I’m at a point where I’ve dated a handful of women, asked out a number of women, and feel like I have a good grasp of the game. I also feel that my knowledge of the game is holding back from committing to someone, even a quality woman.

I’ve dated a few women that most men would consider in the 6-7-8 range (some would think higher, but none of these women were model/stripper/playmate/club types that seem to get the 10 rating)…and I noticed while there’s a lot less b.s. to deal with (for instance, the 6-7-8, while she is aware she isn’t ugly and that she can attract men, she is often modest about it, and her world isn’t based on her beauty or power and attention that comes from beauty) there is still b.s. to deal with (interest fluctuating...women like to argue about minute differences in opinions…and I’m not the type of guy to back down from an opinion just to avoid confrontation…yada, yada, yada.) You have to be “aware” at all times, at least until you two have reached that point where you’ve best friends and lovers, which doesn’t always happen obviously.

I suppose I’m also afraid of letting my guard down, falling for a girl, and her not returning the favor. When a girl is interested just as much as you or more, that’s great, but it doesn’t always work that way. Some women are good at maintaining their frame, or aren’t overly showy about their feelings. What I’m also afraid of is things ending out of nowhere (Which can and will happen) and then me being obsessed with some girl that it’s all done with. With my first girlfriend, I was close to overdosing on medicine (I sought help for it, my therapist seems to think, especially based on how I’ve progressed, that it was just dealing with that kind of loss for the first time.) Now I understand that just because you had something with a woman, once she changes her mind, it’s like you two never knew each other and she doesn’t give two sh*ts about you. But at the same time, I feel like that cynical viewpoint, along with the paranoia that I’ll spiral into a depression, is holding me back from what I really want.

I’m not a one night stand guy. I don’t even see many women that I’d really, really like to get in bed with, even in some magical porn world where women slept with guys for no reason. At the same time, I fear “going all in.”

I’m wondering how to approach a relationship of any kind with restrained enthusiasm, cautious optimism if you will. I feel in the past I’ve went all in (part of that was being a AFC and putting value on “having a girlfriend”) then lost objectivity and not taken things one day at a time. I’m also wondering, if it does end, and there is the start of a bad argument, how to avoid it from becoming worse and just end things on a pleasant note?

The good news if anything is that the past few dates I’ve been on (haven’t been on one in months though) nothing came from it and I didn’t care and just looked at it as another practice date, so I have the right attitude in that department.

Pardon, but what is your question?

How do you date a girl with possible long term implications while still maintaining your frame?

confusedstate said:

How do you date a girl with possible long term implications while still maintaining your frame?

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You realize that making YOU happy is just as important as making HER happy.

It's easy to get into that mentality with a new person that you're trying to IMPRESS her, make HER happy...but many guys get SO into it that they're willing to sacrifice their OWN self-respect to meet that goal.

It's kind of like when you walk into a high-pressure sales situation with an idea what you want and what you are willing to spend, and then between the sales-pitch and your actual desire for the item you're going to purchase, you suddenly become willing to bend all of those guidelines, rather than walk away without what you came for...it's seen as more of a FAILURE to not get what you want than to GIVE UP more value than you had intended for it.

Don't fall for it! You were fine before that skirt came along, you'll be just fine afterward too. It's easy when you walk into HER world, the dating world, (and let's be honest, "dating" is the girl's world...if a guy could f**k a girl whenever he wanted he'd never go on "dates") you start getting the impression that SHE has more value than YOU here.

Which is nonsense, of course...she knows that, she's trying JUST as hard to impress YOU.

The difference is that women in postmodern Western society are taught to "respect themselves" above all else and high-value women are ready to walk WHENEVER, for WHATEVER reason.

Men aren't taught self-respect any more. Being a man is more of a "joke", personified by stuff like "Spike TV".

So you have to approach dating with the mentality that, although it's not likely, if she were to start "trippin'" and decide to up-out on you one day, you would have to be perfectly okay with that...it was fun while it lasted.

Another reason that dating couples who are NOT married and NOT looking to start a family should NOT be living together.

Respect yourself first...and expect that respect from other people when you give them the same respect.

Well I like the company too if I'm into the girl and think she's cool...but I see what you're saying.

The other thing is, I'm just looking for a supplement to my life, not the answer to my life....just someone I can hang out with/sleep with once or twice a week and she has her life and I have mine.

confusedstate said:

Well I like the company too if I'm into the girl and think she's cool...but I see what you're saying.

The other thing is, I'm just looking for a supplement to my life, not the answer to my life....just someone I can hang out with/sleep with once or twice a week and she has her life and I have mine.

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That's the mentality *I* have toward it as well. I'm dating girls more for "something to do" than anything else.

So far they've been mediocre company at best. They're not much to talk to. I understand it's how women are raised in today's world...maybe how they always have been.

It's more just the companionship/cuddling/making out/f**king at this point.

Got a date with a girl tonight who seems to have "personality"...not even the same kind of "personality" I have, but I figure maybe I can learn something from her.

confusedstate said:

How do you date a girl with possible long term implications while still maintaining your frame?

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Always be aware. Most men tend to get sloppy, "let their guards down," and go back to their incorrigible AFC behaviors once they feel the fake security of "hey, it's in the bag!" with the girl.

Always be a DJ. Even in your LTRs and marriage.

Always.

confusedstate said:

How do you date a girl with possible long term implications while still maintaining your frame?

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You shouldn't be thinking about it. You should always maintain your frame regardless you are dating a girl or not.

Men are too naive to think that their girl is special, that their potential-LTR girl is better than the crazy girls he finds at clubs. They are all the same! You heard them b!tches "I am not like those girls", but given the right opportunity, they'd still do it anyway.

Just like how all men think alike when it comes to women, all women act alike when it comes to men. Any women will run at the presence of a wuss, even the good ones. I've had two LTRs, and I have seen them react completely different when I lost my mind. They ran the **** away when I became too clingy and *****y and impossible.

Treat them all the same, from young to old, from girls you met in clubs to girls you see in your church groups.

confusedstate said:

How do you date a girl with possible long term implications while still maintaining your frame?

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Know who you are
Know what you want and don't want
And always have time for your own life. Don't do what a million other guys do and lose yourself in a girl. Having no life beyond the relationship is a recipe for disaster.
Maintaining frame until it becomes natural is the idea. A relationship often makes that a lot more difficult- and hence often results in a slip back into old afc habits. Constant progression in all areas of your life is the plan. Have a strong sense of self and what you want to achieve.

Oh and enjoy. It's very easy to get into an us (men) vs them (women) mentality. If you start worrying about all the little things you end up being the bit ch in the relationship. So love and be happy. And if she ain't along for the ride then there’s a million more to choose from.

I seem to want to be part of a power couple…kind of Brady and Gisele. I want to be one of those classy looking couples, the guy in a nice sports coat or sweater and collared shirt with a tie, the girl with a nice outfit…maybe a dress or a blouse with a skirt…and women look at me and guys look at her.

My friend came to the conclusion that as introverted as I am at times, I like to be noticed for the right reasons, and just get off on the attention, and need another AW…not in the slutty club sense, but a girl that wants to be a part of the fashion show.

I also seem to want a girl who’s very comfortable naked, during or not during sex. One of my favorite parts of sex is when the girl gets out of bed after and you see her ass moving from left to right as she walks away. Could it be an attention ***** that I seek, not in the club/skanky/tease sense, but in the Hollywood sense?