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Is there any compound except GH that grows you overall?

Who Dares Win

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We all know how many steroids and PHs help to grow muscles, I was wondering if it exists any compound that make your body grows in all the districts.

I read that ostarine is anabolic not only in muscles but also in bones and tendons but despite running 2 6weeks cycles this year I noticed very limited growth altough I feel like my hands and frame in general got a little big bigger.

I read about and other type of SARM that behave in a similar way GH does but unlike ostarine is much more suppressive.
 

marmel75

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All steroids effect bone and tendons to some degree...its why they can cause atherosclerosis much quicker than you would normally get it, because they increase the calcification process due to the body attempting to increase bone density to match the added muscle
 

xupc

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HGH without anabolics is a waste of money.

Trenbolone at 100-150mg per day will cause massive changes with a low dose of test. Lower doses will work as well if you cant tolerate higher doses.


6 weeks cycles are pointless you need to build the blood plasma levels for several weeks to really see changes. I advocate at least 16+ weeks cycles/blasts with slow estered compounds.

SARMS are a waste of money.
 

xupc

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Who Dares Win said:
It is near impossible to find high purity pure peptides and research chemicals. In most cases you will be throwing money down the drain. Even solid sources provide very low purity/quality.

Also the reality is 99.9% of us can do everything we want with test/deca/tren.
 

marmel75

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Gotta be careful with MK 677, GH and any peptides that increase GH as they will eventually cause you to become insulin resistant/potentially diabetic

Legit peptides are tricky to find especially since Pepbridge stopped selling to the public. Pepbridge was a peptide arm of a chemical company, and their stuff was 100% legit since they actually made their own, not source from China like the rest of these places do.

SARMS are most definitely not a waste of money. I've used them extensively for the past 2 years. They work and work well if they are legit.
 

xupc

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marmel75 said:
Gotta be careful with MK 677, GH and any peptides that increase GH as they will eventually cause you to become insulin resistant/potentially diabetic

Legit peptides are tricky to find especially since Pepbridge stopped selling to the public. Pepbridge was a peptide arm of a chemical company, and their stuff was 100% legit since they actually made their own, not source from China like the rest of these places do.

SARMS are most definitely not a waste of money. I've used them extensively for the past 2 years. They work and work well if they are legit.
I am not sold on SARMS bang per buck 250mg test + 700mg tren will blow away any SARM. However, I am interested to give them a try. You have any suggestions?
 

marmel75

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xupc said:
I am not sold on SARMS bang per buck 250mg test + 700mg tren will blow away any SARM. However, I am interested to give them a try. You have any suggestions?
Yes, obviously that will blow away SARMS, as would pretty much any steroid if used properly. Tren is the most amazing physique altering compound there is period, but it also can have very deleterious effects on your health if used long term such as an enlarged heart, stiffening of the arteries, greatly increased calcification of the arteries(Vitamin D3/K2 and Magnesium Oil is a MUST, IMO to deal with the excess calcification and make sure it stays out of the arteries), highly damaging to the gut microflora, and numerous other effects if not used in a very controlled manner.

I myself am looking into using a Test/Tren blend for TRT, as research has shown that as little as 50-100 mg a week of Tren has the same muscle building effects as 500 mg a week of Test and greater lipolytic(fat burning) properties, although I am still looking into and trying to talk to people who are actually doing it before I pull the trigger. Its called Micro Tren dosing and its highly effective and apparently very safe at that low of a dosage, pretty much avoiding all the negative sides while getting a lot of the benefits.
In fact, some doctors who deal with bodybuilders/steroid users exclusively have their patients on this form of TRT instead of straight test as they believe the safety profile is actually better(some research points to this as well) and its more effective for muscle building and fat loss.

As far as SARMS go, they were designed originally to prevent cachexia(muscle wasting) in cancer/AIDS patients which is a major reason they end up dying. They were designed to effect only skeletal muscle and bone/tendons without having any effect on the organs or other androgenic properties(prostate, blood pressure, hair loss etc) that steroids do. Basically SARMS are a "light" version of steroids that increases muscle mass but with virtually no side effects, so its a big upgrade over someone who is not using anything, allowing anywhere from 5-10 lbs of muscle to be added over a cycle, depending on the type of SARM, dosage and duration.

Personally I am currently running a "mini" cycle of TRT dose Test E(I'm on TRT) at 175 mg every 5 days, 40 mg Anavar(split doses, first dose with 200 mg of caffeine to add potency), 50 mg of S4(split dose) and 25 mg of Ostarine. Getting great results from it, no sides, one of my favorite cycles I've ran.

What SARM depends on what you want to do. LGD is the most powerful SARM and is good for adding the most muscle, Ostarine is very good for leaning out while building muscle and S4 is good for leaning out, gaining strength and hardening(although you may have to deal with its night-vision effects to some degree or another---don't worry hey go away within a few days of discontinuing usage). S4 and Ostarine together are very effective.
 

xupc

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I am at the moment at 250mg teste pw, 100-120mg tren ed, 250iu HCG, and 0.5 arimdiex 2 times a week.

I seem to tolerate tren very well. After this run I will go back into my TRT regiment (the above with test at 125mg pw and no tren) for several months. However, I am interested in the TRT micro dosing approach. Can you please share your research?

I will have a read (and maybe play assuming my bloodwork from tren comes back OK) on SARMS as they seem to be interesting. Thank you for the writeup.
 

marmel75

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xupc said:
I am at the moment at 250mg teste pw, 100-120mg tren ed, 250iu HCG, and 0.5 arimdiex 2 times a week.

I seem to tolerate tren very well. After this run I will go back into my TRT regiment (the above with test at 125mg pw and no tren) for several months. However, I am interested in the TRT micro dosing approach. Can you please share your research?

I will have a read (and maybe play assuming my bloodwork from tren comes back OK) on SARMS as they seem to be interesting. Thank you for the writeup.

A lot of guys use them as part of their PCT because it helps them maintain their gains and strength much better than if they didn't use anything...
 

xupc

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marmel75 said:
A lot of guys use them as part of their PCT because it helps them maintain their gains and strength much better than if they didn't use anything...
I started using gear because I am on TRT. I had 50 ng/dl testosterone when I was put on testosterone. I am not even going to attempts to pct ;)
 

guru1000

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50 ng/dl? You poor thing. I felt like crap at 350 ng/dl and then sought TRT for life.

Ironically, many believe that TRT is for the physical only. Many entrepreneurs that I know use TRT for augmentation in thinking speed, sharpness and clarity--as well as the ubiquitously-known energy and aggressiveness.

Not to dress up or promote but rather to state the facts, experientially, having an extensive background in sales as a stockbroker in my 20s, TRT increased my sales production by up to 80%. This increased percentage is stated as a comparison of pre- and post-TRT.

I have always believed that TRT augmentation within the higher end of the physiological range (800-1100 ng/dl) made men into better men in all facets of life.
 

xupc

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guru1000 said:
50 ng/dl? You poor thing. I felt like crap at 350 ng/dl and then sought TRT for life.

Ironically, many believe that TRT is for the physical only. Many entrepreneurs that I know use TRT for augmentation in thinking speed, sharpness and clarity--as well as the ubiquitously-known energy and aggressiveness.

Not to dress up or promote but rather to state the facts, experientially, having an extensive background in sales as a stockbroker in my 20s, TRT increased my sales production by up to 80%. This increased percentage is stated as a comparison of pre- and post-TRT.

I have always believed that TRT augmentation within the higher end of the physiological range (800-1100 ng/dl) made men into better men in all facets of life.

I agree man. At 50ng/dl I was feeling like crap. 2 weeks in and felt "awake". I am an academic and trt (250mg test + 1000iu HCG + 1mg arimidex) helps me stay sharp!
 

Who Dares Win

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guru1000 said:
50 ng/dl? You poor thing. I felt like crap at 350 ng/dl and then sought TRT for life.

Ironically, many believe that TRT is for the physical only. Many entrepreneurs that I know use TRT for augmentation in thinking speed, sharpness and clarity--as well as the ubiquitously-known energy and aggressiveness.

Not to dress up or promote but rather to state the facts, experientially, having an extensive background in sales as a stockbroker in my 20s, TRT increased my sales production by up to 80%. This increased percentage is stated as a comparison of pre- and post-TRT.

I have always believed that TRT augmentation within the higher end of the physiological range (800-1100 ng/dl) made men into better men in all facets of life.
I have no doubt that what you say is true but the way you say it it seems that its something you can get in without any conseguence.

Correct me if Im wrong but if you supplement your test level to move from the middle range to the higher range, in the long run your body is gonna decrease the amount of natural test produced, therefore in order to keep that level in the higher range you are gonna need trt for life.
 

guru1000

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I'm not a physician, just a guy with TRT experience. So newbies do not take my posts as medical advice. Do your own research, due diligence, and seek qualified TRT physicians if and when you are ready.

Who Dares Win said:
Correct me if Im wrong but if you supplement your test level to move from the middle range to the higher range, in the long run your body is gonna decrease the amount of natural test produced, therefore in order to keep that level in the higher range you are gonna need trt for life.
I had low T in the 350 ng/dl range, after a few cycles in my 20s.

I tried temporal PCT (30 days), heavy compound exercises, the anabolic diet comprising high fat intake, tribulus terrestris among dozens of other supplements; my baseline levels remained low.

I tried testosterone gels. It was crap.

I tried the HGH/Clomid protocol alone and contemporaneously--which increases your LH/FSH and thus natural T, rather than suppressing natural T, and that combination brought me into the middle range, 500-600 ng/dl.

I tried Cypionate and Enanthate 175-250 mgs/wk, in combination with HCG/Clomid, and my levels soared to 800-1200 ng/dl.

Yes TRT is for life. Conversely, testosterone supplementation can be temporally cycled with proper PCT. I know dozens of individuals whose T levels returned back to norm after cycling following PCT. I also know a few, including myself, whose T level never quite recovered, regardless. Everyone is different. Is it worth the risk? That's a decision you would have to make.

If one had average levels and wished to increase to higher levels without suppression, HCG/clomid combo along with an anti-E might be the solution, although I could see how one can fall into a negative FSH/LH loop following discontinuance.

Quality of life is most important to me. I rather live 60 good years than 90 crappy ones. Not to say that TRT shortens life spans if taken properly. In many cases, TRT can increase life span, as low T is associated with myriad health problems. Just explaining the mindset of TRT for life.
 
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xupc

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Who Dares Win said:
I have no doubt that what you say is true but the way you say it it seems that its something you can get in without any conseguence.

Correct me if Im wrong but if you supplement your test level to move from the middle range to the higher range, in the long run your body is gonna decrease the amount of natural test produced, therefore in order to keep that level in the higher range you are gonna need trt for life.
TRT is for life. You dont TRT for 2-3 years and pct afterwards.

I have issues with the hypothalamus and I need to be on TRT to function.
 

marmel75

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xupc said:
TRT is for life. You dont TRT for 2-3 years and pct afterwards.

I have issues with the hypothalamus and I need to be on TRT to function.
I'm about to start splitting my TRT up between Test and Tren...call it TRT with a kick...

going to start with Test to Tren of 125/25 then go to 100/50 then finally to 75/75 pinning E5D...

Have read a ton of data on this along with numerous people who have experimented with it and have gotten great results running TRT this way with virtually no sides....
 

xupc

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marmel75 said:
I'm about to start splitting my TRT up between Test and Tren...call it TRT with a kick...

going to start with Test to Tren of 125/25 then go to 100/50 then finally to 75/75 pinning E5D...

Have read a ton of data on this along with numerous people who have experimented with it and have gotten great results running TRT this way with virtually no sides....
I get no sides doing 250mg teste + 1g tren.. but I would not do it often or call it TRT ;)

75/75 is a solid cycle/cruise. If you run it for too long make sure you do bloodwork often.
 

Who Dares Win

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What about peptides? anyone tried or is infomed about them?

I've been doing some research and it seems they promote natural GH production rather than suppress it, plus they dont have all the side effects of administration of plain GH.
 

marmel75

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Who Dares Win said:
What about peptides? anyone tried or is infomed about them?

I've been doing some research and it seems they promote natural GH production rather than suppress it, plus they dont have all the side effects of administration of plain GH.
Peptides do work, but more subtly than steroids or even HGH...meaning you can't run them for 2 months and think you are going to notice lot of difference...over a period of 6 months to a year, yes you will notice some difference, but IMO they should be used once you get to a certain point, not to get to that point.

Plus its become harder to find quality providers since a few professional chemical companies shuttered their peptides division, such as Pepbridge. Sometimes you get real stuff, sometimes you get bunk...

IMO, if you are looking for a GH kick, I would go with a SARM called MK-677. ITs been shown in clinical trials to greatly increase growth hormone release, in the same manner as a lot of peptides do, and its easier to find a quality provider of this. Much less expensive in the long run as well...
 
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