Sometimes I feel that this is a bit extreme tin foil hat Territory but then I turn on the television. An ad for eHarmony that showed a man and a woman camping and the woman saving the man from a spider. An ad for a smart TV with the line from the wife to the husband at least the TV is smart. While she is eyeing up the other guy that she obviously wants to branch to. So I turn over the channel and and get treated to an hour-long documentary about what it means to be an indigenous millennial woman which of course blames the patriarchy for it all. It's got pretty bad sign me up for a tinfoil hat.
Hello Friend,
If this is your first visit to SoSuave, I would advise you to START HERE.
It will be the most efficient use of your time.
And you will learn everything you need to know to become a huge success with women.
Thank you for visiting and have a great day!
THE MARGINALIZATION OF MODERN MEN
- Thread starter Dr. Reed
- Start date
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Another niche that's doesn't seem to be well served is grey game. There's a lot of divorced silvertips out there.
I don't doubt your chops in the seduction community doc but commercial success is all about marketing message these days and as others have said it's a crowded market so I think you are going to have to target a couple of niches and stay on message if you are going to make a buck. Maybe try pming Colossus too he had a Kindle book out aimed at a different market if he doesn't mind sharing I'm sure there would be some learnings.
In terms of book content I'd suggest you want to include chapter summaries and quick action plans.
People like quick take out these days. And when it comes to woman so much of it is situational. The quickest improvement is in targeting just not screwing up. So maybe the action plans could be around that because that content is much more generic. And then the chapter contents is where you push your political message and get into the more situational aspects of pick up.
A lot of the well read guys here still rate Doc Loves system which seems quite well aligned with your key messages. But they say it needs a few updates for text and messaging and online dating game. A couple of Good smart Guys here who might help you. @Reykhel in terms of suggesting updates to the doc love material. @deesade could give you a summary of the state of play in modern pickup.
And you are also going to have to consider how to copyright your content. Kindle publishing seems to be quite popular otherwise once a PDF gets up on a torrent site you can forget any commercial returns.
I don't doubt your chops in the seduction community doc but commercial success is all about marketing message these days and as others have said it's a crowded market so I think you are going to have to target a couple of niches and stay on message if you are going to make a buck. Maybe try pming Colossus too he had a Kindle book out aimed at a different market if he doesn't mind sharing I'm sure there would be some learnings.
In terms of book content I'd suggest you want to include chapter summaries and quick action plans.
People like quick take out these days. And when it comes to woman so much of it is situational. The quickest improvement is in targeting just not screwing up. So maybe the action plans could be around that because that content is much more generic. And then the chapter contents is where you push your political message and get into the more situational aspects of pick up.
A lot of the well read guys here still rate Doc Loves system which seems quite well aligned with your key messages. But they say it needs a few updates for text and messaging and online dating game. A couple of Good smart Guys here who might help you. @Reykhel in terms of suggesting updates to the doc love material. @deesade could give you a summary of the state of play in modern pickup.
And you are also going to have to consider how to copyright your content. Kindle publishing seems to be quite popular otherwise once a PDF gets up on a torrent site you can forget any commercial returns.
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Yes, you are correct. But lets be clear: I am not writing this book for the money, I am writing it as someone who is very worried about the ttrajectory of our civilization. Money is secondary. If only my son reads the book I will be happy.
I am unlike other members of the seduction community in that I have extensive training in the complexities of human relations. I am Political Scientist (PhD, MA, BA) but I have been immersed in the academic literature regarding cohabitation and welfare policy. When I taught statistics I assigned those books. That is why I can speak with some authority about the fact that we CANNOT look to tradition gender study fields if we want a solution to this problem. Psychology, woman's studies...they will be of no help whatsoever if we want to end this war on men. Those disciplines are dominated by masindrists. The only academic fields that will inform us are found in quantitative fields. Rational Actor modeling from economics, Evolutionary Biology and Evo Psych have the facts straight, but they will never drive policy. That is why men must protect themselves, no one else will.
I am unlike other members of the seduction community in that I have extensive training in the complexities of human relations. I am Political Scientist (PhD, MA, BA) but I have been immersed in the academic literature regarding cohabitation and welfare policy. When I taught statistics I assigned those books. That is why I can speak with some authority about the fact that we CANNOT look to tradition gender study fields if we want a solution to this problem. Psychology, woman's studies...they will be of no help whatsoever if we want to end this war on men. Those disciplines are dominated by masindrists. The only academic fields that will inform us are found in quantitative fields. Rational Actor modeling from economics, Evolutionary Biology and Evo Psych have the facts straight, but they will never drive policy. That is why men must protect themselves, no one else will.
Understood. And if you were just another pua guy looking to make a quick buck and not put anything back into the community I wouldn't be supporting that. But effective marketing gets your message across to a wider audience.
And I like your science based approach. A lot of what works and doesn't has been researched. To take a concrete example one of the long-running debates here is whether to Kino on a first date or to remain aloof and let her win you over. I remember a French study where they got a guy to ask for numbers on the street same guy same script only difference was a touch on the arm. No touch was a 10% response rate, adding the touch increased it to 20%. Now that is cold approach and if she's agreed to go on a date there's normally some level of interest there so you can say small touches on the arm r a safe approach that is going to work with most women. A lot of the basics have been researched and that can form the foundation of the chapter action plans.
Now getting back to grey game it's a bit like the doc love material. Guys hear readily admit that pickup is different when you're in your forties and fifties but there's not a good Central source of specifics about what is the same and what is different. However what I've done that anyone can do is look over the back posts some of the older members and found how they operate.
There's also a bit of elitism. People saying that by your forties or fifties you should be financially setup and well connected. Well great if you have that good on you however there are approaches to gaming women that don't require those prerequisites so they are applicable to the Average Joe who maybe lost his shirts in a divorce.
So there you go an easy chapter right there.
And I like your science based approach. A lot of what works and doesn't has been researched. To take a concrete example one of the long-running debates here is whether to Kino on a first date or to remain aloof and let her win you over. I remember a French study where they got a guy to ask for numbers on the street same guy same script only difference was a touch on the arm. No touch was a 10% response rate, adding the touch increased it to 20%. Now that is cold approach and if she's agreed to go on a date there's normally some level of interest there so you can say small touches on the arm r a safe approach that is going to work with most women. A lot of the basics have been researched and that can form the foundation of the chapter action plans.
Now getting back to grey game it's a bit like the doc love material. Guys hear readily admit that pickup is different when you're in your forties and fifties but there's not a good Central source of specifics about what is the same and what is different. However what I've done that anyone can do is look over the back posts some of the older members and found how they operate.
There's also a bit of elitism. People saying that by your forties or fifties you should be financially setup and well connected. Well great if you have that good on you however there are approaches to gaming women that don't require those prerequisites so they are applicable to the Average Joe who maybe lost his shirts in a divorce.
So there you go an easy chapter right there.
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SteR
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Sounds like you could write it?
That is why I am here. I already use Pook and Anti Dumps machine, in fact they are both extensively referenced in my second chapter.
I have articles from long ago. They are Political Science Articles and extremely boring. My last 8 years of teaching was at the Community College level, and there is no need to publish there. In the last couple of years I have been writing articles on human performance, but that material is not appropriate for this forum. For example, if you are on steroids I can get you off them and restore your endocrine system to normal. I charge $175 for that service, but I doubt you need it, LOL.
What I do have are 2 semi-finished chapter of my book, the toolbox. That is the stuff you most likely are interested in, yes? There first chapter is about 85% done and the second is about 70% done.
Eventually, I will have my book posted up on my coaching web site. In the meantime I am also trying to get a blog going for my chapters. I hired someone to build my web site but he turned out to be a buffoon. I need to finish my book first.
I would be more than happy to email you my first 2 chapters.
I will say this: The kids on the main forum are in Desperate NEED OF HELP! They need coaching. I try and help now and then but simply do not have enough time.
Most of the threads I read demonstrate that they have not even read the DJ Bible. These kids need to study that text intensely. They need to read it over and over again.
You will see me having disagreements with other top members here, but these disagreements are over smaller matters. We all are on the same page in terms of fundamentals. For example, Des and I may disagree over the possibility of a happy marriage, but as far as all the cultural, social, and legal wars upon men go, our view is exactly the same.
Give me your email please
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Here is something I wrote recently. The kids on the main forum did not seem to interested.
http://www.sosuave.net/forum/threads/natural-verses-structured-seduction-tear-down-that-wall.240843/
sazc
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I saw that post and I saw that no one had replied. Probably too much content in one large dump for the members to take it all in and respond to it. Lots to digest. You are going to be hard pressed to convince these members to change their thought processes, patterns and beliefs, JFYI.
With this new publication, your new book, is the plan to have it peer reviewed? What is your Phd in? May I have a url to your LinkedIn profile? Feel free to DM it to me if you prefer.
I'm not in a personal place to review the first two chapters of your book at the moment. There is a blend of simply not having time (family obligations) and not needing to 'improve my game' (I'm a female)
I am quite interested in the content you post. However, I have always felt that there is missing content discussed on these boards. Personal responsibility, your role in your situation, seems to be ignored here. Assigning blame is rampant. There is also not much discussion on nature vs nurture, and childhood models, and how that plays a significant role in the partners you choose to interact with, and the patterns you repeat. There is a lot of chatter about physically changing oneself in order to be more attractive, and even earning more income to be more attractive, but there is not chatter about cognitively changing oneself in order to move past the patterns that are no longer serving your needs. There's really no deliberate acknowledgement of such patterns - again, just a lot of blame on the opposite sex for what plays out in a relationship. I am not trying to defend females, we're all fvcked up to a degree. But, unless we really look at yourselves, we auto reflexively repeat patterns that are familiar and comfortable, but not necessarily healthy. It doesn't appear that your book is going to address any of these issues?
You mentioned a few dozen posts ago that females fail to bond with there males and, iirc, attributed that to the demise of marriage. Why do females fail to bond with their males?
If you would read you will see that I do in fact address those issues.
You remind me of my students: "We don't want to do the reading, we want you to explain it to us." If you read my first 2 chapters, all your questions would be answered. It is only 40 pages.
Peer reviewed? That would be insanity. In fact, I had to wait until I left academia to write this book. I am a Political Scientist by training. However I have studied a ton of material on cohabitation. That stuff is great because it has solid empirical models that explain female behavior extremely well. It is rational. My book is designed to be a guidebook for men. I use a lot of material from the seduction community, but also academic sources like cohabitation theory and evolutionary biology and evolutionary psychology. I have a program (martial arts and bodybuilding) for physical improvement and spiritual improvement. I use tools from 12 step programs, spiritual understanding of other people and meditation.
Traditional psychology is absolutely worthless when it comes to relationships. They stress "communication." My first wife gave up in the middle of our first session said "**** this" and left. Why? She fell out of love. On the other hand, my current wife will rob banks for me.
I will address a couple of your points here. I don't frame my work as building bonding. I am not sure what that is. My theory (field tested) is that men have one and only one power. The power of love. In todays world the only things you can do is one, pick the right partner, and 2 keep her in love with you. Unfortunately, very few men know how to do so.
You are correct, there are a lot of angry men on this board who blame women and avoid examining their roles in their failed relationships. Think about it: If they were in a good relationship would they be here? Of course not. I was here 14 years ago trying to figure out my situation and I found some great stuff in the DJ bible. I was a regular on MasF and that is where all the masters were.
I came here again and it is the same problem: On the main forum you have a lot of guys who are completely clueless. It is worse than ever. On this, the Mature Man forum you have guys that are smart and very seasoned. They know what they are doing, although they are hampered by their very bad relationships. Yes, they blame women because in our society women bring tremendous sorrow to men. I know this , but I have come back around. Like I said, I don't blame women I blame the choices and mindset our culture has for women and their relationships with men for men. It is a system designed for failure, a system perfectly tailored to destroy families.
That is why the men here, like many others, have opted out of traditional male role models, and I can't blame them.
My first wife was an evil sociopath...but you klnow what? I picked her. One our third date she said she wanted to cut her best friend into pieces because she had not given a coat back that my ex lent her. Talk about rd fkags. My current wife (in my avatar) and I just had a very nice make out session, and treats me like a king. Works all day making lots of money and still brings me dinner every night. She does so because I used my system to select and screen her, and I keep her in love. Very few men know how to do so.
I lay out in my book a rational actor model of female behavior. I posit that women are not evil, they are simply making the best choices that or society gives them. It is the system that is to blame. Women are by nature nurturing and loving, but our society brain washes all of that out of them. You are Scandinavian, yes? Scandinavian women will divorce you in a heart beat, don't get seduced by the blond hair and blue eyes.
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sazc
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@Dr. Reed see above. Thanks in advance
You commented above that you didnt know what "building bonding". I'm not sure why you mentioned that but I am curious if you mean that you dont see bonding as essential in a relationship?
May I get the cliff noes version on how you propose a man 'keep a woman in love with him'?
Am I to understand, because of your derogatory comment on traditional psychology focusing on communication, that your proposal to solve these issues will have nothing to do with communication? Will you be taking your material one step further than traditional 'game' and coaching the man on how to keep her in love with himself, while being true to who he is?
I don't have a linkedln profile. My PhD is in Political Science, from the Rockefeller College of Public Affairs. It is a tier 1 University.
You asked "You commented above that you didnt know what "building bonding". " I take that English is not your first language, but that sentence has syntax issues and is incomplete, so I am still not sure what you are asking. I can say that "building bonding" whatever that means, is not a central part of my thesis.
My thesis is that love, more specifically a woman's love, is what makes or breaks a relationship. Communication, building bonding, none of these things really matter if a woman does not love a man. The only way for a man to have a successful relationship is to keep his woman in love with him.
As stated previously, lets look at couples counselling/therapy. It does not matter if the woman does not love the man. My first wife left our first therapy session because she no longer loved me. My current wife loves me so much that she would do anything for me. Traditional psychology is absolutely useless because it does not teach men how to keep women in love with them. I really do wish you would read my chapters because I explain these matters thoroughly.
Yes, my material goes far beyond game. Game is important because it builds attraction. It is the first step in getting a woman to love you. What I contribute is how to build on that initial love "game." It gets a bit easier, but you can not ever stop doing the things needed to keep a woman in love with you, especially in a society that gives all powers to the woman.
You asked "You commented above that you didnt know what "building bonding". " I take that English is not your first language, but that sentence has syntax issues and is incomplete, so I am still not sure what you are asking. I can say that "building bonding" whatever that means, is not a central part of my thesis.
My thesis is that love, more specifically a woman's love, is what makes or breaks a relationship. Communication, building bonding, none of these things really matter if a woman does not love a man. The only way for a man to have a successful relationship is to keep his woman in love with him.
As stated previously, lets look at couples counselling/therapy. It does not matter if the woman does not love the man. My first wife left our first therapy session because she no longer loved me. My current wife loves me so much that she would do anything for me. Traditional psychology is absolutely useless because it does not teach men how to keep women in love with them. I really do wish you would read my chapters because I explain these matters thoroughly.
Yes, my material goes far beyond game. Game is important because it builds attraction. It is the first step in getting a woman to love you. What I contribute is how to build on that initial love "game." It gets a bit easier, but you can not ever stop doing the things needed to keep a woman in love with you, especially in a society that gives all powers to the woman.
sazc
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@Dr. Reed twice now you have attempted to insult me. The first time was when you referred to me as behaving as one of your students, and now you mention that English must not be my first language. These and a few other nuances that I have noticed about your communication/communication style, do not demonstrate 'professionalism' to me, which is the maturity level that I would expect of a phd professor attempting to solicit information in order to write a book. Because of these observations, I will leave you to your own. I wish you good luck in your endeavor.
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@sazc I noticed that too.
throw you down the stairs.
A lot of the "book" appears to be just extracts taken from other people's work. Perhaps another Corey Wayne in the making.
A little bit petulant to say the least. I think you must have triggered him asking for credentials. Be careful now, he may just
throw you down the stairs.
A lot of the "book" appears to be just extracts taken from other people's work. Perhaps another Corey Wayne in the making.
sazc
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Thanks @Reykhel
My first concern is that this is an internet board. I could have created a username with the abbreviation 'Dr" in it as well and I can claim that I have a phd too.
I dont have a dog in this fight but I noticed that he was annotating his posts with citation information (attempting to give the impression of validity), yet failing to provide a complete reference (from what I saw)
I also felt like he was grooming members to give him an interview. I'll explain what I mean by grooming b/c that's a pretty big word. Again, this is just my perception... When a member would disagree with him, he would push back with his beliefs. If the member continued to disagree, he tended to turn it around with "Can I interview you for my book?" "you are so smart" "you theories are well thought out" etc. Im paraphrasing, but you get the point.
If he does interview anyone from this site, I'm not sure if the interviewee's have contemplated the idea that they need to legally retain complete control over what is actually printed about them and their belief system. As well, is @Desdinova really going to allow his high score theory to be replicated in print without any compensation? Is any other member going to allow their 'research' to be replicated without compensation? General thoughts on the subject of game are one thing, but there are members who have theories that posters use to understand females. Are these people going to allow someone to utilize their research without compensation/proper acknowledgement?
I speak from experience. I was once interviewed for Forbes. They took pictures of me and, in the end, I was on the cover of the publication that my interview appeared in. There were things mentioned in the article (my salary for one) that I didn't appreciate. (I didn't retain control of my story) While I was flattered that they chose me to be on the cover, I realized that they were using my image to sell magazines and I wasnt being compensated. (I didn't retain control of my property) So that's my real baggage here.
For whatever reason my spidey sense was triggered and I went to google and a few other websites. I did find a 55 year old man by that name in Dallas, Tx, and it did mention teaching, but no mention of a phd. I thought - well heck, if he's on the up and up, he should be A-ok to provide credentials. It's VERY surprising to me that a 55 year old teacher, with a Phd has no LinkedIn profile.
I dont know who this person is, and he could very well be exactly what he says he is, I just dont like the thought of people being taken advantage of.
Those are my thoughts. I'm not saying I am right, I'm just sharing.
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@sazc yeah something seems a little "off".
Any doorman who gets fired twice for over aggression is a gormless meathead in my book. Shows a real lack of self control. Granted
anybody can make a "mistake" (twice in this case) but then to go apparently get a Phd and come onto an internet seduction/dating forum with the intention of writing and promoting a book AND mentions in another post that he was fired twice for being overly violent, shows a real lack of tact and awareness.
I'm reading some of his writing and I see in a lot of Doc Love's the system and then the guy mentions "my system". Granted he did say he leaned a lot on Anti-dump whose writing I believe is similar to Doc Love's.
Does a lot of name dropping, is pals with David DeAngelo apparently.
Like you said, maybe he's legit, but seemed to get quite defensive when you asked him for some links.
Any doorman who gets fired twice for over aggression is a gormless meathead in my book. Shows a real lack of self control. Granted
anybody can make a "mistake" (twice in this case) but then to go apparently get a Phd and come onto an internet seduction/dating forum with the intention of writing and promoting a book AND mentions in another post that he was fired twice for being overly violent, shows a real lack of tact and awareness.
I'm reading some of his writing and I see in a lot of Doc Love's the system and then the guy mentions "my system". Granted he did say he leaned a lot on Anti-dump whose writing I believe is similar to Doc Love's.
Does a lot of name dropping, is pals with David DeAngelo apparently.
Like you said, maybe he's legit, but seemed to get quite defensive when you asked him for some links.
