So I have a wife and kids... [Archive] - Don Juan Discussion Forum

Heynow999

07-10-2011, 09:31 AM

To be brief

Married 14 years, two boys under 10. Our relationship has become more like brother and sister rather than husband and wife. She is not interested in sex. Reluctantly does it but tells me to go out and get a girlfriend. So I am going to. I am not going to announce it and will keep it low key. I have a job that requires overnight trips occaisionally and late nights often and I often just go out on my own so I can make time for this.

I have actually started to do this a bit and went on an overnight trip with a women I met, but it has not panned out. I was upfront with her about my home situation, she did not say how she felt about it but she lives with a BF and that stopped her.

I am not leaving my wife. My prime concern is my two boys and maintaining a somewhat normal home life for them. I would leave my wife for another woman, but that means I would have to leave my kids, and I won't do that.

Any suggestions on how to spin this story to women as I met them? I have an ad on POF and I have been chatting with several women and should be meeting some soon.

thanks

Albatross953

07-10-2011, 10:44 AM

Why not game your wife? I have some experience with this topic. Its a rough road you are turning onto.

grayclif

07-10-2011, 11:29 AM

Why not game your wife? I have some experience with this topic. Its a rough road you are turning onto.

http://www.marriedmansexlife.com/

Desdinova

07-10-2011, 11:37 AM

I can't guide you on what you should and shouldn't do with your marriage, as it's entirely up to you. Personally, I think the best method is to end it yourself and get a separation agreement done up ASAP.

But if you think that you need a little fun on the side, get this free e-book. Not only does it follow a lot of the techniques on this site, but it'll give you some pointers on subjects that you may have never thought of before with regards to the risks of cheating on your spouse.

Here's the link. (http://www.cheatmanual.com)

Heynow999

07-10-2011, 11:54 AM

Why not game your wife? I have some experience with this topic. Its a rough road you are turning onto.

While I agree that that may be the easiest way, It is as I say. She is not interested. I have been sleeping with a cold uninterested person for the last several years and I want more than that.

I am NOT cheating. She has told me many times that she does not care if I find a girlfriend. I actually can see us breaking up when the kids are older, bbut until then I need to persever.

As for ending it, I have a responsibility to my kids. I need to provide them with as stable a family life as possible. Breaking up with my wife is not going to make things stable for them.

I guess I can do one of two things if I go out with someone new. Either lie outright, or tell the truth. I tried the truth already and honestly, the woman was not that shocked. I still plan on pursuing her as I know her boyfriend will be leaving the country. I think if I had better skills, it would have worked with her as she gave me many indicators of interest after knowing I was married.

Desdinova

07-10-2011, 12:26 PM

Breaking up with my wife is not going to make things stable for them.

I beg to differ. A child is going to thrive much better if the parents are separated and happy than if the parents are together and miserable.

Again, get the ebook I posted a link to. It will be a good foundation for finding yourself a mistress.

st_99

07-10-2011, 12:40 PM

So what are you going to do when you find out she is banging another guy???

Most likely will happen.

Mr.Positive

07-10-2011, 12:45 PM

Heynow, would you be happy in your marriage if you did have a healthy sex life?

My question is from wondering if a mistress will really help your situation, or just complicate it even more...or worse destroy something that can be fixed.

The lack of sex is an easy thing to focus on as the "problem" with any relationship.

Have you discussed your unhappiness with the situation with your wife? I believe, if she truly cared about you, she's make an effort to work on bettering the relationship.

That will help test her on how she values you as a man. If you make your concerns known, take charge...and she's apathetic. There's your answer.

I'd be bold, blunt, to the point, and call her out on this.

Warrior74

07-10-2011, 04:30 PM

It sounds like you've made up your mind about doing what you want to do in regards to meeting and dating other women while married, and since I've never been in your situation I really can't offer any good advice. But. If you are interested in gaming your wife while you date other women this is one of the most informative posts you can read about this.

http://roissy.wordpress.com/2009/08/14/relationship-game-week-a-readers-journey/

As for other women, my gut says to only explain when they ask. And then tell them that you have an open relationship or make it your wifes fault for being a cold unattentive woman. It's the same justifications they use when they cheat so they will understand. Good luck.

Andy_Dufresne

07-10-2011, 07:35 PM

While I agree that that may be the easiest way, It is as I say. She is not interested. I have been sleeping with a cold uninterested person for the last several years and I want more than that.

I don't comment too much on here, but your story and your response is making my blood boil, dude, only because I was in the same boat years ago and I wish I had done it differently.

First of all, if she is "not interested" there is either extreme medical issues or she is definitely cheating on you. All healthy women love sex just as much as men if not more and if she's not putting out its a sign of a huge problem. My guess is she wants you to go find a mistress so she can justify her actions, or have ammo in court to find cause for divorce. Don't fall for it.

Trust me when I tell you this, I would take every asset of yours and liquidate it...i.e. 401K, cash out and give it to someone you trust, otherwise she'll get half. Also, start removing any/all of your valuables and put it in storage.

After this amount of time in the marriage you can try and game her but I would opt to try and get her to leave. She has made up her mind; it is going to be a bumpy ride from here. "Staying in it for the kids"...you will hear that a lot, however becoming a white knight for the sake of your kids is an expensive and painful proposition. Your kids will respect you way more by seeing you happy. If you arent happy in your marriage throw her ass out FIRST before entering into any affairs.

Zunder

07-10-2011, 07:53 PM

While I agree that that may be the easiest way, It is as I say. She is not interested. I have been sleeping with a cold uninterested person for the last several years and I want more than that.

I am NOT cheating. She has told me many times that she does not care if I find a girlfriend. I actually can see us breaking up when the kids are older, bbut until then I need to persever.

As for ending it, I have a responsibility to my kids. I need to provide them with as stable a family life as possible. Breaking up with my wife is not going to make things stable for them.

I guess I can do one of two things if I go out with someone new. Either lie outright, or tell the truth. I tried the truth already and honestly, the woman was not that shocked. I still plan on pursuing her as I know her boyfriend will be leaving the country. I think if I had better skills, it would have worked with her as she gave me many indicators of interest after knowing I was married.

You know what I am interested in....its not so much your quest for a bit of T&A on the side.....more like it be rather interesting to know what the hell happened to your marriage over the 14 year period where she acts so cold towards you both physically and emotionally?
*Were you ever in love?
*Was her "coldness" towards you gradual....or did she just say one day "My pvssy is off limits I am just not interested anymore"..
*How did you two meet and what do you think attracted her to you in the first place.....I mean she must have liked you enough to marry you....even loved you too?
There are a thousand more questions but you get the idea,
At the moment I am thinking of that new Ryan Gosling movie "Blue Valentine" http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1120985/

As an aside - this may be easy for me to say as I am not married nor do I have children - but be fvcked if I could live with a woman that treated me like your wife does.

speed dawg

07-10-2011, 08:29 PM

You know what I am interested in....its not so much your quest for a bit of T&A on the side.....more like it be rather interesting to know what the hell happened to your marriage over the 14 year period where she acts so cold towards you both physically and emotionally?
*Were you ever in love?
*Was her "coldness" towards you gradual....or did she just say one day "My pvssy is off limits I am just not interested anymore"..
*How did you two meet and what do you think attracted her to you in the first place.....I mean she must have liked you enough to marry you....even loved you too?
There are a thousand more questions but you get the idea,
At the moment I am thinking of that new Ryan Gosling movie "Blue Valentine" http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1120985/

As an aside - this may be easy for me to say as I am not married nor do I have children - but be fvcked if I could live with a woman that treated me like your wife does.

Excellent post Zunder.

Heynow999, please expound on this situation. Much could be learned here.

KarmaSutra

07-10-2011, 09:32 PM

What never-married guys will never understand is the principle dynamic which is presupposed within the marriage.

There's a definitive within the couple's relationship that underlies their understanding of each's place. The husband has an expectation to do certain things or behave a certain way, so does the wife.

I'm not saying every marriage is based on the same suppositions, rather, they're usually what built the foundation for their desire to commit in the first place. Each is unique to that particular couple. But to say there aren't expectations, is unrealistic.

In my marriage, I was the rational half. I took care of the house. The work to maintain it and such. Hers was the financial responsibility; paying bills on time, etc...

Things began to breakdown because I stopped telling her "No". I stopped giving her a reason to think about me when I wasn't there. She did her share of fvcking up too. We stopped fvcking. We'd do it every now and again to shake off the cobwebs, but it was purely for release purposes. There was no passion in the act.

I found solace in other women's orifices while I was married. She fvcked another guy too. What we did was all wrong.

What's wrong with Heynow is the same thing that was wrong with me: I was caged and miserable.

My advice, end it. Split up. Your boys will be in a much safer (and more sane) place. Whether she gives you her blessing to fvck other chicks is completely irrelevant. She's giving away her relationship to you. Her excuse will be to get rid of you due to infidelity if she has proof you did it. Why do you need this headache? End it. Wash your hands of her legally. Go get your own space. Relearn to love yourself, appreciate your boundaries, then bang as much tail as your balls can handle.

Teach your sons that a legacy of cuckoldry is not a life for men.

Heynow999

07-10-2011, 10:32 PM

Ok, I will try and encaplsulate what I think happened

We met over the internet. She was from Ukraine. We wrote and spoke to each other over the phone for 2 years. I went to Ukraine to met her. I felt I knew her well at this point. I stayed for a month. We travelled around the country alot. We got along well. We decieded we would get married, had sex a few times there.

I came back to Canada and began the paperwork to bring her here. Took 9 months. She was here 2 years before we had our first son. Things were pretty normal untill then. She began sleeping in the babies room around then.

Second son 3 years later. Difficult pregnancy, long story, our son was 3 months premature, he spent a long time in the hospital.

Things got worse after that, stress of kids etc

I have had a part in this. I was 185lbs when we got married and I reached a high of 230 last year. I have been dieting and working out and I am now 195 and in pretty good shape. My plan is to get in better shape than I was when I got married, and I am close.

Some things that I think are a problem is just a general drifting apart in the relationship. Also she is religious and I think that holds her back. She rarely orgasims. Oral sex either way is out. She often says that women her age in Ukraine are grandmothers at 40 and shouldn't be having sex.

Is she banging someone else? I doubt it, but I know enough that all women are great actresses and she could be and I would have no idea. I have never had any experiances where I caught her doing something funny. She is a stay at home mom with no cell phone and no email account. I work funny hours and often come home during the day and never seen anything. My neighbour is a close friens and I think they would say something to me

As someone mentioned, I think she does have medical issuses She has heavy periods and low iron which I know can kill sex drive. She will not go to a dr for it, even with our free Ontario Health care.

I want to thank you guys for all the responses. I did not think the tread would take this turn.

Rollo Tomassi

07-11-2011, 07:12 AM

^^^^
And the plane just spiralled in a flaming wreck to the ground.

Desdinova

07-11-2011, 08:32 AM

She is a stay at home mom with no cell phone and no email account.

It sounds as if your wife has some deep psychological issues. She could also have depression. Look at it from her point of view: She's got no outlet, she stays home with no contact with anyone but you and the kids, and she's away from her family.

I personally believe that when a relationship degrades to the point where yours is as, it's seldom worth repairing. It's like an old house that has been neglected to the point where it's beyond repair. Usually the best thing to do is tear it down and build a new one.

The both of you may be better off if you end the marriage. If you aim for shared custody, she won't have to be a stay-at-home mom full time and actually get to have a life, and you'll be able to go out and have sex again.

If you actually do decide to break things off, do NOT approach her with anger, frustration, or revenge. Approach her with understanding and compassion. If you break off the marriage peacefully (like I did), things will go a lot smoother, easier, and she'll be more open to being fair.

But if you break it off with anger and bitterness, she'll become competitive and focus on winning in the divorce.

logic1

07-11-2011, 08:59 AM

Reluctantly does it but tells me to go out and get a girlfriend. So I am going to. I am not going to announce it and will keep it low key.

Good idea to keep it under wraps. When your wife tells you to go out and find a FB its usually a big time trap. When she finds out you carried thru with her idea you will never hear the end of it. She will use it as ammunition to the bitter end.

Dont believe everything a woman says.

5string

07-11-2011, 09:25 AM

I'll tell you from experience. Get fvckin divorced before it's too late and more time flies by. I waited for 25 yrs before I unfvcked myself and got it done. This open relationship/FB stuff is just BS! Get divorced and do it now.

If you don't do this, the best years of your life will be lost and you won't be able to get them back.

Not later, NOW!

thissucks003

07-11-2011, 09:25 AM

sodbuster

07-11-2011, 02:19 PM

my cousin told me this after his divorce...."counseling only works if she's willing to listen and change". After my year of counseling and subsequent divorce, I can second his statement.

Divorce before other women....it's a TRAP,she's setting you up to be the bad guy in your families eyes.

Lexington

07-11-2011, 02:50 PM

It looks to me like your wife may have anemia. That would definitely kill anyone's drive for sex. You should try to get it checked out.

Warrior74

07-11-2011, 03:42 PM

^^^^
And the plane just spiralled in a flaming wreck to the ground.

I know right. Why do guys come here and tell only a fraction of the story and then get mad when the advice they get doesn't help/apply to the situation?

Heynow999

07-11-2011, 08:47 PM

I know right. Why do guys come here and tell only a fraction of the story and then get mad when the advice they get doesn't help/apply to the situation?

I'm not pissed off. I dont think I have ever really talked openly like this and I am very interested in the feedback.

My wife would not do counselling, I might try it.

Again, I am really surprised at the response I am getting. I actually dont think it is that bad of a situation. The sex is absolutely terrible, but other than that it is not bad. And again I have to stress that I feel that the best thing for my kids is for us to stay together.

It's funny that what I am proposing is very common in other parts of the world, for example France. I think that is one reason my wife has proposed it, because she is from Europe.

Zunder

07-11-2011, 10:30 PM

I'm not pissed off. I dont think I have ever really talked openly like this and I am very interested in the feedback.

My wife would not do counselling, I might try it.

Again, I am really surprised at the response I am getting. I actually dont think it is that bad of a situation. The sex is absolutely terrible, but other than that it is not bad. And again I have to stress that I feel that the best thing for my kids is for us to stay together.

It's funny that what I am proposing is very common in other parts of the world, for example France. I think that is one reason my wife has proposed it, because she is from Europe.

I assume you really are being honest when you say you think your situation is not that bad - I am just saying that personally I think your situation that you described with your wife is a Nightmare on Elm Street and then some - and there is no way I could have respect for myself if I put up with it - but each to their own and I thank you for sharing it and giving us some more background.

As for getting a bit on the side - there is plenty of info on this site on how to accomplish that.

Good luck to you.

Iceberg

07-12-2011, 09:33 AM

Maybe I am one of the few to suggest this!

Have you tried conselling?

If you are worried about your boys and being there for them until they are old enough, why would you want to set a bad example for them having a relationship outside of your marriage? Even though you may have been given permission by your wife, is this the kind of example you want your boys to learn? They will find out eventually!

I would totally start talking to a professional yourself first! Then find a way to get joint conselling with your wife!

There are ways for your wife to correct her heavy periods! Finding a competent doctor will help.

I'm not sure you can counsel a woman into being attracted to you. We're talking about emotions here. Not negotiating a used car price.

Again, I am really surprised at the response I am getting. I actually dont think it is that bad of a situation. The sex is absolutely terrible, but other than that it is not bad. And again I have to stress that I feel that the best thing for my kids is for us to stay together.

I couldn't imagine how it's the best thing for the kids to have their parents remain in a dry, sexless marriage. I mean, whatever helps you sleep at night. But the there's a huge chunk of logic missing in your assumption.

I'd think it would have a worse impact on the kid to believe that your type of marriage is normal and healthy.

Sure, your marriage isn't "that bad of a situation". You're not beating each other. You're not stealing each others' money. It's just that your marriage doesn't sound particularly good either. It's like having a job that is "not that bad"..., sure you can pay your bills, and have reasonable hours....but didn't you want more out of your life than "not that bad"?

Is that what you want written on your tombstone? "Here Lies Heynow999. His life wasn't that bad."

Jaylan

07-12-2011, 09:50 AM

My thought is: What is she up to herself for her to be encouraging you to get a gf?

sstype

07-12-2011, 10:52 AM

I think everyone here thats cheerleading for this guy to leave his wife over lack of nookie needs to get a dose of reality. There are children involved and its not just as simple as filling out a few forms and going about your merry way.

Divorce is always has a negative affect on families .Children whose parents have divorced are increasingly the victims of abuse and neglect. They exhibit more health, behavioral, and emotional problems, are involved more frequently in crime and drug abuse, and have higher suicide rates.

Children of divorced parents more frequently demonstrate a diminished learning capacity, performing more poorly than their peers from intact two-parent families in reading, spelling, and math. They have higher dropout rates and lower rates of college graduation.

Divorce generally reduces the income of the child's primary household and seriously diminishes the potential of every household member to accumulate wealth. For families that were not poor before the divorce, the drop in income can be as much as 50 percent.

The only time I would advocate a divorce for the OP is if him and his wifes relationship is high-conflict. If you two are yelling and screaming at eachother in front of the kids, abuse is invovled, you both are depressed and miserable, etc....then yes the family will be better off not together.

But what I am getting is that the OP and wife get along ok. She wants to remain married and raise the kids, yet is ok with quietly disengaging from a romantic relationship with her husband. I see nothing wrong with this arrangement. If you and her need to pursue extra marital affairs to meet your sexual needs, by all means do so while keeping utmost discretion. Don't take this personally, your marriage is first and foremost a business partnership. You're in the business of raising your children in a stable two-parent household.

If divorce made everyone better off then why are children growing up with more behavioral and psychologial problems than before when spouses stuck it out?

Don't listen to these clueless posters OP....do what's best for your family, not just yourself.

Iceberg

07-12-2011, 11:07 AM

I think everyone here thats cheerleading for this guy to leave his wife over lack of nookie needs to get a dose of reality. There are children involved and its not just as simple as filling out a few forms and going about your merry way.

Divorce is always has a negative affect on families .Children whose parents have divorced are increasingly the victims of abuse and neglect. They exhibit more health, behavioral, and emotional problems, are involved more frequently in crime and drug abuse, and have higher suicide rates.

Don't listen to these clueless posters OP....do what's best for your family, not just yourself.

Right. Staying in his passionless marriage really sets a great example for the kids.

sstype

07-12-2011, 11:27 AM

Right. Staying in his passionless marriage really sets a great example for the kids.

Wow...seriously??? Did you rip that out of a romance novel? That's some pretty feminine sounding sh*t right there. For all this talk about how supposedly more "rational" and "logical" we men think.....I would say his wife has more balls than some of the posters here.

You're right....let him breakup his family because the "passion" was lacking.

"It's okay little Tommy, I love your mommy but she was a frigid prude and we just weren't having that passionate sex I need to be happy. You will only get to see me every other weekend from now on but I'm sure you'll understand! Oh and meet my new girlfriend Candi!" :rolleyes:

5string

07-12-2011, 11:34 AM

Wow...seriously??? Did you rip that out of a romance novel? That's some pretty feminine sounding sh*t right there. For all this talk about how supposedly more "rational" and "logical" we men think.....I would say his wife has more balls than some of the posters here.

You're right....let him breakup his family because the "passion" was lacking.

"It's okay little Tommy, I love your mommy but she was a frigid prude and we just weren't having that passionate sex I need to be happy. You will only get to see me every other weekend from now on but I'm sure you'll understand! Oh and meet my new girlfriend Candi!" :rolleyes:"It's ok little Tommy, you know mommy and I no longer love one another and we are both miserable. I know you can sense this. Meet Candi little Tommy. Mommy said to go get a girfriend because mommy knows she can no longer meet my emotional and physical needs in our marriage".

sstype

07-12-2011, 11:47 AM

"It's ok little Tommy, you know mommy and I no longer love one another and we are both miserable. I know you can sense this. Meet Candi little Tommy. Mommy said to go get a girfriend because mommy knows she can no longer meet my emotional and physical needs in our marriage".

According to you guys, a successful marriage should be based on a rock-solid foundation consisting of passion, lust, ego, and feelings. As long as you're getting your d*ck wet every night then other considerations such as her parenting skills, familial upbringing, and personal habits are just minor bonuses. I guess we should all be ok with our 50% divorce rate. Heck, everyone should get divorced as soon as their spouses stop having sex, become old and unattractive, because we all know that marriages lacking hot steamy romance and sex are the leading cause of behavioral and pyschological problems in young children today. (sarcasm)

I'm sure youre also perfectly ok with your wives divorcing you to be with someone "more passionate" taking half your assets, child support, and alimony in the process. Hopefully you'll be as understanding when the tables are turned.

Iceberg

07-12-2011, 11:54 AM

According to you guys, a successful marriage should be based on a rock-solid foundation consisting of passion, lust, ego, and feelings. I guess as long as you're getting your d*ck wet every night then other considerations such as her parenting skills, familial upbringing, and personal habits don't really matter much.

No. A successful marriage should be based on two people who are attracted to each other and intensely love one another. Obviously, you're not going to be having crazy passionate sex all the time, but there should at least be a foundation of attraction.

If you don't have that, then it's merely a business arrangement.

Whatever.....you guys reap what you sow. I guess youre also perfectly ok with your wives divorcing you to be with someone "more passionate" taking half your assets, child support, and alimony in the process. Hopefully you'll be as understanding when the tables are turned.

If my hypothetical wife determined that I was no longer physically attracted to her, and that the loving, passionate side of our relationship had completely died, then yes, she should divorce me.

What is the point of being married to someone who you are not attracted to? Parenting skills and personal habits? You can't build a life-long relationship with a person based on that. We're talking about husbands and wives here, not hired servants.

"Me and Mary can't stand to touch each other, but she makes a good apple pie, and she knows how to change a diaper, so we're just gonna stick together."

Rubirosa

07-12-2011, 12:02 PM

Get divorced........This is all B.S.
Instead of telling you why you should get divorced (which other guys convincingly already did), consider your options;
First good luck finding a quality woman who will put up with you being married while you are seeing her. Even if a woman is a slut, she doesn't want to be thought of as a slut. Being the woman on the side makes a woman feel like a slut.
You do realize that you will only be able to bang her at her place, not at your house. This will take you away from your children even more.
If the other woman becomes emotionally involved with you, her actions could turn into "fatal attraction mode" ...which could result in your children being exposed to some bad scenes.
Get divorced. Marriage is marriage---not this creative compromising you are proposing. Be rational...if you had a condition that affected your sexual health, would you still tell your wife, YOUR WIFE, to go and find a boyfriend ?
Start a new life. Give your kids 110 % when you are with them, and do the right thing.

sstype

07-12-2011, 12:06 PM

No. A successful marriage should be based on two people who are attracted to each other and intensely love one another. Obviously, you're not going to be having crazy passionate sex all the time, but there should at least be a foundation of attraction.

If you don't have that, then it's merely a business arrangement.

That is precisely what marriage is.....a business arrangement..nothing more. All of that lovey dovey, attraction can all be had without signing a legal document. And if you think you're going to feel the same level of attraction to your wife after 30 years of aging, monotonous lovemaking, and the stress of raising a family, then all i can say is you've been watching way too many disney movies

If my hypothetical wife determined that I was no longer physically attracted to her, and that the loving, passionate side of our relationship had completely died, then yes, she should divorce me.

By the same token you will also be perfectly fine handing over half your assets and a chunk of your future income to pay for your wife's "loss of passion" Makes sense when you don't think about it.

What is the point of being married to someone who you are not attracted to? Parenting skills and personal habits? You can't build a life-long relationship with a person based on that. We're talking about husbands and wives here, not hired servants.

"Me and Mary can't stand to touch each other, but she makes a good apple pie, and she knows how to change a diaper, so we're just gonna stick together."

Well I'm glad you have the luxury of hiring servants to take care of your kids while you and your wife run in a field of roses, but rest of us lowly plebes do have to take on child-rearing duties as part of the marriage contract. If you think marriage is nothing more than an unlimited supply of sex and romance then please do us all a favor and don't reproduce.

Mantis Toboggan

07-12-2011, 12:29 PM

That is precisely what marriage is.....a business arrangement..nothing more. All of that lovey dovey, attraction can all be had without signing a legal document. And if you think you're going to feel the same level of attraction to your wife after 30 years of aging, monotonous lovemaking, and the stress of raising a family, then all i can say is you've been watching way too many disney movies

Funny. If you think marriage sucks so much, it's odd that you're advising this guy to stay in his. Maintain this sucky lifestyle for the sake of the kids. Nothing will inspire kids to greatness like seeing their father worn down into a nub of a man.

sstype

07-12-2011, 12:52 PM

Funny. If you think marriage sucks so much, it's odd that you're advising this guy to stay in his. Maintain this sucky lifestyle for the sake of the kids. Nothing will inspire kids to greatness like seeing their father worn down into a nub of a man.

What a bunch of ridiculous retorts so far.

I haven't heard anyone from the "divorce the b*tch" bandwagon address the widely reported negative effects divorce has on kids nor has anyone given me a good explanation why marriage is not a state sanctioned legally-enforced business contract and how that has ANYTHING to do with love and attraction.

So far all i've heard is "but they're not in looooooooove!!!!" I can't believe i'm hearing this sort of whiny responses from a men's forum.

We are done debating here.

Desdinova

07-12-2011, 12:56 PM

sstype

07-12-2011, 01:02 PM

sstype: What are you basing all this 5hit on? Have you ever been married? Have you ever been divorced? Do you have kids?

My child is thriving much better now because the child custody arrangement forces the bytch to spend time with him. She used to walk out the damn door to go fvck her boyfriend, and our child would run to the door, screaming and crying for mommy to stay home.

His development stalled because I'm the only one who does 5hit with him. Before the separation, I was with him 99% of the time and his development was excellent. Now that I get him 50% of the time, his development is much slower because nobody but me teaches him anything. Who's fault is that? Is it fault of the marriage breakup? NO. It's the fault of the parent who won't take the responsibility of their duty to raise the child.

Every situation is different, so you can't just lump every kid with divorced parents together. It has nothing to do with the actual breakup, it has to do with parents who don't give a damn about their responsibility to raise their children and their dedication to their families.

The only time I would advocate a divorce for the OP is if him and his wifes relationship is high-conflict. If you two are yelling and screaming at eachother in front of the kids, abuse is invovled, you both are depressed and miserable, etc....then yes the family will be better off not together

Wow....I said the same exact thing except everyone decided to jump on my throat because I suggested in THIS situation divorce may not be the best option.

Child neglect/abuse is grounds for divorce.

"I'm not getting laid" is not grounds for divorce. Get that through your thick skulls.

loveshogun

07-12-2011, 01:20 PM

If you don't have that, then it's merely a business arrangement.

Let's not discount the importance of the business aspects of relationships. Without good decisions on the ground, passion burns out.

I personally think the degradation of the OP's relationship is a consequence not just of passion burning out, but a lack of attention to the business of being in a relationship.

I like to think of a relationship as a fire. You need the spark first, of course, but you need fuel for the fire as well. Without controlling the flame, and adding fuel over time, the flame will burn out.

That's what game is all about, isn't it? About feeding passion through making rational choices. Taking two sides of the same coin, that at first seem opposites, and making them work in harmony.

OP, I'm not gonna tell you what to do, because you need to make your own decision at this point.

What I will say is you need to be very clear, unlike when you first decided to marry this woman, that your actions will have consequences, not only on yourself, but on others as well. And not all the consequences will be completely good, or completely bad. You will have to decide what is important to you, and pay the price.

I highly doubt when you made the plunge, that you were making it rationally. Not saying that passion isn't important - just that your rationality will be just as, if not more important.

And the only guide you have in an emotionally tumultuous period such as this is your ability to stay rational.

Are you sticking with it for your kids, or because of what others might think of you?

Is your wife really the root of the problem, or are there aspects of your own personality that could improve?

How much of these problems are real problems outside of you, versus problems that are only you?

I've dealt a lot with Eastern Europeans - particularly Ukrainians - and so I can see some echoes of cultural truth in your assessment of your situation. But, that's not a cop out for you to chalk it up to things that are out of your control. YOU are in control of your own actions until you choose to give it up.

Make your choices, and own them. Good, bad, or sideways.

Best wishes, and hope that you can find the best way. Don't lose heart if you find that the best possible outcome is not all sunshine and roses. Persevere.

okyoureabeast

07-12-2011, 01:38 PM

Your marriage is on the way out.

Don't do that to your boys. If anything, you will deeply mess them up when they don't see mommy and daddy actively loving each other.

If you want to save it, try doing something random and spontaneous. Something to surprise her, be a man, take charge, etc etc.

Sometimes little flares like that can help reinvigorate your life. It sounds like you forgot why you fell for the woman in the first place.

5string

07-12-2011, 01:53 PM

Wow....I said the same exact thing except everyone decided to jump on my throat because I suggested in THIS situation divorce may not be the best option.

Child neglect/abuse is grounds for divorce.

"I'm not getting laid" is not grounds for divorce. Get that through your thick skulls.In addition to no intimacy, the op also said that their relationship had become like "brother and sister". And get this, would you want to remain married to a woman who cares so little about you and the relationship that she tells you to go find a GF you can fvck?

Not me. :nono:

Mantis Toboggan

07-12-2011, 01:58 PM

In addition to no intimacy, the op also said that their relationship had become like "brother and sister". And get this, would you want to remain married to a woman who cares so little about you and the relationship that she tells you to go find a GF you can fvck?

Not me. :nono:

Hey! Banging that GF on the side is good for children.

KarmaSutra

07-12-2011, 02:12 PM

I think everyone here thats cheerleading for this guy to leave his wife over lack of nookie needs to get a dose of reality. There are children involved and its not just as simple as filling out a few forms and going about your merry way.

Yes it is. Misery adores company. I can attest the best thing I ever did was divorce my ex-wife. We had a passionless "arrangement" marriage. Rather than rely on fate or circumstance or for her to "come around", I chose to get out and live my life on my terms.

I have a 16 year old daughter who is far better off that we split. That's truth inexperienced, armchair theorists could never understand.

Divorce is always has a negative affect on families .Children whose parents have divorced are increasingly the victims of abuse and neglect. They exhibit more health, behavioral, and emotional problems, are involved more frequently in crime and drug abuse, and have higher suicide rates.

You statistical types are more hurtful than a hollow-point bullet. You look at numbers and justify every act as a detriment of character.

Children of divorced parents more frequently demonstrate a diminished learning capacity, performing more poorly than their peers from intact two-parent families in reading, spelling, and math. They have higher dropout rates and lower rates of college graduation.

Again, you're reaching. My daughter has never gotten below a 3.7 GPA. Pre or post divorce. Why? Because she was a priority of responsibility. Neither of us allowed our differences to interrupt her life.

Divorce generally reduces the income of the child's primary household and seriously diminishes the potential of every household member to accumulate wealth. For families that were not poor before the divorce, the drop in income can be as much as 50 percent.

All I hear is Charlie Browns' fvcking Teacher, "Wha wha wha. Wha wha wha wha wha wha."

The only time I would advocate a divorce for the OP is if him and his wifes relationship is high-conflict. If you two are yelling and screaming at eachother in front of the kids, abuse is invovled, you both are depressed and miserable, etc....then yes the family will be better off not together.

Having a girlfriend on the side while your wife slowly slips into depression will make a woman smother her daughter, leave her in the trunk of her car for a week to rot a stink, then go partying at Blockbuster.

But what I am getting is that the OP and wife get along ok. She wants to remain married and raise the kids, yet is ok with quietly disengaging from a romantic relationship with her husband. I see nothing wrong with this arrangement. If you and her need to pursue extra marital affairs to meet your sexual needs, by all means do so while keeping utmost discretion. Don't take this personally, your marriage is first and foremost a business partnership. You're in the business of raising your children in a stable two-parent household.

Fvcking ridiculous. Utterly ridiculous statements here. This alone proves you have no appreciation for the Husband/Wife dynamic. The foundation is one of friendship, trust, and love. Not cash.

If divorce made everyone better off then why are children growing up with more behavioral and psychologial problems than before when spouses stuck it out?

What fvcks kids up are non-existent parents who are each doing their own thing with other people. Weak Fathers who care more for a slice of hairpie than the guidance and fruition of a proper rite-of-passage.

Don't listen to these clueless posters OP....do what's best for your family, not just yourself.

I would say you're getting dumped on because what you're saying came out of the toilet.

sstype

07-12-2011, 02:13 PM

I'm done debating this.....marriage is nothing more than a sham these days. Why the hell do people even bother going through the hassle of getting married when the minute something goes wrong "hey just divorce!"

Whatever happened to "for better or for worse?"

KarmaSutra

07-12-2011, 02:16 PM

Whatever happened to "for better or for worse?"

What should a man do if his marriage will only ever get worse?

Eat a bullet? Take his family out then eat the bullet? Is that better?

sstype

07-12-2011, 02:19 PM

What should a man do if his marriage will only ever get worse?

Eat a bullet? Take his family out then eat the bullet? Is that better?

So are you saying the institution of marriage is a sham? Why not just abolish it and do serial LTRs then?

loveshogun

07-12-2011, 02:20 PM

Whatever happened to "for better or for worse?"

People who don't know what a contract is, or what responsibility is.

In my opinion, most people should not ever get married, period. Myself included.

However, that opinion doesn't help people like the OP.

I do agree with sstype that marriage IS a business arrangement just as much as it is (if not more) than a romantic thing.

My philosophy:

If you REALLY love a girl, marry her because it makes business sense. Otherwise, keep her in GF territory. Nothin' wrong with that.

Marriages that end in bitter divorce end that way not because of lack of passion, but because the business aspects were all f*cked.

Because after all, if the partnership lacks passion, wouldn't both parties be relatively indifferent about leaving each other?

Divorce court isn't about who doesn't love whom anymore - it's about who gets the money, the house, and the kids.

Groovy

07-12-2011, 02:27 PM

Whatever happened to "for better or for worse?"
I only read the Op's posts and this post too.

It's true! You married her, because you saw something good in her. She also likes you. That's perfect. You guys have sex problems it seems. Maybe she isn't healthy and thus lacks libido, or you suck in bed... Both of these can be fixed you know. Is she attractive? I understand that you want to dump her if she isn't. But you married her anyways, what the heck? Maybe she just lost her shape and that is no biggie since she can still improve (depending on age and so). Since she may have bad health\psychological problems, which probably can be fixed, you should assist her in that since you are her husband. Don't give up...