Which do you guys recommend or prefer??

I tried the T-rows today in place of my normal BB rows. They felt okay, but it seems more of an isolation movement, as opposed to the compound benefits of the bb rows.

Any comments?

barbell rows are the BEST back workout IMO. But you have to remember in order to grow you always have to change things up.(# of sets/reps/time between sets, etc) Another really important thing you have to do is also change things up in terms of the actual excercise.

Different excercise hit the back differently. So switch it up with pull-ups, t-bar rows, the one arm rows, back pushups, etc. The more you change up with the dif types i just told you, the more efficient your workouts will be(and you will actually get bigger). Good luck with it!

Kerp I am doing ripptoe's routine... so I am getting my deads in, and I definately feel it in my upper back as I progress in weight. I just didn't know if it would be good to deviate from his workout at all, and switch up the rows.

wow your right. I totally forgot about deadlifts. They are def the best. I wasn't thinking properly. Some say the best workout period.

Rippetoe's routine doesn't have rows in it as he views them as an accessory exercise for intermediates, and even then he doesn't have people do them the way people do them usually as he promotes the use of hip drive for them and starting from the ground.

http://ripquoteoftheday.blogspot.com/2009/03/quote-of-day-24th-march-2009.html said:

My opinion about barbell rows is as follows: **** barbell rows. Really. **** them.

Stop wasting time worrying about barbell rows and get your deadlift up to 500.

By then you'll have your own opinion and you won't have to worry about mine.

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mrRuckus said:

Rippetoe's routine doesn't have rows in it as he views them as an accessory exercise for intermediates, and even then he doesn't have people do them the way people do them usually as he promotes the use of hip drive for them and starting from the ground.

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I'm using "Option A" from where to start thread... It may may modified a bit from the original Starting Strength routine. Ruckus, should I eliminate them and focus on wide grip pulls instead??

OPTION A:

Workout B
3x5 Squat
3x5 Standing military press
3x5 Pendlay or Bent Rows (or power cleans)
**2x8 Chin-ups (recommended mainly if doing the cleans)

I didn't realize cleans were the preferred exercise, I was just going by what the routine said.

I guess I'll need to start doing cleans then.

I like deadlifts, one arm dumbbell rows, t-bar row and pull ups. I perform all of them because each exercise is good. Personally the t-bar row exercises can be very intense and work the back very well.

The reason Rippetoe "hates" rows so much is that everyone thinks rows are a replacement for cleans when they're really not. People repost his routine with rows substituted for cleans all the time. The reason he uses power cleans instead of rows is because cleans will cause your deadlift to increase faster since you'll be training power/speed off the floor instead of just absolute strength.

I personally don't do power cleans even though I tried to because i've had an issue with my right biceps near my elbow for years. Cleans really makes it ache. Maybe it's a form issue of bending my elbow too soon, but the issue was around before i even tried them, but very few things aggravates it and cleans and throwing a baseball too many times are two of them.

If you can, learn to do power cleans and add some chins.

Actually, i do power clean my sets of the press often.


I don't really see a big deal in rotating out any of the different type of rows movements. Do whatever row you want until it stalls and then change to another one. I did bb rows, then chest supported rows for 2 months, and am now doing db rows. But really, if you're gonna row stick with bb rows. It shouldn't really get stuck early in your career. I 'pendlay' row over 200 for 5x5 and i never did other rows until recently.

Go out of your way to get chins up too. They'll probably help more than rows will. I wish i'd paid more attention to them a few years ago.

somewhere there's a posting around here or another major forum with Rippetoe's workout with an upfront demand, which I will paraphrase very loosely.

DON'T **** WITH THIS ROUTINE! Every jackass thinks he's smarter than Rippetoe. You're not. Do his thing until you've made it through the program, and then consider switching to an "intermediate program."

...or prove that you think you know better than him, and make the substitution. the choice, of course, is yours. as mr. ruckus points out, LOTS of people think they're smarter than mr. rippetoe.

too true.

cleans/powercleans are harder to learn/do than rows in general.. I havnt been to bb.com but it sounds like it's for bodybuilders.

back to the op. crossfit.com has good videos which shows you how to learn cleans.

Flyer said:

cleans/powercleans are harder to learn/do than rows in general..

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Wouldn't want to travel out of your comfort zone or anything difficult like that.

Flyer said:

cleans/powercleans are harder to learn/do than rows in general.. I havnt been to bb.com but it sounds like it's for bodybuilders.

back to the op. crossfit.com has good videos which shows you how to learn cleans.

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the opposite of these statements is true...