, just miming the actual move. A punch from boxing, a kick from kickboxing, a take down from wrestling and a throw from judo are actually completed against people trying to do the same thing to you. Krav Maga is just a choreographed dance with two people doing the moves they have been taught to do.

FairShake said:

It's crap because it doesn't practice on truly resisting opponents and it's supposed best moves are never realized since they could cause damage to the eyes or testicles. They are just done in the air, just miming the actual move. A punch from boxing, a kick from kickboxing, a take down from wrestling and a throw from judo are actually completed against people trying to do the same thing to you. Krav Maga is just a choreographed dance with two people doing the moves they have been taught to do.

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All right, it's good you mentioned that because that's exactly what I want to avoid. Imo, if you're training against opponents who aren't resisting then you're really just doing a fancy dance choreography like you also said.

Akido has a bad rep for being a choreographed dance.

MMA is about the best you're going to do if you study one single art, but it will probably be half bjj and half kickboxing. There's K1 kickboxing and Muay Thai; they are similar. Muay Thai includes knee strikes; K1 includes sweeps and throws, which are not allowed in Muay Thai. The basis of the Muay Thai fighting out of the clench is that takedowns are not allowed.

My mma trainer has a background in Japanese jiu-jitsu, not Brazilian. "JJJ" translates to a street fight a lot better than BJJ, which includes a lot of falling on your back and pulling the other guy down on top of you into guard. It works only because the competition is on a mat. The last grappling tournament I entered, the guy pulled guard. I put the sharp edge of my forearm across his face and put all my weight on it. In a street fight, that would slam his head into the pavement, but on a mat, all it does it make him feel a little pain. MMA was frustrating for me in that regard, too. I could pick up my opponent and hurl him in any direction, and he'd just hit something soft and bounce back at me. It's like fighting in the padded room they keep crazy people in.

JJJ was the original fighting style of the Samurai warriors who defended Japan for 500 years, because they kicked everyone's ass who showed up to conquer them. The Japaneses are small in stature, and sometimes had to fight very large Pacific Islanders, thus the focus on joint locks. A small man can break a big man's arm with an arm bar. Everything translates well to the street, because they had to fight on rocks and hard ground. For example, full mount is the most dominant position in mma, but knee on belly is best in a street fight, because the guy on top touches the pavement much less. MMA is the most "real" of fighting sports, but it is still a sport and not a real fight.

Thanks for the input Bible, that's great.

I'm going with MMA, thaiboxing and submission wrestling/grappling. Work 4 days a week for a total of 30 (34 with breaks counted) hours on monday, tuesday, wednesday and friday if I get the schedule I'm planning to request with plenty of time to study/meditate/whatever because of the calm pace at the facility I'll be on 3/4 days, studying two subjects by distance, gym 6 days a week except mondays and 4-7 martial arts sessions per week on monday, tuesday, thursday and sunday.

Let's see if I can keep it up!

MMA as a MARTIAL ART is crap IMO... so many fake ass gym rats claiming they are MMA allstars. I've done 8 martial arts so far and the most useful has been Aikido, the stuff from that is so brutal, you don't need muscle or anything to break bones, its all techniques and learning to manipulate peoples joints. I trained Muay Thai as well and during one altercation I threw a punch and busted my hand so bad that bones were sticking out from different sides. You absolutely DO NOT WANT to hit someone with your hand if you can avoid it. I had a little run in here at a gym recently, I was showing a guy how to punch the bag correctly and from out of nowhere this buff little dude walked up and said "NO thats of NO USE!!! I AM MMA I KNOW PUNCH, U WATCH" in broken English.. then he hit the bag in a very Hollywood way. He turned to me and said "Your techniques would never work on me, you want try?"... I should have said no. I said I'd go really slow just to show him but as I was doing a VERY light arm bar, the dude resisted and came at me with a gut punch which forced me to finish the technique full power, knee him in the stomach and then grab his neck. Within about 3 seconds he was on the floor... I said to him "Listen guy, relax ok or we are gonna get kicked out". Anyway, I'm glad I didn't get kicked out of the gym because apparently he is a trainer and works for them. He was actually just trying to show off in front of my wife to prove a Chinaman could kick a white man's ass... but I've even trained my wife so she knows real martial arts from BS. Anyway do Aikido brother, its absolutely the most practical martial art you will ever use. I haven't seen that guy around since that, I hope that he got fired, I hate people like that.

Last year a dude broke my neck kind of accidentally while doing long sword training, luckily the Chinese chiropractors are good at their jobs or I would have been permanently disabled... anyway if you want a tough as nails 'martial art' that will actually beef you up and teach you amazing ****, go with long sword and short sword fighting. You can get a really sweet WASTER from COLD STEEL that is good to learn techniques with and let me tell you, I would NOT want to go toe to toe with a guy who knows old world techniques. Jesus christ, even if you have a bat or a stick, you can fvck somebody's day up, and the amount of sh1t you learn is incredible. Those knights man, they fvking meant business.. one hit kills. I was not into it prior to meeting the guy who taught me and sort of thought it was bullsh1t but I fell in love with the art, once we started training, it is NOT for the faint of heart. Just knowing that most people were sliced and diced within 2 moves made me really appreciate what our ancestors sacrificed to get where we are today.

Wrestling, Grappling, Punching and Kicking are all overrated and likely of little use on the street. Aikido has stuff that if you do it a little wrong, you'll bust peoples bones, highly recommended. If you are just looking for fitness and sport though keep doing Muay Thai and MMA. One thing that martial arts is SUPPOSED to teach you is respect for your fellow man and that you shouldn't go around thinking you can 'kick someone's ass' because half of the real stuff can permanently disable you. Even in my case last year, he accidentally hit me too hard and the strike cracked my C1 and C2 vertebrae plus gave me a concussion, that is some life changing sh1t right there man. It doesn't take much to fvck someone up permanently. A small concussion can kill a man and the less harmful one can fck up both sight and hearing... I had to lay down in a dark room for a month with no light and no sound and walk around in a neck brace. Unless you fully intend to kill or maim someone, never willingly enter into a fight. IMO MMA is the stupidest thing in the world and those guys are playing with their lives.

JJJ was the original fighting style of the Samurai warriors who defended Japan for 500 years, because they kicked everyone's ass who showed up to conquer them. The Japaneses are small in stature, and sometimes had to fight very large Pacific Islanders, thus the focus on joint locks. A small man can break a big man's arm with an arm bar. Everything translates well to the street, because they had to fight on rocks and hard ground. For example, full mount is the most dominant position in mma, but knee on belly is best in a street fight, because the guy on top touches the pavement much less. MMA is the most "real" of fighting sports, but it is still a sport and not a real fight.

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I started in Aikido when I was 18 and there was this midget in the dojo who was a yellow belt. I got paired with him and stupidly said "I don't want to hurt you" when it came time to practice techniques. That guy was 2 feet tall but he had me on the mats within seconds in the most painful joint locks possible. I think I learned the most about martial arts from him, never judge your opponent by his size. He'd always be hard on me when I partnered with him, in fact I started to dread going to class because of it. So yeah those little Japanese fvkers, they knew their sh1t.

Also just as a quick side note, I found sparring equipment here fairly cheap. Hand Targets for about 5 bucks, Muay Thai pads for 10 and some really sweet MMA boxing gloves for 20 bucks.

www.taobao.com - This place kicks ass for martial arts equipment. I have alot of Leikson stuff

http://www.allmasterssupplies.com/products/?id=4348 <-- Got a pair of these for 20 bucks.

Also they have head protectors and things, these can be really useful in training. Last month I ACCIDENTALLY punched my wife in the face during training.. so I would recommend getting some inexpensive gear to practice with, anything is better than nothing at all.

My edit button doesn't work... anyway I would probably not recommend bringing your gear with you to the gym. That's what I did last week and I think the equipment may have attracted unwanted attention. I just wanted to hit the bag a couple times in my new duds... For some reason, insecure guys always gotta show off, act tough and give 'unsolicited' advice infront of women. I try to be as pleasant, nice and polite with people as possible so his behavior was really uncalled for, I even invited him out beforehand which he loudly declined. In retrospect, it was actually quite stupid as its an all Chinese gym and most of the guys there seem to have 'something to prove' considering there really aren't enough women to go around. Has anyone else found this when going to a gym? Seems that all the muscular guys always assume their years lifting weights confer some special level of combat preparedness. One of my instructors showed me that pulling muscle is probably one of the most painful experiences you'll ever have, you can pull fat away from a person with little to no pain but tearing at a muscle is extremely extremely painful... anyway just remember that, the next time a gym dude tries to flex his muscles your way.

One of the reasons I hate MMA is that for some reason, every guy that works out seems to think he's some kind of street fighter. It makes people think they are tougher than they actually are and that a few punches and kicks or muay thai lessons makes you a bad motherfcker. MMA to me is kind of like the WWF and it seems to have the same effect on guys, it gives them sort of a false bravado. I've never seen anyone do a pile driver and I would expect that many of the WWF moves, if they were REAL, would end in gore, blood baths, deaths and broken bones. Quite a bit of blood and bone comes out when you hit someone with an elbow, I don't think people realize this. I can only imagine those happening on the street but instead of connecting with a body, you connect with the pavement.. that would hurt. Alot of the times when I watch an MMA fight, I find myself questioning if the fight is real and if they are hitting each other at full force. When I've hit and been hit in the past, it was over within a few strikes... these guys who take punch after punch after punch, I don't see how they aren't dead from internal bleeding or blood clots. I mean sh1t, even getting hit full force with a boxing mitt on, hurts like hell.


I would just like to add, before anyone flips out... I hit my wife completely by accident, we were practicing blocks and she let her guard down unexpectedly. Mmmm I would also recommend maybe not doing this with anyone but your wife or bestfriend. I'm teaching my wife just in case I ever need her help or she's ever attacked. I don't want to scare her but rape and assault is a real thing despite present bullsh1t hysterics. I've also taught all my friends, I'm a teacher so that sort of makes me feel good... anyway I just wanted to point that out.

If you are wondering why I like martial arts so much, I had my ribs kicked in by some school yard bullies in junior high. I'm not a maniac and I don't enjoy bloodsport, I believe learning self defense makes people confident, smarter and more assertive. Everyone could benefit from a little training.

It's funny LiveFree, I am giving the MMA perspective here, but you and I are saying a lot of the same things. My trainer's background is in Japanese Jiu-Jitsu, which is really only marginally related to mma. We trained a lot of moves that would have been against mma rules. The regulations of mma are what frustrated me. I would prefer to get in a fight where there is some concrete to slam someone's head into or a nice big window to throw them through. Realistically though, a quick little kick to the nuts will take the fight out of just about anyone. (I got kneed in the nuts while fighting, with a cup on, ref didn't see it, and it was just like a video game where 2/3 of your energy disappears.)

When I was 7 years old, I popped the playground bully in the face, busted his lip and made him bleed everywhere. Then I grew up with the same kids who saw that happen and everyone was always scared of me, so I never had to fight. I was 15 when the punter on our high school football team picked a fight with me after practice. No one had ever taught me how to throw a straight punch, so I swung wildly at his head over and over, missing every single time. Then he hit me in the face once, which was the first time that had ever happened to me. And it wasn't fun. So I grabbed his head and put him in a standing guillotine - except mma had not yet been invented, so I did not know it was a standing guillotine. It was more of a front headlock. You mentioned WWF pro wrestling - that's what I grew up watching as a kid in the 80s. It was the only fight moves I knew. I was going to throw my feet up in the air and drive his head into the sidewalk, but then I thought "oh sh!t, that might kill him. And he's our only punter." Then the volleyball coach came out and made me let him go.

I can tell you that I don't think I ever knew an mma fighter to lose a street fight. A lot of them can hold their own 3 on 1. I know a lot of fighters who were attracted to mma because they had a history of bar fights. Then they would discover mma, realize they were not invincible, and stop street fighting.

The place I used to train was a den of killers as far as fighters went. It had a reputation as the place to go and get humbled. Every night, there would be new guys who would show up thinking they were fierce, get their ass kicked up and down, and then we'd never see them again, because their ego couldn't take it. Maybe that's what let me stick with training; I knew I sucked going into it. I had to train with the den of killers for two years before my trainer let me fight. Even then he told me I was going to get knocked out and be an embarrassment. And maybe I would have if not for him telling me that. I didn't let the other guy hit me once in the face, because I do what my trainer says, once again, because I am not taking any ego into it.

I doubt the quality of instruction at my new dojo is gonna be a problem. The instructors there are either ex Europe champions or ex world champions in their fields, I'm going to bust my @ss and take heed to what they teach me. They have a great presentation too compared to the other dojos.

As for myself... I have 0 illusions about this. In fact, like I said in my OP, the one thing I'm going to focus on the most is developing the ability to not get hit by getting excellent reflexes. And then my other goals are learning how to disable/kill someone in as little time as possible and competitions for fun. I don't do this because I think I'm Tony Montana like those guys coming in with something to prove. I feel more like Yoda

Well it's hard to define who's a legit MMA practitioner since MMA by its nature, mixed martial arts, is technically anyone who practices ANY combination of multiple disciplines.

A guy who boxes and also does wrestling is just as much an MMA fighter to a guy who practices Judo and Thai Kickboxing.

I shouldn't have said Krav is crap. Like anything else you can probably learn something from it.

Aikido is pretty much the same. A good workout and you can learn some cool things but it won't make you a great fighter on it's own.

Start boxing in the inner-city or wrestle with a college club. You will be working with guys who fight hand-to-hand to live (pay bills, pay for scholarship) and use what keeps them on top. And they will hurt you at first. Good to know if you can take it or not.

Put it together in an MMA gym.

Then, after you have a solid base check out some aikido and krav classes for something that most people won't expect.

Start boxing in the inner-city or wrestle with a college club.

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https://ca.sports.yahoo.com/blogs/t...-ex-wwe-superstar-rey-mysterio-192735547.html

This is exactly what I'm talking about. Money is no good if you ain't around to spend it. Get a trade instead.

Aikido will make you an excellent fighter, have you done any aikido FairShake? Joint locks are 1000x better than punching/kicking. Anyone can throw a punch, not everyone can take a punch and turn it into an arm breaking situation. The Katas are also very physically intensive.

The only fight I've ever wanted to get into was one where a DYKE called me out and said she could 'kick my ass' right out of the blue at work because I once said the word 'fag'. I wanted to re-arrange her face so bad, man I would have given my entire month's salary for a no holds barred match against her. Usually people who talk about 'kicking ass' are the type of people who have never fought anyone. They are always the people who will step up in a crowded room but wouldn't say sh1t to you in a dark alley.